Richards 0
Recommended Posts
kallend 1,920
QuoteQuoteThe trouble with polls like this is that the vote of the police chief of my home town, population 8400, has exactly the same weight as the vote of the police chief of NYC, Chicago, Houston or LA. Ditto for sheriffs' votes whrn the population of counties may be 1,000 or 3,000,000
In other words, it is pretty stupid.
So, unless you're in a city as large as Chicago, there's no crime?
HAHAHAHAAHHAA!
Ok, John. So what about my town of 65,000 is a regular Mayberry and our Chief doesn't have to worry about any crime? We don't have to worry about any murder or rape or gangs or violent crime?
Oh, wait, Chicago doesn't have any sort of violent crime according to your past posts. Perfectly safe to walk down the street in the middle of the night.
The issue is whether the weight given to the opinion of a police chief of a town of 800 inhabitants should be the same as the weight given to the opinion of a chief of a city of 3,000,000.
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
kallend 1,920
QuoteQuote
The trouble with polls like this is that the vote of the police chief of my home town, population 8400, has exactly the same weight as the vote of the police chief of NYC, Chicago, Houston or LA. Ditto for sheriffs' votes whrn the population of counties may be 1,000 or 3,000,000
In other words, it is pretty stupid.
well John I see gun control laws have really helped lower Chicago's crime rate...
![[:/]](/uploads/emoticons/dry.png "[:/]"){kind=small}
Chicago's homicide rate has DROPPED approximately 50% since 2002.
Now, what was it you were saying?
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
crwtom 0
Quote
The total numbers of gun related homicides, which are 10-20
times higher in the US than in most western European countries
with restricive legislation, speak for themselves.
Cheers, T
You have no stats or facts to back that up. If I am wrong please post. The stats I am seeing do not support your statement
from
W. Cukier: "Firearms Regulation: Canada in the International Context"
Chronic Diseases in Canada 19 no.1 (1998)
(with some additional updates from 2001)
Country........Gun Homicide......Fraction of
.....................(per 100,000).........US rate
Australia_________0.56________11.1
Austria___________0.42_______14.9
Belgium__________0.87________7.2
Canada__________0.6________10.4
Denmark_________0.23________27.1
England/Wales____0.07________89.1
Finland__________0.87________7.2
France___________0.55_______11.3
Germany_________0.21_______29.7
Ireland___________0.3________20.8
Israel____________0.72________8.7
Italy_____________1.16_______5.4
Japan___________0.03_______208.0
Kuwait___________0.34_______18.4
Netherlands_______0.27_______23.1
New Zealand______0.22_______28.4
Northern Ireland___3.55________1.8
Norway__________0.36_______17.3
Scotland_________0.19_______32.8
Singapore________0.07_______89.1
Spain___________0.19_______32.8
Sweden__________0.18_______34.7
Switzerland_______0.46_______13.6
Taiwan__________0.15_______41.6
USA____________6.24________1.0
Note: does not include suicides.
Note: "Fraction of US rate" means, for example,
that the gun homocide rate in the US is 11.3 times
higher than that in France, etc.
Numbers may have changed some in recent years and, although
"gun homicide" is a relatively unambiguous term, there may be
slightly different opinoins about data collection.
However, the ballparks of these drastic ratios should still be the
same. (Even if some NPR prop. manufactures arguments that
contort some of the 1:20 ratios down to say 1:4 or so ratios the US still
fares very badly in the international comparison among these
higher income countries)
Cheers, T
*******************************************************************
Fear causes hesitation, and hesitation will cause your worst fears to come true
Fear causes hesitation, and hesitation will cause your worst fears to come true
QuoteQuoteQuote
The trouble with polls like this is that the vote of the police chief of my home town, population 8400, has exactly the same weight as the vote of the police chief of NYC, Chicago, Houston or LA. Ditto for sheriffs' votes whrn the population of counties may be 1,000 or 3,000,000
In other words, it is pretty stupid.
well John I see gun control laws have really helped lower Chicago's crime rate...
Chicago's homicide rate has DROPPED approximately 50% since 2002.
Now, what was it you were saying?
well I guess you are saying that it took until 2002 to have a drop in Chicago's homicide rate?
and this is due to the law that was passed in 1983?
I would also like to mention that the amount of shootings that didn't result in death were not accounted for in your statistics.
Also can you explain why politicians in chicago own guns, carry them even if they are prohibited by law, and also if they are a felon?
and yet that goes unpunished by law enforcement?
Quote
The issue is whether the weight given to the opinion of a police chief of a town of 800 inhabitants should be the same as the weight given to the opinion of a chief of a city of 3,000,000.
That's my point. A city of 10,000 has the same kind of crime that a city of 3,000,000 has. Infact, a smaller city can sometimes have more crime per capita then the larger city, even though the larger city has more instances of that specific crime.
--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."
rehmwa 2
Don't feel bad, obviously John just considers some Pigs to be 'more equal' than other pigs.
(If anyone here hasn't read 'animal farm' note that pigs is more of a quote from the story than a derogatory term for law enforcement officer)
This particular desire for aristocracy is considered normal and preferrable for the left wing liberal type.
...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants
(If anyone here hasn't read 'animal farm' note that pigs is more of a quote from the story than a derogatory term for law enforcement officer)
This particular desire for aristocracy is considered normal and preferrable for the left wing liberal type.
...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants
JohnRich 4
QuoteThe trouble with polls like this is that the vote of the police chief of my home town, population 8400, has exactly the same weight as the vote of the police chief of NYC, Chicago, Houston or LA.
