USA is the World's SOB!

[Erroll 49]

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Well, Ron, come on. It's common knowledge that one of the reasons the U.S.A. disregards and has contempt for the rest of the world is because the rest of the world is cheap and petty!

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And you are curious as to the 'glee' ?

[Ron 7]

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Ron, I am the first to admit that it is cheap and petty. My initial reaction was a knee-jerk to what I perceived as arrogance. Read my second post again....

Sorry didn't see the second post.

But still, I can admit that at times the Us can be arrogant...But so can every other country.

I was ashamed when our Gold medalists acted like jackasses back in 1996....But then again...Hell it would be hard to contain myself if I just won.

America gets a bad rap cause we are so big and have so much.

We are easy to see cause we are in the spot light.

Assuming all Americans are arrogant is like assuming all SA are racist, Englishmen are pale and weak, Germans are all drunks, or Commies are "Evil".

It's wrong.

The French however are still cowards

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[Erroll 49]

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Assuming all Americans are arrogant is like assuming all SA are racist, Englishmen are pale and weak, Germans are all drunks, or Commies are "Evil".

It's wrong.

Agreed.

[Skyrad 0]

Really.........Puleeeze! What a load of crap. America is very far from being the utopian society that you make it sound. I can't even spare the time to list the crimes committed by the USA around the world and in its own back yard since its formation. Or mention its piss poor record on human rights for its own people or the criminal way it abuses the worlds resources. I laugh when they came third along with most people I know. As for 'taking a hit' get a sence of perspective, its a swim race America isn't some holy land beyond having the piss taken out of it, you guys like to dish but you just can't take it can you?

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[TomAiello 25]

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I can attest to that. I was really looking forward to the Phelps/Thorpe contests but when Phelps started his 8-medal stories I could not help but think how arrogant that was. When we (SA) took the gold I was obviously very proud and excited (and surprised!) but it was also with glee that I took note of the Amrican team's poor performance. I also could not help thinking 'It serves you right' when Phelps only got bronze in the freestyle last night.

Huh? I haven't seen Phelps say anything but "I came here just wanting one medal." Not even a gold medal--just a medal. I think he comes across as reasonably sincere, and fairly humble--definitely not full of himself.

I think that anyone who thought that Phelps (an IMer) was going to seriously contend in the Free was being drawn into the media hype (which I don't think was created by Phelps). I mean, come on. Thorpe has swum a full second and a half faster than anyone else, ever in the 200 free. You expected him to lose? Personally, I was hoping to see someone smoke in from lane 8, but I'd still have preferred to see Hackett or van den Hoogenband win.

On that note, and back to the original discussion, I wish the press had payed a little more attention to Klete Keller's anchor of the 4x200 free relay. Now _that_ was the swim of a lifetime. Holding off the reigning world record holder, despite losing virtually all of his lead in the first 50 meters. I was definitely pulling for Keller. Not because he was an American, but because he was the underdog.

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[Botellines 0]

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There is a saying I heard recently from a friend whose passport is so stamped it's thick as a book: "I've seen a lot of places and traveled all over the world, but one thing holds true: There's America, and then there's everywhere else."

If his passport is so stamped it is thick as a book, most likely (I could be wrong though) he has not spend much time in any of those places.

Maybe that's because it quickly became apparent that being in those places sucked compared to being in America.

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Have you ever left the U.S.A? I am not talking about going on vacations with mammy and daddy down to mexico. I am talking about living for a period of time outside your country. Honest question, BTW.

[Kennedy 0]

Chicken....egg, egg....chicken.

Oh wait, that's not right.

Pot....kettle, kettle.... pot

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[Ron 7]

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America is very far from being the utopian society that you make it sound. I can't even spare the time to list the crimes committed by the USA around the world and in its own back yard since its formation. Or mention its piss poor record on human rights for its own people or the criminal way it abuses the worlds resources.

If you do find the time please list Jolly old England as well and few other countries.

1. No country is perfect.
2. Pride in your country is good.
3. Being blind and thinking your country is perfect is bad.

We ALL are proud and it is easy to point out how other countries have problems.

The simple fact is that if you are not proud of your country....There might be something wrong with you.

Also if you HATE a country and have not spent time there...There is probley something wrong with you.

Its easy to point out others problems.

The French however are still free game

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[christelsabine 1]

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...that as "arrogant" as we are supposed to be, we remain incredibly hospitable to people from nations all over the world to come and live and work here, and make their fortunes and...

.. become better, more educated, more happy people.

You're kidding or what? More educated? Compared with what ??

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We throw our doors open wide and welcome everyone, and still we take shit from people who hate us because of their own blindness to our goodness.

