suicidal parachutists?

[happythoughts 0]

Once a student asked Buddha, "After I die, what will...(blah, blah, blah)?" Buddha replied, "After you have reached enlightenment, all your questions will fall away."

Not that the answer will be found, but the question will be unimportant.

Instead of studying religion and immersing yourself in philosophy, quit worrying about questions and go do some skydiving. The easiest way to stop worrying about dying is to become involved in living.

Invisible people aren't half as important as the ones that I see flying around me.

(edited for grammar)

[Jskydiver22 0]

Nice point! After a couple of PM's shot back and forth with him i eventually decided to forget about it and figured no matter which way i die, it really isnt up to me to decide what happens anyways.

--I don't even know enough to know that I dont know--

[darrenspooner 0]

Well, if accidental death from skydiving is suicide then every other non-illness-related death that ever occurred must be suicide. This means that everyone that died falling out of bed or slipping in the shower committed suicide because they didn't surround the bed in sponge and paint the bath in submarine paint. And all those that got run over committed suicide because they left their homes that day knowing there were cars on the road and so on.

This is a meaningless post, other than having the effect of irritating people.

Cheers mate.

[Darius11 12]

I like what Al Pachino says in the movie Heat in response to a guy saying he could get killed.


“You could get killed walking your doggy”

There is many things in life that put you in danger. If you think that way you should live in a bubble.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[EBSB52 0]

Quote

If we were suicidal, we wouldn't wear parachutes.

If we weren't at least partially suicidal we would golf.....

[EBSB52 0]

Quote

Im glad to see this thread is unlocked now....me and ying actually sent a few PM's back and forth about this subject. My opinion on this still is that if anyone went in with both handles pulled and did everything they could, that theres no way it could be considered suicide.

Anyone else?

How about the part before the pulling of the handles? Where does really dangerous activity end and suicide begin? Remember Harold and Maude from the 70's? That guy was suicidal but never died. I think the part people fail to think about here is subconscious behavior.

[EBSB52 0]

Quote

Where's Ron Schott when you REALLY need him (like here)?

Ying, I would hasten only to point out that there is a whole "sect" (is that a pallatable term?) with a sizeable membership of highly religious (at least from my point of view ...I am NOT a member)Christian Skydivers, quite "active" and organized called the Christian Skydivers Association.

You may want to check this link out:
http://hometown.aol.com/christskyd/

I would think that they would take serious issue to what you say here. As not even a member of that group, I know that I even do.

I have absolutely NO DEATH WISH, and my skydiving activities therefore by definition can in NO WAY that I see, be EVER deemed as suicide, or suicidal. I think you've got a pretty skewed point of view, for sure.

No one ever said that the human body should hurtle itself down a river in a white-water raft either for instance. So would you also be saying that anybody who just happened to perish doing that activity in turn also therefore just committed suicide?

-Grant

Geez, he's just pondering the issue! Burn him at the stake why don't you.... (intentional metaphor)

[brothermuff65 0]

Quote

In the place I'm writting from autumn and winter are a melancholic, thought provoking time. Recent (maybe not the newest but still fresh in our memory) event - death of one well-known and quite experienced skydiver in a simple main canopy malfunction situation - is an additional inspiration for pondering on certain matters. What's my point; Christianity is a religious system very popular in the world; have you ever considered parachuting in the context of Christian faith? I have. And you'd never guess what was the logical conclusion.... well, it seems that death during a parachute jump should be regarded as a.... suicide. How is that? It's very simple. No one forces anybody to become a pachachute jumper. One does it from his or her own free will and, what's more, purely for his or her own egoistic pleasure. Because, as we all well know, parachuting is highly pleasant, euphoricly adrenalinal, and generally mind-blowing. Nobody becomes a jumper because he or she has been forced to become one, or because of an inner need to help others, and everybody is perfectly aware of the fact that this particular sport can result in death or serious injury. How such unnecessary and advanced riskyness can be classified? How can we call our favourite leaving a well-funcioning plain, helicopter, glider, cliff or whatever one wishes to jump from? At best we can call it stupidity. At worst an indication of a self-destructive drive. And life according to Christians is a gift from God Himself, a gift which should be respected and which cannot be rejected. Anyone who dares to do it, will be cast into hell where he or she will suffer the eternal condemnation....
Whole this analysis leads to only one conclusion; people who kill themselves during a parachute jump should be treated as suicides and buried outside the cementaries.
What do you think?

are you out of your rabbit ass fucking mind we skydive because we very much have a life wish

till later have fun & love each other seeya mb65johnny gates

[njasshole 0]

You're actually thinking along fairly profound lines in this analysis. Your lack of familiarity with the skydiving community, however, has led you to make this wrongful key assumption: skydivers are anomic.

