jdhill 0 #1 May 20, 2005 Just curoius what people think? JAll that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. - Edmund Burke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lisamariewillbe 1 #2 May 20, 2005 If it didnt begin at conception then whats the point of conception?Sudsy Fist: i don't think i'd ever say this Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jdhill 0 #3 May 20, 2005 I should have said fertilization... JAll that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing. - Edmund Burke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpeedRacer 1 #4 May 20, 2005 QuoteWhen Does Life Begin? At 4:55 PM on Friday. Speed Racer -------------------------------------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Alias 0 #5 May 20, 2005 I think a new individual human being begins at fertilization, when the sperm and ovum meet to form a single cell. Carpe Diem Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #6 May 20, 2005 About 5 billion years ago? ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Alias 0 #7 May 20, 2005 QuoteJust curoius what people think? J Nice read http://zygote.swarthmore.edu/intro5.html Biologists were unanimous in agreeing that life starts at fertilization, and that there was no dispute in the scientific literature. Besides being a parody of science (i.e., that scientific facts are the objective truth and that all scientists agree what these facts mean), it is wrong. I have read a wide range of scientific positions on when life begins, and these positions depend on what aspect of life one privileges in such discussions. Here is my classification scheme concerning when human life begins. You may have others. 1. The metabolic view. There is no point when life begins. The sperm cell and egg cell are as alive as any other organism. 2. The genetic view. A new individual is created at fertilization. This is when the genes from the two parents combine to form an individual with unique properties. 3. The embryological view. In humans, identical twinning can occur as late as day 12 pc. Such twinning produces two individuals with different lives. Even conjoined ("Siamese") twins can have different personalities. Thus, a single individuality is not fixed earlier than day 12. (In religious terms, the two individuals have different souls). Some medical texts consider the stages before this time as a "pre-embryonic". This view is expressed by scientists such as Renfree (1982) and Grobstein (1988) and has been endorsed theologically by Ford (1988), Shannon and Wolter (1990), and McCormick (1991), among others. (Such a view would allow contraception, "morning after pills", and contragestational agents, but not abortion after two weeks). 4. The neurological view. Our society has defined death as the loss of the cerebral EEG (electroencephalogram) pattern. Conversely, some scientists have thought that the acquisition of the human EEG (at about 27 weeks) be defined as when a human life has begun. This view has been put forth most concretely by Morowitz and Trefil (1992). (This view and the ones following would allow mid-trimester abortions). 5. The ecological/technological view. This view sees the human life as beginning when it can exist separately from its maternal biological environment. The natural limit of viability occurs when the lungs mature, but technological advances can now enable a premature infant to survive at about 25 wks gestation. (This is the view currently operating in many states. Once a fetus can be potentially independent, it cannot be aborted). 6. The immunological view. This view sees human life as beginning when the organism recognizes the distinction between self and non-self. In humans, this occurs around the time of birth. 7. The integrated physiological view. This sees human life as beginning when it has become independent of the mother and has its own functioning circulatory system, alimentary system, and respiratory system. This is the traditional birthday when the baby is born into the world and the umbilical cord is cut. Carpe Diem Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #8 May 20, 2005 QuoteAbout 5 billion years ago? As today I already was called a smartass, let me follow that tradition: Question is: When DOES life begin? dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #9 May 20, 2005 QuoteQuoteAbout 5 billion years ago? As today I already was called a smartass, let me follow that tradition: Question is: When DOES life begin? uh,,,, 4 billion years ago? (actually, tonight when the door opens and I hear a loud rushing noise) ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,384 #10 May 20, 2005 > Just curoius what people think? It never stops. Your ovaries or testes are alive. Your sperm or egg cells are alive. An unfertilized pair is alive, as is a fertilized egg. Once the fetus begins development, _its_ ovaries or testes are alive - and it goes on forever. If the question is when does a fetus become human, I think it happens when it gains the one thing that makes us human - a mind. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #11 May 20, 2005 Quote> I think it happens when it gains the one thing that makes us human - solar cells and a hybrid car? ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,384 #12 May 20, 2005 >> I think it happens when it gains the one thing that makes us human - >solar cells and a hybrid car? Naah, a sub-100 sq ft main canopy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #13 May 20, 2005 Quote>> I think it happens when it gains the one thing that makes us human - >solar cells and a hybrid car? Naah, a sub-100 sq ft main canopy. Then I am likely never to really live Look, the clouds have cleared up - have a good weekend ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,381 #14 May 20, 2005 For me it began the day I moved out of my parents house."There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tink1717 2 #16 May 21, 2005 When the door on the Otter opens.Skydivers don't knock on Death's door. They ring the bell and runaway... It really pisses him off. -The World Famous Tink. (I never heard of you either!!) AA #2069 ASA#33 POPS#8808 Swooo 1717 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #17 May 21, 2005 Quote> Just curoius what people think? It never stops. Your ovaries or testes are alive. Your sperm or egg cells are alive. An unfertilized pair is alive, as is a fertilized egg. Once the fetus begins development, _its_ ovaries or testes are alive - and it goes on forever.. exactly... although i would qualify that as simple existence... QuoteWhen the door on the Otter opens. this is the Real answer... those who dont understand the difference have never really been alive....____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheAnvil 0 #18 May 21, 2005 Ditto. Vinny the Anvil on a sub-100 ft^2 main? Nooooooooooo way. I'll remain a sexy but weak-swoopin' JACKASS. My legs are stubby enough as is - they have enough problems. Vinny the Anvil Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL JACKASS POWER!!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 25 #19 May 21, 2005 Quote>> I think it happens when it gains the one thing that makes us human - >solar cells and a hybrid car? Naah, a sub-100 sq ft main canopy. Damn it. I'm never going to be human...-- Tom Aiello [email protected] SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tbrown 26 #20 May 21, 2005 Life begins in the back seat of the daddy's car. Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity ! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fallingchip 0 #21 May 22, 2005 QuoteLife begins in the back seat of the daddy's car. My momma told me life starts (at least mine) when salt is applied on the margartia glass.______________________________________________ "A radical man is a man with both feet firmly planted in the air." -Franklin Delano Roosevelt Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
justaflygirl 0 #22 May 22, 2005 well since I just turned 30, I have had a ton of people tell me that life begins at 30....LOL but really, IMHO, life begins at conception, thats were the magical thing takes place that eventually becomes another living breathing human... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kris 0 #23 May 22, 2005 QuoteMy legs are stubby enough as is - they have enough problems. Yeah, but c'mon, Vinny. Look at the positives! You get to save so much money on pants by buying shorts since they still come to your ankles anyway!Sky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #24 May 23, 2005 When there's grass on the wicket it's good to play cricket. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,384 #25 May 23, 2005 >>Naah, a sub-100 sq ft main canopy. >Damn it. I'm never going to be human... I'm almost human! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