Dear Lord,just fell down on my knees: Where did you read that? (Fairy Tales at the hair dresser, right ?)

Today soap for breakfast?

Just feel tears rolling down my cheeks reading that.

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So, a free education in the U.S., and we're still arrogant elitists, right?

Do not combine "arrogant" with "elitists": Who said "elitists"??

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Maybe we should be flattered by the fact that everyone holds us to a higher standard than the rest of the world.

Everyone? Who?? Higher standard? : What? where?

dudeist skydiver # 3105

[PhillyKev 0]

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You're kidding or what? More educated? Compared with what ??

Well, we may not have the best public school education but we do have the top rated higher education in the world.

[christelsabine 1]

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But still, I can admit that at times the Us can be arrogant...But so can every other country.

I was ashamed when our Gold medalists acted like jackasses back in 1996....But then again...Hell it would be hard to contain myself if I just won.

America gets a bad rap cause we are so big and have so much.

We are easy to see cause we are in the spot light.

Assuming all Americans are arrogant is like assuming all SA are racist, Englishmen are pale and weak, Germans are all drunks, or Commies are "Evil".

It's wrong.

Ron, what the hell happend to you? You sound so, so - how to explain? - peaceful, appreciative

I was so prepared to jump on your words "Germans are all drunk"..., impossible to me now!

BTS: Brits and Scaninavians and Japanese and (Americans) and .... are bigger drinkers!

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The French however are still cowards

No. No way! (But that's another story )

Christel

dudeist skydiver # 3105

[Kennedy 0]

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...that as "arrogant" as we are supposed to be, we remain incredibly hospitable to people from nations all over the world to come and live and work here, and make their fortunes and...

.. become better, more educated, more happy people.

You're kidding or what? More educated? Compared with what ??

Let's not forget that the US has the best higher education in the world. People come here in huge numbers to study medicine, law, computers, and a host of other advanced topics.
(in far greater ratios than people from here travel abroad to learn)

witty subliminal message
Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards.
1*

[Botellines 0]

Any link that proves that?

[nacmacfeegle 0]

"Any link that proves that?"

Depends on how you want to measure quality of education..
http://www.nationmaster.com/cat/Education
Loads of statistics here, fill your boots.
Its a pretty good site, but some folks just don't like it, can't think why.

With due respect to our colonial cousins, just because its popular, IE people sending their kids from abroad, doesn't mean its effective.

Some stats show the USA up top, others show a different picture.
Statistics..depends what you measure, how you measure it, and how you report it.

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He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson

[crozby 0]

How trustworthy is that site?

It seems to indicate that gun related crime is higher per-capita in the US than the UK.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/cri_mur_wit_fir_cap

[nacmacfeegle 0]

Trustworthy?
"NationMaster is a vast compilation of data from such sources as the CIA World Factbook, United Nations, World Health Organization, World Bank, World Resources Institute, UNESCO, UNICEF and OECD."
>edit to add, the source for that particular stat for example is from "Seventh United Nations Survey of Crime Trends and Operations of Criminal Justice Systems, covering the period 1998 - 2000 (United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime, Centre for International Crime Prevention)"<

Of course its open to challenge, and the data is not necessarily up to date, some stats I've seen there are 5 years old.
If anyone has a similar comparative site, I'd be glad to refer to that in the future.

"It seems to indicate that gun related crime is higher per-capita in the US than the UK."

Hard to swallow isn't it?
Thats my opinion too, gun related murder isn't particularly high over here, despite the howls of disbelief from the Hoplophiles.

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He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson

[Erroll 49]

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First let me give a HUGE congratulations to your SA Gold Medalist! That swim was awesome!

On the issue of Phelps, however....it wasn't him that said he was going for 8 Golds and a record. That was media speculation and hype. They wanted us to believe Phelps was on that mission of his own words and accord. Nada. It was -their- need to create a story (and ratings).

ltdiver

Thank you for the nice sentiments, Lori.

As for Phelps, I'm over him! He is a brilliant young swimmer with a bright future ahead of him and I will follow his career with interest.

A bit of irony regarding this whole issue:- To my knowledge three of the four South Africans in that relay team are on sholarships...... IN THE US of A!

The youngster won more medals by himself than the entire SA team did. Well done! That goes for the whole US Olympic team too - good show!

[Erroll 49]

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First let me give a HUGE congratulations to your SA Gold Medalists! That swim was awesome!

Last night showed that the Olympic Gold was no fluke either! And with a Commonwealth Record for good measure!

[tbrown 26]

Makes me think about how this World Baseball Championship is going, now that the US has been eliminated after losing to BOTH Canada and Mexico.