Though a certain degree of detachment from society's dominant norms and values might lead one to jumping, you deny in your analysis the distinct cohesiveness of skydiving subculture. It is this cohesiveness that discourages anomie and, by extension, prevents the egoistic suicide about which you've hypothesized.

See Emile Durkheim's writings on Egoistic Suicide in his 1897 book "Suicide", and read about the detachment from society required to provoke it. Then, compare that to the skydiving community's tenacity. You won't still believe we're suicidal.

[superwhuffo 0]

Quote

Quote

In the place I'm writting from autumn and winter are a melancholic, thought provoking time. Recent (maybe not the newest but still fresh in our memory) event - death of one well-known and quite experienced skydiver in a simple main canopy malfunction situation - is an additional inspiration for pondering on certain matters. What's my point; Christianity is a religious system very popular in the world; have you ever considered parachuting in the context of Christian faith? I have. And you'd never guess what was the logical conclusion.... well, it seems that death during a parachute jump should be regarded as a.... suicide. How is that? It's very simple. No one forces anybody to become a pachachute jumper. One does it from his or her own free will and, what's more, purely for his or her own egoistic pleasure. Because, as we all well know, parachuting is highly pleasant, euphoricly adrenalinal, and generally mind-blowing. Nobody becomes a jumper because he or she has been forced to become one, or because of an inner need to help others, and everybody is perfectly aware of the fact that this particular sport can result in death or serious injury. How such unnecessary and advanced riskyness can be classified? How can we call our favourite leaving a well-funcioning plain, helicopter, glider, cliff or whatever one wishes to jump from? At best we can call it stupidity. At worst an indication of a self-destructive drive. And life according to Christians is a gift from God Himself, a gift which should be respected and which cannot be rejected. Anyone who dares to do it, will be cast into hell where he or she will suffer the eternal condemnation....
Whole this analysis leads to only one conclusion; people who kill themselves during a parachute jump should be treated as suicides and buried outside the cementaries.
What do you think?

are you out of your rabbit ass fucking mind we skydive because we very much have a life wish

----------

First of all let me simply point out that all religions are created and invented by thought. Has it ever occurred to you that your belief system is nothing more, in truth, than a bunch of thought created nonsense? I will tell you that if it works for you and makes you happy, then that is your affair. I had a chance to do a skydive in 1980, but I chose not to because, being of an engineering background, I felt that the technology would get safer as time went on. I had done several other extreme sports, like cliff diving, snow skiing, repelling, racing motorcycles, and jumping the ramp on water skies, and rock climbing. I did not want to do a skydive until I felt confident in the technology and I then felt that I would have control over my destiny. The fact is I am a sober individual and I always wanted to fly and have had many dreams about flying. I was finally asked if I wanted to do a skydive by a friend of mine that happens to believe in these Christian beliefs, and, by the way, was afraid of heights. In fact he would not even jump off a 25 foot cliff into the water after many attempts to try to get him to do so (by his own wish). I finally got to fly (skydive) in September of 2001 and I have done over 2100 skydives since. My friend did one tandem skydive and never returned, mainly because of money. I am now an Accelerated Freefall Instructor and have a PRO Demonstration rating. Skydiving is in fact one of the safest sports that I have ever done, and all other extreme sports tend to make me nervous.
You should consider the possibility that it is possible to exit a plane and fly through the air like a bird without a single movement of thought, and to go beyond "self" while doing it. This simple means that there is no ego functioning on the skydive. Therefore "you" are gone. This is the true joy of a skydive...----------------------------------------

We take risk not to escape life, but to keep life from escaping._______________________
It is noble to teach oneself; it is still nobler to teach others. Mark Twain

[Fab 0]

Quote

If we weren't at least partially suicidal we would golf.....

