Knock knock. "This is the police. May we search your home?"

[Amazon 7]

I am of the opinion.. Cop shows up at my place.. asks to search????

I will gracefully decline.. and then dial my VERY GOOD Lawyer.. and hand the phone to the police officer.

I dont do anything that would warrant a search of my home so my priovacy will NOT be invaded by some toon local cop.... and my next door neighbor... is a local detective.. and we are on VERY good terms.. in fact he is my bestest neighbor...I dont mind too much when his horse gets into my yard from time to time.. We DOOO need a better fence though.

[masterrig 1]

Quote

Quote

A person does not have to submit to a voluntary search

you see, the above is a complete oxymoron "have to submit" to a "voluntary" search

that statement above is why I think the poll was written confusing - on purpose

I wasn't busting on you (sorry), just using you to prove the point - I think the poll results can't be used for anything as likely 20 people answered 20 different questions in their own heads...



What I do like is that most of the reasonable here have noted the real issue is that people should know their rights and say 'no' to these types of requests. That would be more productive than taking away options from law enforcement personnel.

Even if I had nothing to hide, I'd still say no nearly all the time. But I DON'T CARE IF HE ASKS AND THINK THERE IS LIKELY GOOD REASON FOR HIM TO ASK IN CERTAIN SCENARIO.

The reason I'd say no most of the time is that I live in the socialist state of Minnesota, and if I let a cop in to confirm there isn't a meth lab in my basement, he might end up arresting me for not "disposing of D cell batteries in an environmentally friendly fashion" or "not providing a clean change of water in my cat's drinking bowl" or "not having a state sanctioned prayer room labeled per state code in the house" or something left wing like that.

_______________________________

I don't feel, you were 'busting' me at all. I did, have the feeling I may have missed something along the way. As far as using me... use me... abuse me... Seriously, you make a good point. The whole thing, has been vague and as you said, and very important, that people know their rights. Not the rights they learn in a beer joint or from someone who 'has been through it'. I have a bit of an edge... I'm married to a cop. She knows her 'stuff' and if, something comes-up she's uncertain of, she'll get the straight of it.
People need to educate themselves. The attitude that, 'it won't happen to them', is scarey, anymore.
Good post.


Chuck

[JohnRich 4]

Quote

Quote

I sold that gun as soon as I got back home, so that it would no longer be traceable to me, if those Barney Fife's ever decide to try and hang some crime on me in the future.

John. In my opinion your name was already tagged to the ballastics tests. So selling doesn't do any good for past crimes if any.

If they had matched me to any past crimes, they would have arrested me when I came to pick up the gun.

Selling the gun only helps for future cases where those bullets might "match", and that's why I stated "in the future".

In any crime since the date I sold the gun, I have the sales receipt from the gun store proving that I no longer owned the gun after that date, and therefore any crime to which it "matches" was not committed by me.

I hate having to play this game. I liked that gun. But there are too many crooked or incompetent crime lab people out there.

[JohnRich 4]

Quote

It's a damned good thing the cops did not "make sure" John was guilty. I think you know what I mean.

I feared that, and was watching closely for it. After searching the car, and looking frustrated, and then running the drug dog through the car and finding nothing (except xmas cookies), they looked REALLY frustrated. They even had a sock or something with pot in it, and threw it up against a building to test and see if the dog was behaving properly. The mutt strolled over to the sock, and immediately sat down at attention, giving the correct "Hey, I found drugs!" signal.

That's when I half-expected them to pull out some throw-down drugs to avoid further embarassment, and accuse me of possessing it. Fortunately, they didn't do that. The possibility made me very uncomfortable, to say the least.

Here's another sign of how goofy this traffic stop was: I was driving home from Florida to Texas after xmas. A new governor of Alabama was going to be inaugurated in early January, and someone had phoned in a death threat against the new governor. The cop found my rifle and gear in the trunk, and accused me of being a hit-man out to assassinate the governor. After all, everyone from Texas with a rifle is a hit-man, you know. Actually, I had just taken my son out shooting with me while visiting.

The guy was a real Barney Fife. Beware of I-10 across Alabama...

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

The guy was a real Barney Fife....