The Semifinalists now are Japan Vs South Korea and CUBA (oh God no ! Not Cuba ! Aren't they a bunch of Commies or sumpin' ?!?), uh that's Cuba Vs. Dominican Republic.

My guess is that this will be the first, last & only time this fiasco is ever attempted on American soil. By this time next year it will not only NOT be played a second time, but Major League Baseball will be denying that this year's series ever even took place.

Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity !

[Trent 0]

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Makes me think about how this World Baseball Championship is going, now that the US has been eliminated after losing to BOTH Canada and Mexico.

Actually it was Korea and Mexico that beat the US this year. And guess what? The US deserved it. Our pro players (with some exceptions) are too great either in contract size or ego to play for the US Team... soooo... we don't ever get the real "best" team to represent us. Sad... but hey... Jeter and Clemens were out there trying!

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The Semifinalists now are Japan Vs South Korea and CUBA (oh God no ! Not Cuba ! Aren't they a bunch of Commies or sumpin' ?!?), uh that's Cuba Vs. Dominican Republic.

Korea will dominate on everyone. They're the only undefeated team out there. Cuba will get destroyed by the DR like they did once already. Communists or not... they just have a young and weak team. What WAS interesting was all the protests against Cuba and Castro at the games though. Funny.

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My guess is that this will be the first, last & only time this fiasco is ever attempted on American soil. By this time next year it will not only NOT be played a second time, but Major League Baseball will be denying that this year's series ever even took place.

Why would it be any different next year? The US rarely wins anything at the Olympics in baseball either... they don't deny that. You're assuming too much pride on the US Team's part. The fact is... not a lot of people care... including the athletes that SHOULD be on the US team.

Oh, hello again!

[Erroll 49]

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... He is a brilliant young swimmer with a bright future ahead of him and I will follow his career with interest.

He has matured into the best Olympian of all time. Great stuff!.

[shropshire 0]

He is no doubt an excellent athlete but to label anyone the Greatest Olympian on medal count alone is a shallow accolade.

We do have this tendency to need to pigeon hole folks and raise them on pedestals and for what?

The ethics of the games have a wider remit than to raise a single person to such a postion. They set out to embrace a wider audiance, to recognise each individuals commitment and pursuit of excellence in them selves. To cherish and applaud a high degree of sportmanship and gamesmanship. Not to concentrate of medal counts alone but to appreciate the sum total of all of the effort and skills involved. To cheer on rivals not belittle them, to be defiant in defeat and magnanimous in victory. To raise standards and encourage the next generation and support them in the spirit of games. It's not just the taking part, it's how you take part that counts.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[Guest]

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Just a few points:

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- The antics and arrogance of some US athletes (e.g. the 4*100 M track relay in Sydney and the “dream teams” behaviour and special treatment) do not endear the US team to spectators from other Nations.

- It is quite common (and natural) that people think that the place (country/state) they come from is the best place on Earth. However, it seems to me that many Americans have strong “tunnel vision” when it comes to other countries and cultures – i.e. are less interested and accepting.

- This attitude does perpetuate a perception of American arrogance and disrespect to other athletes/countries, hence why Americans are not very well liked by many.

- Before complaining that America is the SOB of the world, Americans might want to ask themselves why that is. And if your answer is that the reason is “envy” (i.e. America is so much better then everything else) – then you are part of the reason why so many are “rooting” against the Americans – arrogance.

That's too easy and cheap of a shot to make.

Most Americans simply don't have the exposure to other countries, languages, cultures, etc. because of geographic isolation, and for no other reason.

Where I'm stationed, for example, there are 7 countries (Bosnia, Croatia, Serbia, Montenegro, Macedonia, Bulgaria, Greece) less than 6 hours' driving distance away - just pick a direction. Mainland Europe (starting with Italy) is only an hour away by air.

Contrast this with the US. Most people live on the coasts or in the interior (Red State "Flyover Country") and not near the borders.

Exposure to different languages, customs, ideas, etc. doesn't happen by watching the Discovery Channel or reading a book. It happens by getting out there, something most Americans don't get to experience because they can't afford it or are just too busy working and trying not to lose their homes.

So, please don't be so quick to condemn us as arrogant, it's all I ask. Ignorant, however - yeah, I'll buy that.

mh
.

"The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat."

[Erroll 49]

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He is no doubt an excellent athlete but to label anyone the Greatest Olympian on medal count alone is a shallow accolade.

I had no intention to spark a philosophical debate!. I merely wanted to confirm my intention four years ago to follow his career with interest, and I applaud his success.

[crozby 0]

... I wonder what became of peacefuljeffrey ...