Rig advice for a tall person?

[lyosha 46]

Hi there, I'm a recent A license recipient that happens to be of a tall/skinny stature (~6'6", 200 lbs). In a few months when things up north defrost a bit I am hopeful to continue my progression through the sport. That will likely involve purchasing a container and some canopies and the such to cut down on the running costs of my newfound addiction.

I've been watching classifieds for the past couple of months and 6'4" and 30 pounds of gut on me (guessing this will not fit properly) is doable, but 6'5" is already an elusive beast... So, with my dimensions, I'm used to purchasing custom-made or hard to find stuff. Will the story be the same with containers? Are there some kind of dimensions on containers that can actually be adjusted or should I not bother? Should I ask extra questions when looking for used containers to make sure they'll fit me properly post-adjustment?

The student containers really fit like @$$ and I'm guessing the rentals at my local rigger will fit similarly. Is it worth it to purchase a new container custom made for my uncommon body?

Also, being newer to the sport and concerned with safety, a skyhook seems like a really good idea, which makes used rigs even THAT much harder to find and somewhat limits my selection...

To that end, does anyone have any recommendations of containers that work better for individuals with my body type? I don't want to dislocate a shoulder going for the BOC on a short container... am I correct to just give up on classifieds for containers?

Also, if purchasing a new container, I would prefer to knock out as many bases as I could for as long as I could so I don't have to purchase another container two years from now. That means if I want to learn to start freefly a dozen or two jumps from now, I won't have to get a whole other container. And if a couple hundred jumps from now I want to try a wingsuit on, the container will work as well.

I was thinking of starting out with something like a Vector V349, which will hold an OP193 and stick something docile and easy like a Pulse 190, with room to go down from there whenever I'm ready, in a year or maybe two. I've worked my way down to flying Nav 220's and 200's as a student and my landings have been pretty good. Does this sound reasonable or am I doing something silly? Also, Vector containers take like 8 months to manufacture. Which seems very excessive. But none of the other containers even publish container dimensions (is there even another container that will hold a pulse 190 at its upper bounds with a OP193 as a standard fitting reserve?)! How am I supposed to know if it will work for me at all? :-/ I'd love to have more choice, but the other manufacturers don't seem to want to release information that I would consider important :-/

Ohhhh the dilemma of being tall...

I guess the bright side of ordering a Vector would be that by the time it actually arrives I'll definitely be ready for the size of parachutes that can go into it...

Is there anyone else out there that has to pay extra for custom tailored suits like me because no store carries anything that fits you or anyone with experience with such a man that would have some advice for me?

Thank you so much in advance!

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

Well, you don't have to buy a new container to get a harness that fits you. A harness resize is an option. And it may not be necessary, depending on how you are put together. If you have long legs and a shorter body, you may fit a container built for someone shorter, but with a longer torso.

Find a used container that fits the canopies you will be jumping now. You can theoretically fit several different sizes in a given container size, but they work best with the size that fits best. Get the serial number of that container (if the seller isn't willing to give it out, find another).

Go to the manufacturers websites and find the page that tells you how to measure for a new harness. Have someone take your measurements (DO NOT try to do it yourself).

Contact the manufacturer with this information and find out if a harness resize is necessry or possible and how much it will cost. It will probably be a few hundred bucks, but still far cheaper than a new one.

Most rigs made in the past 5 or 6 years are considered "freefly friendly" which is a fancy way of saying proper pin, bridle and riser protection for the unusual attitudes and higher speeds encountered while freeflying.

Everyone makes a rig that will hold a 190 main/193 reserve. The others may not have sizing info on their sites (I thought most of them did, but I'm not going to look right now), but all of them will tell you what you want to know if you shoot them an email (don't forget this is a holiday weekend and it might take a bit for a response right now). Vectors have a long wait time because there are a lot of people in line ahead of you.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[FreefallSnoopy 0]

Hey man, I'm not too far ahead of you jump wise in the big scheme of things but here's my $.02...

Get a custom fit one... I'm about 6'7" and 225, and i've had rigs on that fit alright and fit marginally but none fit like my custom one. Most anything that you get nowadays from the big brand names (Vector, Wings, Javelin, Mirage, Curv, icon etc.) will be acceptable for freeflying. Not all will be, the Dolphin is the only one that i can think of that is not freefly friendly. However, a quick chat with the company can quickly resolve any questions on some of the lesser known brands. The only thing with wingsuiting is having a spinner up canopy, which as a beginner you shouldn't be buying anyways. They should fit a couple of canopy downsizes.

As far as skyhook is concerned, they can be installed on the appropriate container, and wings has a now reserve boost or something like that, that is basically the same kinda idea. Canopy decision is the hot topic on this website, stick to something close to 1-1 and you'll live, go over it and you'll probably live but might scare or injure yourself a couple of times. Your call really. But don't ask for that kinda advice on here from perfect strangers, get it from your instructors, S&TA, DZO and make a conscientious decision.

I'm not sure about anyone but wings, but if you order with your 2 canopy sizes, they will build you the appropriate container. You shouldn't really be downsizing a reserve until you buy a new rig, but the main pack tray will allow for a few downsizes like i already said, so you shouldn't really need to worry about that.

