Secret CIA prisons DO exist

[freeflir29 0]

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I cann't see how the world has suddenly become more dangerous... It's always been that way..

No.........prior to the demise of the Soviet Union/End of the "Cold War" (Hate that term since there was PLENTY of shooting) there was somewhat of a balance. The USSR supported this side and it was met in many places by support from the US and or NATO on the other side. There was some control. Certainly there was terrorism but it was MOST often state sponsored. DIRECTLY! (That one is important) In this new age of the GWOT (Global War on Terrorism) the terrorist are now stateless and PRIVATELY funded through thousands of "charities." This makes things A BIT more difficult. They have no law or order to follow. No one is making rules because WE (As in "civilized western society") are the only ones that are forced to use rules by political pressure. Armed conflict is an extension of politics. When negotiations fail a government or in the case of Islamic Extremists uses force to try and further coerce their foe to do as they wish. We did actually try to use political pressure a time or two to stop Bin Laden. It was a pretty weak attempt though and Clinton made a HERO out of Bin Laden and the Taliban for "Standing Up to the Infidels." What so many fail to understand is this is nothing more than a WORLD WIDE Insurgency. Think most of what happened in the Vietnam war on a GLOBAL scale. This isn't EVER going to go away. There will always be some "Down Trodden" little guy somewhere that feels slighted because he either has suffered due to some perceived wrongdoing (Or actual in some cases) or just the fact that he doesn't have as much money as he thinks he should. (Jealousy) Now bring in religion and the bastardization of it by modern Islamic Extremists. He now has not just a grievance..........but a "CALLING." I don't see an end to this ever. Islamic Extremists are using Islamic "Transnationalism" to incite violence. When someone is willing to give their life in order to kill civilians the only thing a Govt or security force can do is help them do that as quickly as possible while limiting the damage. I think the intel community and Law Enforcement agencies in the US have done an absolutely Amazing job at heading off SO MANY attacks. I'm proud to be part of that. This "WAR" isn't about Iraq or Afghanistan so much as it is about keeping the violence OUT of the West and OUT of mine and your living rooms, malls, schools, and streets. That's my take anyway. Of course, I have been awake for the better part of 2 days right now.

[freeflir29 0]

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I feel truely sorry for you.

And I you. I'm guessing you served in the military in one or both of the two theaters. You obviously got a bad taste in your mouth from it. I can't blame you. Especially if you were some regular Army (Joe's we call them). I imagine it looks hopeless and frustrating from that view. When all you know is that you drive down the road and people throw rocks, shoot AK's, and set IED's for you. If you were in Iraq I particularly understand. I work with a bunch of guys right now that spent a large amount of time traversing Southern Iraq. (British Military territory for those that don't know) It's ugly down there. Almopst like the cold war all over again with Iran and the West fighting a "Proxy War."


I'm NOT a USAF Airman anymore. I get to do things here that really and truely are changing the world. It's exciting and I see it happen every day. Yes......there is a certain amount of "Driving down the road hoping the IED is far enough away to NOT penetrate your vehicle's armor. Gee.........hope if there is a sniper watching me right now his rifle or skills or both are rusty!" But there is also an AMAZING amount of progress going on. Watching how excited people were to VOTE. Then the parades afterward because their party one. It was party on for 3 days straight in this town. Seeing poor families or whole villages and even an ENTIRE COUNTRY Benefitting by WHAT I DO for a living. Here's one for you............how about the day an insurgent walked up to me and PEACEFULLY surrendered. I will remember THAT for the rest of my life. Plus a whole BOAT LOAD of other things that I WON'T discuss on the internet. I don't think I'm banking too many Karma points or anything but it is very satisfying in it's own way. I consider this the opportunity of a life time. You can say what you want but I believe I am making a difference.




OK.............stop it............enough rambling. I need sleep.

[Skyrad 0]

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I cann't see how the world has suddenly become more dangerous... It's always been that way..

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Certainly there was terrorism but it was MOST often state sponsored. DIRECTLY! (That one is important)

Not so. There was some state sponsored terrorism but by no means was most of it so.

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In this new age of the GWOT (Global War on Terrorism) the terrorist are now stateless and PRIVATELY funded through thousands of "charities." This makes things A BIT more difficult. They have no law or order to follow.