Golf is a dangerous 'sport' dude. Do you know what happens if someome shashes a golfbol into your head? I would rather go skydiving...that is much much safer...at least then I can see the 'golfbal' coming towards me and I can take evasive action

------------------------------
Only 6 more days till I get my new rig
Three more weeks till riggers inspection and I can actually jump the damn thing

_______________________________________

[skreamer 1]

Quote

Invisible people aren't half as important as the ones that I see flying around me.

And the most important people are the ones flying around me that I can't see.

[superwhuffo 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

In the place I'm writting from autumn and winter are a melancholic, thought provoking time. Recent (maybe not the newest but still fresh in our memory) event - death of one well-known and quite experienced skydiver in a simple main canopy malfunction situation - is an additional inspiration for pondering on certain matters. What's my point; Christianity is a religious system very popular in the world; have you ever considered parachuting in the context of Christian faith? I have. And you'd never guess what was the logical conclusion.... well, it seems that death during a parachute jump should be regarded as a.... suicide. How is that? It's very simple. No one forces anybody to become a pachachute jumper. One does it from his or her own free will and, what's more, purely for his or her own egoistic pleasure. Because, as we all well know, parachuting is highly pleasant, euphoricly adrenalinal, and generally mind-blowing. Nobody becomes a jumper because he or she has been forced to become one, or because of an inner need to help others, and everybody is perfectly aware of the fact that this particular sport can result in death or serious injury. How such unnecessary and advanced riskyness can be classified? How can we call our favourite leaving a well-funcioning plain, helicopter, glider, cliff or whatever one wishes to jump from? At best we can call it stupidity. At worst an indication of a self-destructive drive. And life according to Christians is a gift from God Himself, a gift which should be respected and which cannot be rejected. Anyone who dares to do it, will be cast into hell where he or she will suffer the eternal condemnation....
Whole this analysis leads to only one conclusion; people who kill themselves during a parachute jump should be treated as suicides and buried outside the cementaries.
What do you think?

are you out of your rabbit ass fucking mind we skydive because we very much have a life wish

----------

First of all let me simply point out that all religions are created and invented by thought. Has it ever occurred to you that your belief system is nothing more, in truth, than a bunch of thought created nonsense? I will tell you that if it works for you and makes you happy, then that is your affair. I had a chance to do a skydive in 1980, but I chose not to because, being of an engineering background, I felt that the technology would get safer as time went on. I had done several other extreme sports, like cliff diving, snow skiing, repelling, racing motorcycles, and jumping the ramp on water skies, and rock climbing. I did not want to do a skydive until I felt confident in the technology and I then felt that I would have control over my destiny. The fact is I am a sober individual and I always wanted to fly and have had many dreams about flying. I was finally asked if I wanted to do a skydive by a friend of mine that happens to believe in these Christian beliefs, and, by the way, was afraid of heights. In fact he would not even jump off a 25 foot cliff into the water after many attempts to try to get him to do so (by his own wish). I finally got to fly (skydive) in September of 2001 and I have done over 2100 skydives since. My friend did one tandem skydive and never returned, mainly because of money. I am now an Accelerated Freefall Instructor and have a PRO Demonstration rating. Skydiving is in fact one of the safest sports that I have ever done, and all other extreme sports tend to make me nervous.
You should consider the possibility that it is possible to exit a plane and fly through the air like a bird without a single movement of thought, and to go beyond "self" while doing it. This simple means that there is no ego functioning on the skydive. Therefore "you" are gone. This is the true joy of a skydive...----------------------------------------

I should also point out that when I went out with this big biker dude that may or may not have had a death wish because he was going to prison for six years, (I found out after the fact) and did nothing right on this skydive and it was a flopping and spinning mess, and the only thing that I could do when left alone with this nut in his panic mode and on the reserve side was to put him under a big yellow parachute. Not only does this prove that I was not suicidal, but I even went though great risk to save another person's life and he thanked me for it. I have never had a student that I trained get hurt in any way. How can teaching others to do a creative thing live flying and being concerned that they do it safely have anything whatsoever to do with "suicide". I worry that the person that wrote this nonsense may be in the confused and unrealistic state of mind and of the type mind-set that may someday commit suicide. I wonder how many people with these strange belief sytems have committed suicide? I know of many. People that live in the realm of the "what is" and are just simply intelligent people with goodness and love, will never commit the ultimate sacrifice by intentionally killing themselves.
---------------------------

