M2 vs vigil 2+

[gowlerk 1,903]

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It's worse than that. You are going off the mandatory replacement at 10 years but the battery info provided by vigil (off the top of my head) is "at least 5 years" or 2000 jumps but factory mandated at 10 years. I'm kind of concerned about that. The disparity between 2000 jumps and 15000 jumps is pretty significant and a lofty claim. That would make it by far the longest lasting battery of any AAD afaik

It is indeed a very lofty claim. And one that very few units will ever get a chance to test. But not that hard for the manufacturer to test. Relatively easy to cycle it up and down 15000 times. But without the benefit of aging it. I do know that it has the ability to give you a readout of the percentage of battery remaining. I consider it unlikely that I will ever be able to do enough jumps to test it's limits. Even the most active of jumpers don't do 1000 jumps a year for years on end.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[mcordell 2]

but exceeding the 2000 jump guarantee on the vigil battery well within the 5-10 year life span is not uncommon. That means during the 20 years you have the unit it's not necessarily unlikely to go through 3 or 4 batteries whereas the M2 is sold as having a battery to last 15 years so the maintenance costs of the vigil are much higher. When you add that to the cost of the unit, the cost of ownership is higher. I just wonder if that cost is worth it or if the M2 is legitimately a better deal. I guess it is too soon to tell if they will stand up to 15 years of use.

www.facebook.com/FlintHillsRigging

[sammielu 3]

I bought an M2 a year ago and am happy. It was less expensive on an annual basis (lifespan + services required), it doesn't have scheduled service time where my rig will be down (and I have to pay my rigger for installation each time) and it was available on-site from a local dealer (saving shipping $ and time).

The way I figure, there is the possibility for an error or a service recall with any product, so that factor is a wash between any AAD. In my experience, this year, multiple new Vigils have had issues requiring sending them in for service or replacement, and I don't know of one example of that happening with a M2. $999 well spent for me.

[tsf 0]

sammielu

The way I figure, there is the possibility for an error or a service recall with any product, so that factor is a wash between any AAD. In my experience, this year, multiple new Vigils have had issues requiring sending them in for service or replacement, and I don't know of one example of that happening with a M2. $999 well spent for me.

The factor isn't a wash just because it can happen with any product (that logic would make almost all factors a wash). You have to consider which product is more likely to have an error or service recall. And if you're just looking at the raw # of reported errors, you also have to factor in sample size (there are a LOT more Vigil II's out there). And if you say "who cares, an error is an error," then consider that your M2 could have an error but it might not get caught because the sample size is small and nothing gets reported.

99% of people that are happy with their particular AAD are NOT happy because it worked as intended for its critical application (as in it fired when exactly when they needed it to). They are happy because it didn't misfire, it hasn't had any errors, and it hasn't had to be recalled. Something to consider when someone says they love their brand X AAD.

[erdnarob 1]

The battery life of a Vigil 2 is 5-7 years or 2000 jumps.

Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

[gowlerk 1,903]

Cut and pasted from page 23 of the Vigil 2 manual....

---------------------------------------------------------------

"The battery’s life span is expected to be a minimum of 5 years, or 2000 jumps. When the «Bat Low» or
«Bat Rpl» message appears, the battery pack needs to be replaced (see chapter 7).
Regardless of the above-stated life span, the battery pack must be replaced after 10 years of use
(max. operational lifetime)."

---------------------------------------------------------------


The batteries are now generally expected to last the full 10 years for most units. But could be less for some. 2000 jumps is not a limit to their life, it is the estimated minimum life expectancy.

Always remember the brave children who died defending your right to bear arms. Freedom is not free.

[piisfish 135]

erdnarob

The battery life of a Vigil 2 is 5-7 years or 2000 jumps.

that last one is under 4 years and under 400 jumps

scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM

[hillson 0]

piisfish

***The battery life of a Vigil 2 is 5-7 years or 2000 jumps.

that last one is under 4 years and under 400 jumps
Just avoid static discharge, right? I kid, I kid.

To the OP: if you're considering a vigil you can get a cypres for damned near the same price. They're 1325-1350 through para gear the last time I checked. Not much more than a vigil.

I have a vigil fwiw. I'd buy another one. If I had to buy a new battery at 2000 jumps no biggie. If I had to send a cypres in for service every 4 years...no biggie. In the grand scheme of things it is a small expense considering the amount of money we spend for jumping and gear. A few hundred Bucks four years from now or 2000 jumps from now is small peanuts. It isn't like I'm swimming in cash either. Just the cost associated with a aad.

If you're getting paid to jump...just write that shit off.

[mattjw916 2]

Yeah, I think the amortization of a Cypres came out to be something like $12/mo over its lifetime including maintenance.

People that whine about AAD costs have never had to pay for a funeral. They are significantly more expensive.

NSCR-2376, SCR-15080

[hackish 8]

I have seen the vigils serial numbers go up almost exponentially each year I assemble new equipment so I believe as a company they are mature and doing well.

Locally most of the jumpers purchased a vigil when their cypres wore out. While I only packed 60 rigs last year there was only a single Cypress. Some dropzones are the exact opposite so check with your riggers.

I don't really think you'll have a statistically significant difference between the safety of any of the products. An approach more likely to affect you is the size/stability of the company and the supply chain.

If you need a new cutter (broken wire???) in the middle of the season it's nice to know that your local rigger probably has one in stock.

-Michael

[erdnarob 1]

Advanced Aerospace Designs, the maker of the Vigil has now 55% of the all AAD market and still growing. In the last World 4 Way championships, two of the first 3 top teams were equiped with Vigil. Those people jump a lot and just like Formula one racing does for our cars, they are kind of testing equipment for us jumpers.

Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

[tsf 0]

erdnarob

In the last World 4 Way championships, two of the first 3 top teams were equiped with Vigil. Those people jump a lot and just like Formula one racing does for our cars, they are kind of testing equipment for us jumpers.

They aren't testing the critical functionality of the AAD, though. They may do 1000s, or 10000s of jumps, but I bet they have 0 or very close to 0 AAD fires (and a professional is probably one of the least likely to end up in a situation where he/she has to rely on the AAD to save him/her).

It's like Mario Andretti driving your car for 100,000 miles to prove the airbag system is good. If he never gets into an accident, what can he really prove about the reliability of the airbag system? Probably just that it never gave him an error or misfired on him.