Your argument fall here because you seem to lump all Terrorist together as one entity. The groups are as they have always been seperate with limited communication and with various goals, some religios, some national and some regional some just ideological.

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We did actually try to use political pressure a time or two to stop Bin Laden. It was a pretty weak attempt though and Clinton made a HERO out of Bin Laden and the Taliban for "Standing Up to the Infidels."

Until 9/11 Bin Laden was either not well known or seen as a bit player by both the east and the west, even after the Cole.

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What so many fail to understand is this is nothing more than a WORLD WIDE Insurgency.

This is nothing more than propergander and is total nonsense.

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Think most of what happened in the Vietnam war on a GLOBAL scale.

Sorry but thats nonsense. Vietnam was both a ideological nationalist insurgency. What we're seeing here is attacks by different groups for different reasons lumped together by a government desperately trying to sell a reason for Pax Americana.

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This isn't EVER going to go away.

The Neo con wet dream, war without end. That is the legacy of GWB. (& before you start banging on about Clinton, I couldn't care less)

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There will always be some "Down Trodden" little guy somewhere that feels slighted because he either has suffered due to some perceived wrongdoing (Or actual in some cases) or just the fact that he doesn't have as much money as he thinks he should. (Jealousy)

Still not sure how much of the 'Jealousy' argument is intelectual lazyness and how much is just ignorance and arrogance.(Not you personaly)

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Now bring in religion and the bastardization of it by modern Islamic Extremists. He now has not just a grievance..........but a "CALLING."

At last we agree on something. But who put those hardliners into positions of power in the first place? We did back when we wanted them to fight our proxy wars against the Godless commies.

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I don't see an end to this ever. Islamic Extremists are using Islamic "Transnationalism" to incite violence.

Some are trying to but there isn't yet a global jihad, dispite the Bush governments best efforts to develope one.

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This "WAR" isn't about Iraq or Afghanistan

Which had nothing to do with each other.

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so much as it is about keeping the violence OUT of the West and OUT of mine and your living rooms, malls, schools, and streets.

In which case like I said before the US is loosing the war. Before the so called 'GTW' Islamic terrorists weren't exploding bombs in Europe or blowing themselves up on tube trains. The so called 'GWT' has encouraged and spread and given percieved just cause to the call for a Jihad by people who would never before harbour such ideas.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

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[idrankwhat 0]

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The thing I can't figure out is whether it's ignorance or dishonesty that leads people to put all the blame for the state of affairs on the Bush administration.

I suppose you could include the Republican leadership due to their willingness to cede their power of checks and balances to the executive branch. That aside, why shouldn't the Bush administration take the blame? They're the ones who left Bin Laden and the "war on terror" when they yanked most of the resources and ignored our military leadership to implement their premeditated invasion of Iraq, and by doing so lost the global public support that we had post 9/11, getting us into a civil war quagmire that has cost us nearly a half a trillion dollars so far. They're the ones who are breaking international laws with regard to invasion, detention, torture, using cluster bombs in populated areas, etc. They're the ones who's actions are increasing the number of terrorists world wide. And they're the ones who think that the US should be able to torture and prosecute people in a manner that they themselves would never be expected to tolerate and then have the arrogance or ignorance to not listen to their military leadership when it tells them that such practices put our own troops in danger. And they're the ones who insist on keeping Rumsfeld in the DoD ever after he's gotten absolutely everything wrong so far.

As if voting in some power hungry democrat is gonna make a lick of difference. I almost want liberals to win so that they can see the world of shit they'll make for themselves...

Power hungry? You have that right now with this authoritarian executive branch. I'm more interested in something resembling Constitutional. That aside, as much as I want a change in leadership I don't know that I want a Democrat to win. Bush's foreign and economic policies have basically set up a time bomb to go off during the next 4-8 years. I almost want someone like that bigot George Allen in office so he can take the fall that he helped to create. But then again I live here too and I don't want to have to put up with the fallout of a Bush clone.

[Skyrad 0]

Glad that you're sincere, and hope I'm wrong.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[nacmacfeegle 0]

"Until 9/11 Bin Laden was either not well known or seen as a bit player by both the east and the west, even after the Cole. "

Not so, he was on the USA's most wanted list for a number of years.
Next time you watch Silence of the Lambs look out for his pic...