In the end, with your build, custom stuff makes things easier. Its important to remember that having gear that fits you right can take some of the risk out of skydiving. You end up with a loose container and it can shift in freefall making it difficult to grab your PC (that happened to a friend of mine). Or so tight that you're uncomfortable from the moment you put it on.

You should talk with your local instructors for more info. They should point you iin the right direction.

[mattjw916 2]

no way I would wait 8 months for a container regardless of the features

people safely put bazillions of jumps on various Mirage, Javelin, Voodoo, Talon, Infinity, Wings, Dolphin, etc rigs on an ongoing basis... some offer "skyhooks" as an option, some don't...

all the container manufacturers I'm familiar with have their container sizes published... e.g. http://www.miragesys.com/sizing-guide/ some are more buried than others on their sites though

so if you wanted a Op193 with a Pulse 190 in a Mirage you would go with an M5 sized container (just an example)... remember a Pulse packs up at least one size smaller so a 190 is going to pack up like a full ZP 170

as for jumpsuits... everyone I know has them custom made... there really isn't an "off the rack" suit that is going to be ideal for anyone, myself included... have a (sober) friend measure you and get exactly what you want/need if you're ready to plop down that much cash

NSCR-2376, SCR-15080

[fossg 0]

You might want to give Jump Shack a t
ry. The Racer container is extremely comfortable. Jump Shack is kind of the big and tall shop for skydivers.

[ufk22 32]

What matters is not height, it's your torso. I'm only 6', but have only a 31" inseam, so I need a larger harness than a lot of people that are much taller. For a rig to fit me, it needs a 19 1/2" MLW. If you're 6'6" with a 36" inseam, you may well need the same size.
This dimension is on the manufacture tag on most rigs.
What you need to be concerned with is the length of the main lift web.
As others have said, with assistance of someone who know how, measure yourself according to a manufacture's instructions, then find out what size they recommend.

This is the paradox of skydiving. We do something very dangerous, expose ourselves to a totally unnecesary risk, and then spend our time trying to make it safer.

[riggerrob 558]

Vector and Wings are available in "tall" container shapes.

[riggerrob 558]

Don't worry too much about down-sizing.
If you take canopy-piloting seriously, you will need most of 200 jumps to explore all the corners of the envelope on your first 190/210 square foot canopy.
Then just when you are starting to get bored with that main canopy, you will want a boring, docile, fully-understood canopy when you take on the challenge of learning how to fly a wing-suit.
Finally, most people do no down-size new reserve canopies into their old containers, rather they trade in their old container and reserve and buy a completely new (smaller) set of gear.

[riggerrob 558]

The "Skyhook" brand of MARD is optional on Vector, Javelin and Icon containers. Unfortunately, Skyhooks cannot be retrofitted to those containers built before 2000 (?).
The "Boost" MARD system is optional on new Wings and can be factory retro-fitted to most older Wings.

[RiggerLee 61]

The early vector 3's tended towards longer pattern sets. I would also look at the Infinity. It tends towards a longer thinner reserve tray. I think some of there pattern sets would work well for you.

Lee

Lee
[email protected]
www.velocitysportswear.com

[grue 1]

ufk22

What matters is not height, it's your torso. I'm only 6', but have only a 31" inseam, so I need a larger harness than a lot of people that are much taller. For a rig to fit me, it needs a 19 1/2" MLW. If you're 6'6" with a 36" inseam, you may well need the same size.
This dimension is on the manufacture tag on most rigs.
What you need to be concerned with is the length of the main lift web.
As others have said, with assistance of someone who know how, measure yourself according to a manufacture's instructions, then find out what size they recommend.

Yup, same boat here. 6'3", 19.5" MLW. Every borrowed rig I've ever put on has been exceptionally uncomfortable. My custom Infinity, however, rocks.

cavete terrae.

[Joellercoaster 6]

Hey. To the OP, I feel your pain.

I'm 6'5" and 205ish (and mostly torso), and while secondhand containers in our size do occasionally appear, I have never yet been lucky enough to grab one.

The people who point out that you can have a harness built are correct! It's expensive, but still less expensive than buying new. But the gap is smaller... the temptation to have a custom rig is powerful, and I am a sucker

In beginner sizes, to be honest it doesn't matter which brand. Something that will fit a 190 main will work for you in terms of easily reaching your handles and so on.

I bought my second one (Vector) specifically because it came in a tall variant, but have since regretted it. Not the Vector itself (utterly brilliant container) but the idea that I needed something long. It was an illusion. Likewise Wings EXT... nice idea but I'm not sure it's a real help even for me.

mattjw916

no way I would wait 8 months for a container regardless of the features

This.

I love my Vector, but my incoming container is something I could have for the start of next season!

[edit to add:

Quote

none of the other containers even publish container dimensions

They do.

From a quick look on the internet, the first two manufacturer sites I went to suggest an Icon I6 (which can be fitted with a Skyhook, if you must have one) or an Infinity I-45. Other containers are available but I have to go and do actual work now ]

--
"I'll tell you how all skydivers are judged, . They are judged by the laws of physics." - kkeenan

"You jump out, pull the string and either live or die. What's there to be good at?