The Barney Fife character - though a bit powerless and bumbling:

1 - cared about the citizens
2 - tried very hard
3 - occasionally made mistakes but owned up to them
4 - had good morals
5 - got to know everybody on a personal level
6 - never resorted to physical force
7 - was very honest

I think when people mock the police and call them "Mayberry", they are ignoring the fact that the character of that sheriff especially was an excellent role model of what we wish a lawman could be - personal, fair, calm, moral, present in the community, caring.

I think they are taking the stereotype of the Dukes of Hazzard police (crooked, set speed traps, stupid, corrupt) and calling them by the wrong TV show........

maybe turning of the TV and also ignoring Hollywood would help with reality

just a thought

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[slug 1]

Quote

I am of the opinion.. Cop shows up at my place.. asks to search????

I will gracefully decline.. and then dial my VERY GOOD Lawyer.. and hand the phone to the police officer.

Hi A

IMO lose -win unless your lawyer works for free

OTOH decline and log on DZ.com speakers corner and talk to your staff of mute Lawyers on line. then ask the officer to read what your mute lawyers have to say.

Cop ventures into SC.

Win win drive cop never to return again.. Cost maybe green bottles, fun MAX
R.I.P.

BTW if the cops insisted on entering my home in response to the 911 call. i would not waste my time or money on a attorney at 11pm.

I'm required to let you in? OK do you mind if i lock my 3 dogs in the garage first, they weigh over 100# ea, their gonna want to jump on you and lick your face and we don't want to get your uniform dirty. Their labs not pits just Big! and friendly and bark a lot. The hounds are looking down at him from the LR window. Bark Bark bark

Herding the hounds into the garage takes time, a lot of time.

Cops hangs around and still wants to come in. Fine he earned it. Bark bark bark.
Win win

R.I.P.

• Quote

[warpedskydiver 0]

The guy was a real Barney Fife. Beware of I-10 across AlabamaAnywhere...

[BIGUN 1,049]

Ya know, I was watching Cops the other night and I must have busted out laughing about three times. Three different times on this show, the cop told the person they were free to go. Then would "ask" them, "Do you have anything illegal in the car?" No, sir. "Would it be alright if I searched it?" Yes, Sir. BAMMMMMMM There'd be something illegal in the car and off they'd go. I was thinking - are they really that ignorant about their rights or just stupid to think the cops don't know every hiding place on a vehicle?

I was once asked by a cop if he could search my vehicle. I told him, "No." He said, "You know I really don't need your permission to search it." I told him, "If you believe that you have the legal right to search this vehicle then you go ahead, but you do NOT have my permission." He said, "What are you afraid of?"

"I'm afraid you don't have a warrant."

I didn't feel as though I'd made a new friend that day.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[JohnRich 4]

Quote

I was once asked by a cop if he could search my vehicle. I told him, "No." He said, "You know I really don't need your permission to search it." I told him, "If you believe that you have the legal right to search this vehicle then you go ahead, but you do NOT have my permission." He said, "What are you afraid of?" "I'm afraid you don't have a warrant." I didn't feel as though I'd made a new friend that day.

Good one!

I once refused to answer any questions for a chickenshit traffic stop for rolling through a stop sign in a residential neighborhood. They have these little boxes on their form they have to fill out, like: "Where are you employed?" I simply said that he had my driver's license for identification, and that I wasn't going to answer any further personal questions. Whooeeee, they don't like that. But there's nothing they can do about it.

Oh, and they almost always ask: "Is this your current address?" They're not doing that out of friendly curiousity. What they want to find out is if you've moved more than 3 months ago, and that would then be another ticket they can write because you failed to notify the Division of Motor Vehicles of your change of address.

If a question sounds fishy, or there doesn't seem to be any reason for them to be asking it - just politely decline to answer. There's a hidden reason for them asking, and it can only do you harm to answer.

[Lindsey 0]

Yeah. Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you.

A year or so ago I was stopped for going 70 in a 55 zone, and the officer asked me for my license and my proof of insurance. I had my license, but couldn't find a recent insurance card--but I assured him that it hadn't changed since this older one that I handed him. He asked me where I was employed, so I told him. He asked me if my address was correct on my driver's license. I told him that it was not (I had moved more than a year before then). He explained to me why it would be good to change my address on my license, and then he gave me three warnings. (I had a brake light out too).