--------------------

He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson

[idrankwhat 0]

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But there is also an AMAZING amount of progress going on. Watching how excited people were to VOTE.

Can you do us a favor, when you're finished over there could you come to the US and help folks get to the polls? It's pretty sad when voter turnout in a war zone is better than over here in democracy's "model".

[freeflir29 0]

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There was some state sponsored terrorism but by no means was most of it so.

Most of the large groups and even the small ones in Western Europe ALL received funding from the USSR. Even if they didn't particularly agree on ideaology it was a case of "The enemy of my enemy is my friend." Or even simpler when a specific operation was funded to further the sponsor's cause. All the wars I can think of in Africa during the time started as colonial squabbles and ended in full blown proxy wars. Same with Vietnam and Afghanistan. Of course there were also assholes like "Carlos" that just seemed to work for money as an all encompassing motivation. Hell......Saddam Hussein did the world a favor when his security forces killed Abu Nidal. I'd STILL like to know the REST of THAT story.

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The groups are as they have always been seperate with limited communication and with various goals, some religios, some national and some regional some just ideological.

I think OBL was able to "rally the troops" when he discovered a methodology that was successful in attacking the west. There is a VAST amount of intercommunication and cooperation with like minded groups. There's also a HUGE population that will if not directly support at least lend tacit support. OBL didn't create this network. It's been around for 1000's of years going back to the crusades and probably before that. Due to technology it has just become FAR more effective.

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Until 9/11 Bin Laden was either not well known or seen as a bit player by both the east and the west, even after the Cole.

Yep..........MANY people were asleep at the wheel. Seems all the warnings happened to fall on deaf ears. Even some of mine when I TRIED to warn the FBI about Islamic terrorists raising money INSIDE the US. They completely ignored me before 9/11 but took action within 1 day after 9/11.

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What so many fail to understand is this is nothing more than a WORLD WIDE Insurgency.

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This is nothing more than propergander[sic] and is total nonsense.

I'm going to stick with that definition. We'll have to agree to disagree on that one. When you send "cells" around the world to recruit new members in an area, spread your propaganda and also conduct combat (terrorist) operations............Ummm........I can't think of a better word than "Insurgency" off the top of my head. Sure..........some of these cells spring up "spontaneously" through joining your cause but that's the aim of ANY insurgent leader. To cause the SPONTANEOUS uprising of the people due to causing the govt to use harsh methods to stop the insurgency. It creates a viscious circle and can be rather effective. As can be seen repeated throughout history.

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Vietnam was both an ideological and nationalist insurgency.

I don't think the Vietnamese (Southerners) fought for many ideological reasons. It was more nationalist. The communism came more from the North as a tool I think. Just my opinion. Remember that after the US left they turned around and fought Pol Pot and the Kmer Rouge and then got spanked rather hard by the Chinese for being "uppity." I think mostly they just wanted to be left alone.

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The Neo con wet dream, war without end. That is the legacy of GWB.

War was here LONG before me, you, or GWB. I live just a few miles from a place called the Citadel. It's quite a few thousand years old now and has hosted the likes of Alexander and the Templar Knights. The HUGE battle between Alexander and Salahedden took place just a few miles from where I live. There has been war since men were living in caves. This is just the newest flavor and many kinds have been lumped into "GWOT." You can't blame war on GWB.

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Still not sure how much of the 'Jealousy' argument is intelectual lazyness and how much is just ignorance and arrogance.

Me either.........I think there is plenty on both sides. If you can remember the Russian communists term of "The Decadant West." I think that part can be explained. The Russians used communism to attack our lifestyle while Islamic Extremists use religion. *Shrug*

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At last we agree on something. But who put those hardliners into positions of power in the first place? We did back when we wanted them to fight our proxy wars against the Godless commies.

Actually no.........All we did was give them ASS LOADS of money through the Pakistanis. Read the book Charlie Wilson's War. I don't believe it's entirely truthful but does give some good info anyway. I hear we gave them quite a bit of hands on training as well. However, we never "put anyone in charge." In fact the guy that liked us the most was fighting to hold onto the Panjsheer Valley by his fingernails. Ahmed Shah Masood WOULD have been put in power by the US shortly after 9/11. IF OBL and the Taliban hadn't forseen that and sent a suicide bomber after him.

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Some are trying to but there isn't yet a global jihad

Ummm..........I'd hate to see your apocolyptic requirements before you were willing to call it that.