We take risk not to escape life, but to keep life from escaping._______________________
It is noble to teach oneself; it is still nobler to teach others. Mark Twain

[wildWilly 0]

I think if that's the conclusion you have come to then there will be one less membership check going out this year.
People that kill themselves skydiving ( unintentionally) have no desire to die doing what they love. They have been properly trained, using the latest technology in gear and have every intention of doing it many more times. But sometimes shit happens.
If we followed your line of thinking we wouldn't even take a comercial airline flight to our favourite holiday spot because it's too risty to get on a plane and risk our precious lifes.
I don't think too many christian sky divers will be giving up the sport.


Willy

growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional.

[Newbie 0]

Don't feed the troll.

The one other post this person has put up here, in reponse to: "how did you get into skydiving".

Quote

My boyfriend dumped me. I got depressed and wanted to hurt myself. It took me 60 seconds to forget the bastard :)

"Skydiving is a door"
Happythoughts

[ying 0]

Hi everyone! :)

I’ve postponed answering to you because i’ve waited until a few posts accumulate to send one big reply that will explain it all. Of course i doubt whether i manage to convince you writing only once but then it’s quite a challenge to try :)

First of all, i want to thank you for your involvment. It’s very kind that you decided to spend some of your precious time reading my post and writing to me. I certainly do appreciate it.

Second of all let me tell you something about myself; if you call a troll a person who comes up with a controversial subject then obviously i am someone like that. What’s more, i trully LOVE controversial subjects – not only those i invent but all. I find them inspiring. They enrich me and let me know myself better. How come you consider it a negative thing? However your judgement, you should be aware that the very process in which you classify my subject as controversial takes place in your minds :) Therefore it is YOU who’s the real source of controversy here. Does this mean YOU are the trolls? ;) Zen masters say: IF THE MIND IS PURE – THE WORLD IS ALSO PURE :)

But let me now stop digressing and get to the point.

Belgian Skygirl, Superwhuffo; who said i’m Christian?

Op5e; the fact who i am has nothing or very little to do with the subject of this discussion. Especially you don’t know me and we will probably never meet.

Tdog; so what that i’ve just registered? So what i have only 2 posts? Does it matter? How does it influence the things i write? Don’t try to scare me. I’m not affraid of you. If you want a good fight then confront me intellectually. If you dare :)

Salsa John; be informed that i am na authentic Polish skydiver and a holder of a FAI licence. I’m in the sport for a few years now. Aren’t you too confident with posting evidenceless suspicions on others?

Dbcooper; I’m affraid that you mistake ying for yin. Ying is not the element complementary to yang. It is an ordinary Chinese noun with not much symbolic meaning. As far as i know at least.

Skybill; oh, are you really that great? And you say people just keep staring at you with their mouths agape? :) Tell us do you get a kick out of it? :) You’re probably very proud of yourself. Wow, 40 years of jumping, what an achievement! Mother Theresa compared to you is just no-one.

Happythoughts; have you ever heard of koans, the riddles (such as the Gateless Gate for instance) that help to achieve the enlightment? From what you wrote one could assume that buddhism encourages thoughtlessness. And this is not true. There is a difference between deliberate simplicity and ignorance, don’t you think? And from the second paragraph of your post (“Invisible people aren’t half as important as the ones that i see flying”) it is clear that you cite buddhist texts but you don’t get the basics of buddhist teachings which says that ALL creatures are important.

Njasshole; not all siucides are egoistic. Remember Christ? Or a priest called Maksymilian Kolbe who went to death intead of the prisoner from his cell in Aushwitz? Will you tell me they were egoistic? Or the samurai, although what they did was quite different to what Christ and Kolbe did. Suicide is a way to complex phenomenon to be simply classified as egoism. But that’s a whole different subject. Perhaps i will post it on this forum someday.