Before he stopped me again I had put my proof of insurance in my glove box. But I still didn't have my address changed. That time I only got one warning--for speeding again .

:)
linz

--
A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[slug 1]

Response to every one.

We all know the police profile certain groups, stop them for varius reasons and then the fun begins.

We used to drive some real beaters: Nice neighborhood four way stop cop is there first. We stop at other sign and wait for cop to proceed, and wait and wait.

Cop waves us thru turns on lights so we pull over. Sir you have a tail light out. Say what Walk to back of car sure enough tail light is out again. Pop trunk wiggle wire. Problem solved

Liscense please got that
We retun to our car without liscense cop returns to his car with liscense and talks into Radio. When the cop returns to our car he's carrying a metal 4-6 battary flashlight. and shines it into my back seat empty, no TV's stero's etc front seat . Your free to go next time get the light fixed or you get a tickee

I'm not a lawyer.

OTOH a black dude Leave same party a hr later nice guy, dress's nice, drives Ok car. steady work history. Barney is stopped at same intersection same deal.

Pulls the ethnic minority over same routine except the minority declines aka give the cop a attiude. Your profiling me Night in jail.

The constitution we all know and love has some grey area's. and though we're all americans sometime there are some grey area's.

Why you stop me, you fit the descrtion of a person who ........ Black male black hair brown eye's. etc.Say what? Stop resisting stop resisting etc etc.

I'm an american, I do not have any political preference blue red lib vs cons bull shit. more or less bottom line they are politicians.

You all are worrying about your consttution rightsl and i don't hear squat when the cops SOP Profile Minoritys. Less experienced cops shoot first ask questions later they are in a high stress situation and some do a better job than others.

50 shot's fired in NYC cause the plain cloth's cops were in fear of their life because when the car backed up to leave a PC cop foot got run over.

John rich: When NYC switched to glocks I know there was a special ny trigger (heavier pull) and their mags were restricked to seven rd's. I remember the chief or top cop at the time said somethiing about if you can't hit the target in 7 shots to bad we don't want you doing a pray and spraywith a 17rd mag.

R.I.P.

[Lucky... 0]

Reminds me of an incident years back. It involved a vehicle, I know diff, but still the same concept of coercive asking to search when no PC exists.

I was driving thru Utah in 89, had an old truck towing a 16ft enclosed trailer that was homemade looking. I just passed a sign that read, "NO services for 100 miles) The cops were going the opposite way on a freeway/highway and turned around before I even passed them. As they flipped they hit their lights and pulled me over.

He walked up and I said, "I couldn't have been speeding." (I was going about 50 pulling the trailer). He said no. I asked why he pulled me over, he replied, as he looked around, "I couldn;t see your license plate." (I was thinking of course you couldn't, lying sack of shit, you were ahead of me when you decided to pull me over - total profile stop). Anyway, he asks me if I had a lot of cash on me, carrying any drugs or had guns in the cab. I said no to all. He asks me what is in the trailer. I told him I have my clothes and tools, plus a motorcycle. (Meanwhile, dirtbag cop partner is trying to peek between the sheets of plywoood to look inside).

So then he asks me if he can look inside the trailer. I replied that he cannot. He got real pissed and asked what I was hiding. I said, "nothing." He asked why he could not look in there. I replied that if I open the door, he can be there all day and strew my stuff all over the road. He said he wouldn't do that. I said once I open the door, you can do what you want. He looked at me real sternly and stated, "I'm gonna ask you one more time, can I look in the trailer?" I said, "No." He looked at me and nodded his head as if to say, 'All right, fucker, you just fucked up." And then he left.

Most other people would have been too scared to refuse and let the slime search, rip and destroy. Who knows, maybe the partner dirtbag would have took me to the other side of the trailer while DB1 either planted something or stole something.

So with this story, the same kind of corecion could be present with a home search. Even tho voluntariness is the key, to have cops go door to door aking to search crosses lines of teh spirit of privacy and protection from governmental intrusion.