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This "WAR" isn't about Iraq or Afghanistan

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Which had nothing to do with each other.

I didn't say they did. ABout the only thing in common is that people in them represented a clear threat to the Western World and the US in particular.

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Before the so called 'GTW' Islamic terrorists weren't exploding bombs in Europe or blowing themselves up on tube trains.The so called 'GWT' has encouraged and spread and given percieved just cause to the call for a Jihad by people who would never before harbour such ideas.

And the STRING of attacks on Western interests all the way back to the 60's and 70's didn't? There wasn't a certain portion of the Islamic world that DIDN'T cheer everytime an airliner was hijacked, blown up, or an American killed in some other attack? Munich? (Yes I know the Palestinian/Israeli conflict is sort of it's own ball of dog poo but A LOT of this found it's roots in that conflict)

[freeflir29 0]

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It's pretty sad when voter turnout in a war zone is better than over here in democracy's "model".

No shit..........I meant to say something like "And people in the US often think of it as a burden. If they even bother to think of it at all."

[kallend 1,623]

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I cann't see how the world has suddenly become more dangerous... It's always been that way..

No.........prior to the demise of the Soviet Union/End of the "Cold War" (Hate that term since there was PLENTY of shooting) there was somewhat of a balance. The USSR supported this side and it was met in many places by support from the US and or NATO on the other side. There was some control. Certainly there was terrorism but it was MOST often state sponsored. DIRECTLY! (That one is important) In this new age of the GWOT (Global War on Terrorism) the terrorist are now stateless and PRIVATELY funded through thousands of "charities." This makes things A BIT more difficult. They have no law or order to follow. No one is making rules because WE (As in "civilized western society") are the only ones that are forced to use rules by political pressure. Armed conflict is an extension of politics. When negotiations fail a government or in the case of Islamic Extremists uses force to try and further coerce their foe to do as they wish. We did actually try to use political pressure a time or two to stop Bin Laden. It was a pretty weak attempt though and Clinton made a HERO out of Bin Laden and the Taliban for "Standing Up to the Infidels." What so many fail to understand is this is nothing more than a WORLD WIDE Insurgency. Think most of what happened in the Vietnam war on a GLOBAL scale. This isn't EVER going to go away. There will always be some "Down Trodden" little guy somewhere that feels slighted because he either has suffered due to some perceived wrongdoing (Or actual in some cases) or just the fact that he doesn't have as much money as he thinks he should. (Jealousy) Now bring in religion and the bastardization of it by modern Islamic Extremists. He now has not just a grievance..........but a "CALLING." I don't see an end to this ever. Islamic Extremists are using Islamic "Transnationalism" to incite violence. When someone is willing to give their life in order to kill civilians the only thing a Govt or security force can do is help them do that as quickly as possible while limiting the damage. I think the intel community and Law Enforcement agencies in the US have done an absolutely Amazing job at heading off SO MANY attacks. I'm proud to be part of that. This "WAR" isn't about Iraq or Afghanistan so much as it is about keeping the violence OUT of the West and OUT of mine and your living rooms, malls, schools, and streets. That's my take anyway. Of course, I have been awake for the better part of 2 days right now.

Classic American view that nothing exists unless it affects the USA. The IRA was (is) privately funded and for 30 years killed, maimed and blew up stuff in the UK and elsewhere. It was mostly funded by Americans through "charities" which the USA did nothing about. The US did sweet F.A. about terrorism until 9/11.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Skyrad 0]

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Yes I know the Palestinian/Israeli conflict is sort of it's own ball of dog poo

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Skyrad 0]

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I cann't see how the world has suddenly become more dangerous... It's always been that way..