In other words, it is pretty stupid.
You seem to be presuming that the votes of large-city police chiefs would more likely be against civilian gun ownership, and therefore, if they were used to represent the population they serve, that the vote would go more against gun ownership.
But you've provided nothing to support this idea that big city chiefs are somehow more prone to be anti-gun than small-city chiefs.
And you would also need to show that the population represented by the big city chiefs, is significantly larger than the collective population represented by all the small city chiefs.
So, your claim of "stupid" rings hollow.
micro 0
QuoteQuoteQuote
The trouble with polls like this is that the vote of the police chief of my home town, population 8400, has exactly the same weight as the vote of the police chief of NYC, Chicago, Houston or LA. Ditto for sheriffs' votes whrn the population of counties may be 1,000 or 3,000,000
In other words, it is pretty stupid.
well John I see gun control laws have really helped lower Chicago's crime rate...
Chicago's homicide rate has DROPPED approximately 50% since 2002.
Now, what was it you were saying?
Ran out of places to hide the bodies, did ya prof?
I miss Lee.
And JP.
And Chris. And...
SkyDekker 1,392
Funny, the police chiefs in Canada voted in favour of continuing the "gun registry"...Now, off course it couldn't be that these decisions and polls are heavily saturated with politics, now could it??
Nah...that would never happen.....
Nah...that would never happen.....
kallend 1,920
QuoteQuoteThe trouble with polls like this is that the vote of the police chief of my home town, population 8400, has exactly the same weight as the vote of the police chief of NYC, Chicago, Houston or LA.
In other words, it is pretty stupid.
You seem to be presuming that the votes of large-city police chiefs would more likely be against civilian gun ownership, and therefore, if they were used to represent the population they serve, that the vote would go more against gun ownership.
But you've provided nothing to support this idea that big city chiefs are somehow more prone to be anti-gun than small-city chiefs.
And you would also need to show that the population represented by the big city chiefs, is significantly larger than the collective population represented by all the small city chiefs.
So, your claim of "stupid" rings hollow.
No, I assume nothing at all, except that the poll is meaningless if the size of the chief's jurisdiction is not accounted for. We have precinct sergeants in Chicago who are responsible for policing more people and property than the chief of police in some of the rural Illinois towns. Why not give those sergeants a vote?
Meaningless data are meaningless regardless of which way the data are skewed.
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
JohnRich 4
Quotethe poll is meaningless if the size of the chief's jurisdiction is not accounted for.
It's not meaningless - it's a poll of police chiefs.
You want to presume that any poll that doesn't use civilian population as a base measurement is invalid. That's not so. There are lots of polls of selected types of people which don't follow that model, and which are perfectly valid. It represents just what it says it does - police chiefs. Whatever population they represent is not meant to be a factor, and is irrelevant to the poll.
If we took a poll about the opinions of college professors on some subject, would that automatically be a meaningless poll because some college professors teach more students than other college professors? According to your way of thinking, it would be...
SkyDekker 1,392
JR, do you think the role of mayor of New York City and mayor of Hickory Flat, MS is the same? Some complexity of the job? Same qualifications? Same standing?
I think that is what Kallend is trying to say. Even though they are the same job title, doesn't mean it is the same complexity of job.
I think that is what Kallend is trying to say. Even though they are the same job title, doesn't mean it is the same complexity of job.
JohnRich 4
QuoteJR, do you think the role of mayor of New York City and mayor of Hickory Flat, MS is the same? Some complexity of the job? Same qualifications? Same standing? I think that is what Kallend is trying to say. Even though they are the same job title, doesn't mean it is the same complexity of job.
The complexity of the job is not what the poll is about. It's about how the police chiefs feel about civilian gun ownership. The complexity of their particular roles is irrelevant.
It's amusing how those who dislike the poll results keep trying to put some kind of spin on it to discredit it.
kallend 1,920
QuoteQuoteJR, do you think the role of mayor of New York City and mayor of Hickory Flat, MS is the same? Some complexity of the job? Same qualifications? Same standing? I think that is what Kallend is trying to say. Even though they are the same job title, doesn't mean it is the same complexity of job.
The complexity of the job is not what the poll is about. It's about how the police chiefs feel about civilian gun ownership. The complexity of their particular roles is irrelevant.
It's amusing how those who dislike the poll results keep trying to put some kind of spin on it to discredit it.
It is meaningless in terms of information content. Why do you try to justify meaningless data? Might as well poll AFF instructors. The police chief of NYC is a totally different animal than the police chief of Little Podunk, IA.
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
mnealtx 0
I would think the Chief of Police of a small town would have a much better idea of his town's views on RKBA than the Chief of a much larger town.
Especially as the Chiefs in larger towns seem to be much more of a political animal than a law officer.
Especially as the Chiefs in larger towns seem to be much more of a political animal than a law officer.
Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706
Again too many on the extreme left would rather lament endlessly about root cause bullshit, and insist that putting a basketball court in a bad neighborhood will magically make all the gangbangers see the light and become churchgoing productive model citizens.
It is though it is politically incorrect to suggest that gangbangers getting plugged occasionally by their intended victims might actually serve a socially usefull purpose.
It is really bad up here in Canada where gun owners are more despised than the most depraved criminals for some silly reason
It is a shame because most criminals support gun laws (surprise surprise), and presently they are laughing at our weak criminal laws and strong gun laws.
Anyway had to rant
Share this post
Link to post
Share on other sites