[Lucky... 0]

Quote

Quote

I was once asked by a cop if he could search my vehicle. I told him, "No." He said, "You know I really don't need your permission to search it." I told him, "If you believe that you have the legal right to search this vehicle then you go ahead, but you do NOT have my permission." He said, "What are you afraid of?" "I'm afraid you don't have a warrant." I didn't feel as though I'd made a new friend that day.

Good one!

I once refused to answer any questions for a chickenshit traffic stop for rolling through a stop sign in a residential neighborhood. They have these little boxes on their form they have to fill out, like: "Where are you employed?" I simply said that he had my driver's license for identification, and that I wasn't going to answer any further personal questions. Whooeeee, they don't like that. But there's nothing they can do about it.

Oh, and they almost always ask: "Is this your current address?" They're not doing that out of friendly curiousity. What they want to find out is if you've moved more than 3 months ago, and that would then be another ticket they can write because you failed to notify the Division of Motor Vehicles of your change of address.

If a question sounds fishy, or there doesn't seem to be any reason for them to be asking it - just politely decline to answer. There's a hidden reason for them asking, and it can only do you harm to answer.

I do the same thing and a scumbag judge said, "There's no 5th Amendment protection in civil matters." Caught me off gaurd, but the scumbag cop isn't a scumbag judge and the street isn't a court. Net result: I don;t have to invoke my 5th on the street when the liar is questioning me.

[Lucky... 0]

Quote

The constitution we all know and love has some grey area's. and though we're all americans sometime there are some grey area's.

Uh, the Constitution is ALL grey, hence the SCOTUS to darken in areas, but these areas move around as time goes on.

[slug 1]

Quote

Quote

The constitution we all know and love has some grey area's. and though we're all americans sometime there are some grey area's.

Uh, the Constitution is ALL grey, hence the SCOTUS to darken in areas, but these areas move around as time goes on.

Hi lucky


Hm this is SC
Ok your right. You win.
Thanks for interupting you busy schedual.

R.I.P.

[Scoop 0]

Its not illegal to look through someones windows. In fact if you look through someones windows and see something odd looking that builds your justification for a thorough search. Like for example looking in you see a set of gloves, a balaclava, you know the local area has been hit by burglaries recently and its an odd time of night for you to be about. If police officers don't look and ask questions then they are actually being negligent in their duty. What might seem as a slight inconvenience to you is very basic bread & butter policing that helps keep burglars out of your house while your asleep.

Society likes to complain and make things very difficult for authority, unfortunately some bad eggs have caused this combined with a sensational media. If we lived in a world where police weren't allowed to do basic enquiries they would not be able to do good proactive polcing, which prevents crime and stops it before its been comitted.

JohnRich, as is my understanding, you were well within your right not to give anymore info if officer had all that was legally required. But why do you think that if you had failed to notify of change of address (which is an offence) that the pesky cop is trying to get one over on you? It is illegal! The sad fact is people drive without insurance, dont register vehicles in their name, dont notify when they change address and as a result, when they commit crime, are involved in accidents or knock someone over and make off from the scene it becomes very difficult to track them down. If that was your son, family member or friend who was hurt or had their car smashed you'd be the first one screaming about how the useless police aren't doing their jobs if they can't track the offender down. You can't have it both ways.

I've said before, by being so furtive to police and creating a bad atmosphere that tends to make cops think something is up. He might not know your just being a prick, he probably thinks your trying to evade something, so don't be surprised if they take things a step furthur. Asking someone where they live is a reasonable request in my opinion.

If I pulled someone over and I wanted to deal with it in a manner beyond verbal advice, ie ticket, report to appear at court etc and they failed to give me their name and/or address they would be arrested for failing to provide a name or address suitable for summons.

You never know, what started off as 'lets have a chat with this guy cos his lights out' easily becomes 'this guys a fucking asshole, he can have a ticket as hes obviously got an attitude problem'

[Andy9o8 0]

Which brings up another point (really a side point, but what the hell). Ever notice that every time a traffic stop is made the cop always asks, "Do you know why I stopped you?" It's because he's trying to get you to admit to (fill in the blank here: speeding, running the stop sign, etc.), so that admission can be used against you. Then when you fight the ticket in court, Bam! -- your admission has sunk you. I've seen it happen in court dozens of times. You're almost always best off saying "No, sir, I don't know why you stopped me", no matter how obvious the infraction may be.