No.........prior to the demise of the Soviet Union/End of the "Cold War" (Hate that term since there was PLENTY of shooting) there was somewhat of a balance. The USSR supported this side and it was met in many places by support from the US and or NATO on the other side. There was some control. Certainly there was terrorism but it was MOST often state sponsored. DIRECTLY! (That one is important) In this new age of the GWOT (Global War on Terrorism) the terrorist are now stateless and PRIVATELY funded through thousands of "charities." This makes things A BIT more difficult. They have no law or order to follow. No one is making rules because WE (As in "civilized western society") are the only ones that are forced to use rules by political pressure. Armed conflict is an extension of politics. When negotiations fail a government or in the case of Islamic Extremists uses force to try and further coerce their foe to do as they wish. We did actually try to use political pressure a time or two to stop Bin Laden. It was a pretty weak attempt though and Clinton made a HERO out of Bin Laden and the Taliban for "Standing Up to the Infidels." What so many fail to understand is this is nothing more than a WORLD WIDE Insurgency. Think most of what happened in the Vietnam war on a GLOBAL scale. This isn't EVER going to go away. There will always be some "Down Trodden" little guy somewhere that feels slighted because he either has suffered due to some perceived wrongdoing (Or actual in some cases) or just the fact that he doesn't have as much money as he thinks he should. (Jealousy) Now bring in religion and the bastardization of it by modern Islamic Extremists. He now has not just a grievance..........but a "CALLING." I don't see an end to this ever. Islamic Extremists are using Islamic "Transnationalism" to incite violence. When someone is willing to give their life in order to kill civilians the only thing a Govt or security force can do is help them do that as quickly as possible while limiting the damage. I think the intel community and Law Enforcement agencies in the US have done an absolutely Amazing job at heading off SO MANY attacks. I'm proud to be part of that. This "WAR" isn't about Iraq or Afghanistan so much as it is about keeping the violence OUT of the West and OUT of mine and your living rooms, malls, schools, and streets. That's my take anyway. Of course, I have been awake for the better part of 2 days right now.

Classic American view that nothing exists unless it affects the USA. The IRA was (is) privately funded and for 30 years killed, maimed and blew up stuff in the UK and elsewhere. It was mostly funded by Americans through "charities" which the USA did nothing about. The US did sweet F.A. about terrorism until 9/11.

Beat me to it.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Skyrad 0]

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Most of the large groups and even the small ones in Western Europe ALL received funding from the USSR. Even if they didn't particularly agree on ideaology it was a case of "The enemy of my enemy is my friend." Or even simpler when a specific operation was funded to further the sponsor's cause. All the wars I can think of in Africa during the time started as colonial squabbles and ended in full blown proxy wars. Same with Vietnam and Afghanistan.

When looking at Global terrorism we can't just look at Western Europe, as you know its a big world out there. Also just because a terrorist organisation was funded by a country doesn't follow that they were under operational control or constraint.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[freeflir29 0]

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The IRA was (is) privately funded and for 30 years killed, maimed and blew up stuff in the UK and elsewhere. It was mostly funded by Americans through "charities" which the USA did nothing about. The US did sweet F.A. about terrorism until 9/11.

So you're trying to tell me that they DIDN'T recieve MAJOR funding and operational assistance from the USSR? I'd have to disagree with you there. They certainly had no great love for each other but it was a means to both their ends. Just like the more recent links between members of IRA factions and the FARC in Colombia. I'm WELL AWARE that MILLIONS of dollars came from private US citizens. Sadly.......in much the same manner that millions now end up in Jihadi coffers to fund the killing of "Infidels." But please don't try and tell me the USSR wasn't HEAVILY involved in helping the IRA.

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When looking at Global terrorism we can't just look at Western Europe

I wasn't. I was just citing those because the communist block had a much more obvious hand in the rest of the world.

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Also just because a terrorist organisation was funded by a country doesn't follow that they were under operational control or constraint.

True...........but it DOES give the funding nation "plausible deniability." As long as it doesn't damage the funding country........they didn't care what damage was done to the "enemy." Terrorism is almost always "cost effective." Since you guys like to bash the US I'll use the example of covert funding of the war in Rhodesia. Politically the American people would NOT stand for another war. We had just gotten out of Vietnam. So......money was funneled to South Africa which paid the salaries of the "mercenaries" that fought. BTW........the USSR was funding the other side.

[kallend 1,623]

I'm telling you that IRA terrorism was fundied primarily by Americans by way of "charities" like
Noraid

Now, do you have any evidence that the USSR funded the IRA or are you just blowing hot air?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Skyrad 0]

Soviet interest for the IRA was in the Official IRA, the 'Stickies' the left wingers, socialists dedicated to not only the removal of the British but to the overthrow of the Dublin govenment and the setting up of a Socialist/Communist government of all Ireland. who later became the INLA, this interest was short lived and not in the form of finance it fell away when the PIRA made a deal not to carry out hostile actions against the Republic in 1969 (when the PIRA took the lead in the fighting). The Soviet Union gave no financial support to the PIRA who have recieved the majority of their operating costs from US citizens whos great, great, grandaddy once farted in County Mayo.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[freeflir29 0]

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Now, do you have any evidence that the USSR funded the IRA or are you just blowing hot air?