Tink1717, op5e, salsa john, chrisL, slotperfect, fab, drew, jskydiver22, nightingale, scrumpot, michelle, derrenspooner, brothermuff65, superwhuffo; even if parachuting doesn’t fit our human definition of suicide WHAT can possibly stop God from taking it as suicide anyway? And don’t tell me you don’t believe in God – any slightly intelligent person knows we can’t be sure He doesn’t exist. But never mind that. You see, the thing is that suicide actually fits the definition. Because suicide can be defined as “deliberate involving of onself in an action and/ or exposing oneself to a phenomenon that can cause death”. Can you deny that parachuting can kill you? Can you deny that you are fully aware of that? I don’t think so. Ergo parachuting = suicide. Just as driving a car, eating junk-food, smoking and even brathing because this process causes our cells to oxidize which is, well, unhealthy. Perhaps God is malicious and deliberately designed it all so that everybody went to Hell? Have you considered such an option? :)

Ebsb52; you’re the only one (out of people who posted here) who’s taken the subconscious factor into consideration. On my local forum (which has more or less 200 users who regularily visit it) i received around 250 answers and no-one mentioned what you have mentioned. I congratulate you :) But since this post is quite long arleady i will leave the issue of subconsciousness for the next time. Though then maybe it won’t be necessary. Maybe all doubts have perished already? ;) Regards,

ying.

[Newbie 0]

I cannot be the only person that finds this playground philosophy offensive, surely?

Suicide CANNOT be defined as “deliberate involving of onself in an action and/ or exposing oneself to a phenomenon that can cause death” as you say, rather it is "the act or an instance of taking one's own life voluntarily and intentionally especially by a person of years of discretion and of sound mind" (Webster).

Just because i cross the road, thereby potentially being susceptible to being hit by a car or bus means i'm putting myself in a dangerous position, therefore i'm trying to commit suicide by your reasoning.

You say you are a skydiver. You realise then that even if we do everything right on a skydive, we can still die. So how can you post something so insensitive as "people who kill themselves during a parachute jump should be treated as suicides and buried outside the cementaries" even if just trying to provoke "intellectual" conversation? What about people who die trying to save themselves, do they qualify as the suicide squad? When someone doesn't come back from a jump, it is incredibly saddening to those left to pick up the pieces. But according to you, they meant to kill themselves, or that, at least, is something we should consider, due to the fact we are doing something more risky than sitting inside waiting to die, right? And we should throw the idea out there that, even if you don't believe in it, that perhaps those people should be buried "outside the cemetaries"? What sort of "intellectual discussion" are you trying to come up with here?

If you truly are a skydiver, i would look at what you are doing in this sport, particularly in light of your reasoning for being here, according to your other post on the foums (wanting to "hurt yourself" because you were dumped in a relationship), and would also think about talking to someone about whats on your mind. I'm done here, i've risen to this way more than i wanted to.

"Skydiving is a door"
Happythoughts

[EBSB52 0]

Quote

I cannot be the only person that finds this playground philosophy offensive, surely?

Suicide CANNOT be defined as “deliberate involving of onself in an action and/ or exposing oneself to a phenomenon that can cause death” as you say, rather it is "the act or an instance of taking one's own life voluntarily and intentionally especially by a person of years of discretion and of sound mind" (Webster).

Just because i cross the road, thereby potentially being susceptible to being hit by a car or bus means i'm putting myself in a dangerous position, therefore i'm trying to commit suicide by your reasoning.

You say you are a skydiver. You realise then that even if we do everything right on a skydive, we can still die. So how can you post something so insensitive as "people who kill themselves during a parachute jump should be treated as suicides and buried outside the cementaries" even if just trying to provoke "intellectual" conversation? What about people who die trying to save themselves, do they qualify as the suicide squad? When someone doesn't come back from a jump, it is incredibly saddening to those left to pick up the pieces. But according to you, they meant to kill themselves, or that, at least, is something we should consider, due to the fact we are doing something more risky than sitting inside waiting to die, right? And we should throw the idea out there that, even if you don't believe in it, that perhaps those people should be buried "outside the cemetaries"? What sort of "intellectual discussion" are you trying to come up with here?