[Scoop 0]

Yeah its true, but don't you hate it when scumbags get off with things. Face your consequences and stop being such a chicken shit (not you, but whoever trys to wriggle off the hook)

[Andy9o8 0]

Quote

Yeah its true, but don't you hate it when scumbags get off with things. Face your consequences and stop being such a chicken shit (not you, but whoever trys to wriggle off the hook)

Ah, depends on definition of "scumbadgs" and "things". A burglar getting off with a burglary? Yes, I don't like that. Joe Average Citizen fighting a traffic ticket? No, that doesn't bother me.

[Scoop 0]

I guess it depends on what the traffic tickets for eh. Number plate light not working... that pretty pathetic. But even a light out is potentially dangerous if there is no illumination on that side. Other vehicles can assume you are a motorcycle in the dark and might not allow enough room, a pedestrian may step out prematurely or even if nothing like that does happen the headlight that does still work becomes ultra bright and dazzles oncoming traffic. Plus why should everyone else maintain their cars to a reasonable condition for safetys sake when other people are allowed to get away with not doing the same? That isn't fair

I think it probably appears that cops are being over the top regularly, but the trouble is they go to more incidents in a week than most people will ever see in their entire life. Seeing people smashed up in accidents, distraught homeowners returning to a ransacked property and the consequences of dangerous driving tend to harden you up and make you not see it is such a casual matter. Don't get me wrong, a lot of traffic legislation is very picky but its for a reason, perhaps that your average Joe citizen doesn't get to see. Maybe all new drivers should go to one of those fire & rescue driving days where they show you the gruesome reality of accidents.

I'm lucky, I've only had to tell one set of parents that their son had died in a car accident and killed his girlfriend passenger too, hardest part was telling them it was his own fault for driving like an idiot (I was more diplomatic at the time naturally). But telling one family that their son, brother, grandson, uncle had died is enough for me. I'd prefer not to have to ever say it again

[JohnRich 4]

Quote

'this guys a fucking asshole, he can have a ticket as hes obviously got an attitude problem'

A perfect illustration of what is at stake here. Someone exercising their constitutional rights should not be deemed an asshole, and given a ticket just to "teach him a lesson". The person who is really an asshole and which has the wrong attitude in that scenario, is actually the cop giving the ticket. It's unprofesssional and gives all cops a bad name. It's not your job to use your authority to give tickets to people just because you think they're an asshole.

[Lucky... 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

The constitution we all know and love has some grey area's. and though we're all americans sometime there are some grey area's.

Uh, the Constitution is ALL grey, hence the SCOTUS to darken in areas, but these areas move around as time goes on.

Hi lucky


Hm this is SC
Ok your right. You win.
Thanks for interupting you busy schedual.

R.I.P.

Thanks for the void reply, now on with your busy "schedual."

BTW, the US Const is grey, hence the SCOTUS to darken in the colors. Don't think so, spend a while pondering the meaning of the word, "reasonable" and its application to presonal rights of privacy and intrusions.

[Lucky... 0]

Quote

You never know, what started off as 'lets have a chat with this guy cos his lights out' easily becomes 'this guys a fucking asshole, he can have a ticket as hes obviously got an attitude problem'

Yea, he's an asshole cause he won't gladly succomb to Police Naziism.

[Lucky... 0]

Quote

Which brings up another point (really a side point, but what the hell). Ever notice that every time a traffic stop is made the cop always asks, "Do you know why I stopped you?" It's because he's trying to get you to admit to (fill in the blank here: speeding, running the stop sign, etc.), so that admission can be used against you. Then when you fight the ticket in court, Bam! -- your admission has sunk you. I've seen it happen in court dozens of times. You're almost always best off saying "No, sir, I don't know why you stopped me", no matter how obvious the infraction may be.

So if the pedestrian's head is sticking thru the windshield licking me in the ear, still say that I don't know?

[Lucky... 0]

Quote

Yeah its true, but don't you hate it when scumbags get off with things. Face your consequences and stop being such a chicken shit (not you, but whoever trys to wriggle off the hook)

Quote

Yeah its true, but don't you hate it when scumbags get off with things.

Hey, start your own, "Police immunity" thread; quit hijacking ours.