I don't keep a library no. I did find an interesting page though. You have to scroll down a ways to get to the IRA mention. http://www.windsofchange.net/2002_09_01_woc.html


That one seems to point mostly to American fund raising and organized crime. Which is CERTAINLY what they survive on these days. Here's one that doesn't give direct links to the USSR but shows the "trail of logistics" that the USSR had world wide.

http://www.signsofthetimes.org.uk/Loretta%5Bfulltext%5D.html



Anyway......seems I can't find a more solid link at this moment but you HAVE to know they would fund an organization so close to their doorstep. Even if it was through convoluted relationships.

[Skyrad 0]

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But the LTTE are small time compared to some of the players out there. Like Britain & Ireland's IRA. Or Colombia's FARC.

In terms of attacks and bombings the LTTE are way ahead of either the IRA or the FARC.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Trent 0]

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I suppose you could include the Republican leadership due to their willingness to cede their power of checks and balances to the executive branch. That aside, why shouldn't the Bush administration take the blame? They're the ones who...

I'll bet glasses for that kind of short-sightedness are REALLY thick. But whatever, I understand that people are so obsessed with hating the current government that it leads them to make ridiculous arguments. Like your very own here... Bush and the current Republican administration are to blame for all the mess, and nothing that anyone before them did (or DIDN'T do) lead up to it, no. And, NO, our own policies and lack of planning across MANY presidents didn't have anything to do with where we are today. You're right... it must be Bush's fault.

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Bush's foreign and economic policies have basically set up a time bomb to go off during the next 4-8 years.

So Bush screwed everything up and NONE of it had to do with people before him... BUT, he's so powerful that ONLY HE could influence the world that is left to the next president? Guaranteed that logic will be what the Dems use to make excuses for their failures if they win in 2008.

Like I said, it'd almost be worth it to let your ilk have their way and just see what would happen...

Oh, hello again!

[shropshire 0]

You could be right, you're a lot closer to it than I am...

BUT,

There's only been a GWOT since America got hit, before that, it seems like they couldn't give a toss and we funding/training some of the nasties out there.

Anyway.. my thoughts go out to for the families of ALL victims, especially with the anniversary of 11/9 tomorrow.

PAX

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[freeflir29 0]

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There's only been a GWOT since America got hit, before that, it seems like they couldn't give a toss and we funding/training some of the nasties out there.

Are you kidding? Do you really think that America only started to fight terrorism AFTER 9/11? Yes it became MUCH more public after but please. Of course.........every time they WERE involved all the conspiracy nuts went off. How about a little country called Somalia? Remember that?

[shropshire 0]

Not what I was saying..

The MUCH publicised GWOT is NEW a PA/money earning exercise (I would guess)... but what do I know I'm just one of the tax paying idiots that let Phoney Tony get away with joining in.

Question(s) : Was Somalia about fighting global terrorism? Did it help?.. Why didn't we bother with Rwandan ?

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[kallend 1,623]

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Not what I was saying..

The MUCH publicised GWOT is NEW a PA/money earning exercise (I would guess)... but what do I know I'm just one of the tax paying idiots that let Phoney Tony get away with joining in.

Question(s) : Was Somalia about fighting global terrorism?

No - it was a "humanitarian" mission in relief of a country tearing itself apart with no effective central govt., just a bunch of competing warlords.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[shropshire 0]

Ta.

So, why did the US get involved? Were they asked for help?

.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[freeflir29 0]

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Were they asked for help?

Yes..........the UN and NGO's were reporting how bad it was there. However, it was made a complete mess by the liberal leadership of Bill Clinton. It was a "humanitarian" mission but I think there were a lot of people that saw the "writing on the wall" and figured it was a win win situation. Save a few million people from starving to death AND bag some shit heads.


Rwanda? Good question. The world typically ignores Africa because it's just plain such a mess. Damn near every western country in the world has tried to make Africa better. Some of it horribly misguided but they tried. In the end..........it always ends up a disaster.