If you truly are a skydiver, i would look at what you are doing in this sport, particularly in light of your reasoning for being here, according to your other post on the foums (wanting to "hurt yourself" because you were dumped in a relationship), and would also think about talking to someone about whats on your mind. I'm done here, i've risen to this way more than i wanted to.

Things aren't black and white. Attending highly dangerous activity can be defined as an attampt to kill yourself IMO.

How about this, hook turns kill about 1/2 of the skydivers some years, right? So are those people just pushingthe limits, or are they fucking with death? I think the latter, which carries a suicidal component.

[happythoughts 0]

Quote

Happythoughts; have you ever heard of koans, the riddles (such as the Gateless Gate for instance) that help to achieve the enlightment?

This was not a koan. The purpose of koans is to provoke thought. I thought I was pretty straight forward.

You are theorizing about the relationship between skydiving and suicidal thoughts. I told you to go out and do some skydives yourself, then see how you felt. Your questions would be answered or the questions would no longer matter.

Basically, people have been providing you with direct answers to your question, yet you refuse to accept the answers. If you refuse to learn from others, I wanted you to learn from yourself.

Quote

And from the second paragraph of your post (“Invisible people aren’t half as important as the ones that i see flying”) it is clear that you cite buddhist texts but you don’t get the basics of buddhist teachings which says that ALL creatures are important.

First, that isn't a Buddhist text, it is what I say about crazy people pushing shopping carts and talking to invisible people. I also think that it is crazy to talk to an invisible deity on a daily basis about what will happen when I die. The people that I see flying around me are other skydivers. My point was, skydivers are more important to me than invisible gods.

Quote

if you call a troll a person who comes up with a controversial subject then obviously i am someone like that. What’s more, i trully LOVE controversial subjects –

Nope, lots of people discuss controversial topics. You are being called a troll because you don't really care about the topic, just how much provocation you can create.

If you really wanted to discuss or learn, people have given you information. It is obvious that you are not really interested in the answers to your questions, just the effect. That is sad. I never could understand why trolls get amusement from causing anger.

Quote

Zen masters say: IF THE MIND IS PURE – THE WORLD IS ALSO PURE :)

Zen masters said a lot of crap too. It is easy to sit on a hilltop and puke out nebulous sayings. Hiding from life, and discussing it in an abstract sense, is a poor substitute for being alive.

Skydivers are all about being alive.

[superwhuffo 0]

This thread is so far out there that there is no reason to continue it.

We take risk not to escape life, but to keep life from escaping._______________________
It is noble to teach oneself; it is still nobler to teach others. Mark Twain

[justinb138 0]

Sudicide - N. The act or an instance of intentionally killing oneself.

skydive - v : jump from an airplane and perform various maneuvers before opening one's parachute.

I don't see how they are related at all.

Ying - Go make yourself useful.

[ying 0]

superwuffo, justinb138; about you dictionary definitions of suicide; try thinking out of the box. If you do you'll see that i'm right. Be creative. Don't rely on other people's standards. It's intellectual lazyness. Remember Emerson?

superwhuffo; I guess that you belong to people who get angry watching the movie Fight Club :) if you find offensive what i write i suggest that you read the 4th paragraph of my previous post again.

It's extremely nice of you that you worry about me. But let me reassure you - currently i have absolutely no depression related problems. My brain is in perfect chemical balance :)

happythoughts; the number of mistakes you've made in your last post is just unbelieveable. What you previously said can be summed up as don't think - skydive. And you used a buddhist story of a student asking Buddha a question to back it up. The story was not a koan of course. I mentioned koans because from what you said one could think that buddhism encourages thoughtlessness. And the Gateless Gate IS a collection of koans. So what you meant saying "This was not a koan"?

As far as your advice is concerned; each time i skydive i get more convinced that it's suicide driven.

I certainly do not refuse to lear from others but does the fact that people answered me means that i have to automatically get convinced by what they say? The replies i received are NOT convincing in my opinion.

I didn't say, that your statement “Invisible people aren’t half as important as the ones that i see flying” is Buddhist. But the story about Buddha and the student IS. Don't try to tell me that you meant that "skydivers are more important than invisible gods". You said "invisible people" and people are NOT gods as far as i know. But even if somehow you really meant "gods" saying "people" you should know that according to buddhism gods are also feelig creatures and therefore they are also important.

I didn't say it is only me who loves controversial subjects. And don't tell me what i really care about because you cannot know it. What i'm interested in is DISCUSSION and your arguments. I read all answers very carefully and polemize with them. The fact that i don't give up and keep writing doesn't make me a troll.

How do you know that i hide from life? You don't know me, you've never even seen me. Your accusations are completely evidenceless.

Okay, the subconscious factor next time. Regards,

ying.

[justinb138 0]

superwuffo, justinb138; about you dictionary definitions of suicide; try thinking out of the box.


You mean make up my own definition to fit the argument? That's what you seem to be doing.


If you do you'll see that i'm right. Be creative.

Its a possibility, but I doubt it. I'll be creative, but not delusional.


Don't rely on other people's standards. It's intellectual lazyness. Remember Emerson?


No, only Emerson I know makes VCRs. I am "intellectually lazy" and I enjoy it. If you wern't you probably would spell-check your posts.


superwhuffo; I guess that you belong to people who get angry watching the movie Fight Club :)


Good Movie.


if you find offensive what i write i suggest that you read the 4th paragraph of my previous post again.


Don't care to read that.


It's extremely nice of you that you worry about me.


I don't give a shit about you, don't kid yourself


But let me reassure you - currently i have absolutely no depression related problems. My brain is in perfect chemical balance :)


Yeah... umm. That's questionable. I'll believe it when I see a psych eval.


happythoughts; the number of mistakes you've made in your last post is just unbelieveable.


You know how many times you didn't capitalize "I" in the past few sentences? What's your point?


What you previously said can be summed up as don't think - skydive.


I agree, overthinking anything takes the fun out of it. Just do it and enjoy it.


And you used a buddhist story of a student asking Buddha a question to back it up. The story was not a koan of course.


Who cares?


I mentioned koans because from what you said one could think that buddhism encourages thoughtlessness. And the Gateless Gate IS a collection of koans. So what you meant saying "This was not a koan"?

As far as your advice is concerned; each time i skydive i get more convinced that it's suicide driven.


So don't Skydive, and let the rest of us enjoy it without all your complaining. No one is going to call you a wimp for quitting, so don't come here and look for justification to do so, just say you don't enjoy it and move on. Go sit on your couch and watch tv, or play golf, just find something you do enjoy and do it.



I certainly do not refuse to lear from others but does the fact that people answered me means that i have to automatically get convinced by what they say? The replies i received are NOT convincing in my opinion.


No one cares about your opinion, even if it is illogical.


I didn't say, that your statement “Invisible people aren’t half as important as the ones that i see flying” is Buddhist. But the story about Buddha and the student IS. Don't try to tell me that you meant that "skydivers are more important than invisible gods". You said "invisible people" and people are NOT gods as far as i know. But even if somehow you really meant "gods" saying "people" you should know that according to buddhism gods are also feelig creatures and therefore they are also important.

I didn't say it is only me who loves controversial subjects. And don't tell me what i really care about because you cannot know it. What i'm interested in is DISCUSSION and your arguments. I read all answers very carefully and polemize with them. The fact that i don't give up and keep writing doesn't make me a troll.


Ignoring good explanations hoping to get the absurd answer you came here looking for does.


How do you know that i hide from life? You don't know me, you've never even seen me. Your accusations are completely evidenceless.


I don't know anything about you, nor do I wish to, nor do I care. Happy?



Your reasoning is flawed, good luck finding someone to disagree with that.

[billvon 2,380]

>each time i skydive i get more convinced that it's suicide driven.

Been jumping with Luigi?

Seriously, if you feel that, you're jumping with the wrong people. At the places I frequent, we spend a LOT of time talking about how not to die on a skydive. The idea is to jump without having it be fatal; it's less suicidal than smoking or drinking to excess.

[Michele 1]

ying, I again assert that you have no idea what suicide is and is not. I'd suggest you start learning a bit more about that, and then rethink your positions posted here.

Like was said, if you don't want to skydive, don't....just don't cloak it in the delusion that skydiving is suicidal. At least be honest with yourself, if you can't be honest with us. Intellectual honesty is the only way to live your life, and to learn about yourself.

Ciels-
Michele

~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~