[bob.dino 0]

I have a friend who is 6'7" and weighs 200lb. He wears the same size rig as a former teammate, 5'3" in stature. I can't safely fit into either of their rigs, 'cause at 6'3", my torso is too long.

It really bugs me the way people go "designed for a person 5'8"-6'1"". Get a rigger or knowledgable friend to measure your harness size. Then you can get a feel for whether you're short/normal/long and know by manufacturer what size you need.

After all that, you'll know if you need to buy a new container, or if there's a bunch of second-hand containers on the market that might suit.

[masterrigger1 2]

Quote

I'm a recent A license recipient that happens to be of a tall/skinny stature (~6'6", 200 lbs)

You will be needing a 19-20" lift web at least.

Shoulder size will determine if you need a "C" or "D" yoke.
The yoke size is important to know because unlike the harness size, it cannot be changed.

Also if you have too short of a yoke size, it may be hard to get to the PC when you get ready to throw out.

Guessing with just the info that you gave above, you are looking at a C-19 or C-20 sized H/C. But get measured to be sure.

MEL

Skyworks Parachute Service, LLC
www.Skyworksparachuteservice.com

[BIGUN 1,051]

Highly recommend a WingsEXT custom made to fit you.
Your choice of ~190 in a main (Safire, Sabre, Pilot) and PD or Smart reserve.
Decide on and purchase a reserve first, then main....
Have two separate riggers take your measurements for the harness.
Then, place the order for the harness.

ETA: I've owned Vectors, Icons and have jumped Talons, Javelins, etc. The longer EXT works for us tall ones.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[councilman24 36]

I have a vector II that was custom for a 6'3" 210lb friend. It fits me well at 5'10" and 240lbs. (no comments). Get measured and get rig sizes from manufacturer's. Then you can better judge whether a particular used rig might fit.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[ChrisD 0]

UPT might have some leftover camo rigs V350s for less than 3 week delivery, give them a call???

C

But what do I know, "I only have one tandem jump."

[lyosha 46]

Thank you all for the replies. How can I figure out what size of MLW do I need? I do have a longer torso (I think). Inseam is about 37 inches

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

lyosha

Thank you all for the replies. How can I figure out what size of MLW do I need? I do have a longer torso (I think). Inseam is about 37 inches

General rule is height minus inseam minus 20"

So I come up with a 21 for you (6'6"-37-20)

If you have a freakishly long neck or big head it might be different.
Again, you can take your measurements according to the manufacturers procedure and ask them.
That would give you the most accurate answer.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[ChrisD 0]

lyosha

Thank you all for the replies. How can I figure out what size of MLW do I need? I do have a longer torso (I think). Inseam is about 37 inches

If you go the UPT route Mike can size you.

There are lots of manufactures that can help you, but I mention the folks at UPT cause they were doing this kind of thing well before most of the others were born. Except for the Immediate neighbor of UPT that is

There are a lot of excellent posts here about sizing, the one that sticks out the most is to get some other very competent person to size you...

C

As always try before you buy and make sure your purchases involve a escaroll service!

But what do I know, "I only have one tandem jump."

[lyosha 46]

Also - as far as wings containers go, they don't offer them with magnetic riser covers. Are those as useful as the sales pitch for them makes them out to be? I've seen wings containers have problems with tuck tabs coming undone on the ground which makes me a little uneasy...

Also, looking at their MARD design from their reserve packing instructions, how does the RSL lanyard get released if risers are still attached and reserve handle is pulled (lets say plane is going down at low altitude, for the sake of a scenario)? It's pretty straight forward for a skyhook, the lanyard slips off of the metal bit, but for a reserve boost it almost seems like it would want to hold on to the lanyard. Can someone please explain how it works? Has someone tried to pull a reserve handle prior to a repack on one of those systems? Does the reserve pilot chute still fly as far back or will it have trouble clearing my burble?

[mattjw916 2]

Quote

There are a lot of excellent posts here about sizing, the one that sticks out the most is to get some other very competent person to size you...

This. Preferably someone that has measured for and/or ordered a lot of rigs before. Margie at Square2 did mine, it was absolutely perfect.

NSCR-2376, SCR-15080

[RiggerLee 61]

Interesting. My new wings is setting right here beside me with magnetic riser covers.

If the pc pulls on the bag rather then be dagged upwards by the riser is pulls the pin out of the loop and releases the rsl. In a since it's the same as the skyhook just more secure. Seems like a reasonable design.

Lee

Lee
[email protected]
www.velocitysportswear.com

[lyosha 46]

RiggerLee

Interesting. My new wings is setting right here beside me with magnetic riser covers.

You are right, I am confused, thanks for setting me straight. Chutingstar doesn't have them as an option you can click on and that threw me off... whoops :X

RiggerLee

If the pc pulls on the bag rather then be dagged upwards by the riser is pulls the pin out of the loop and releases the rsl. In a since it's the same as the skyhook just more secure. Seems like a reasonable design.

Well before PC can pull on the bag it has to clear the lanyard, right? (otherwise the PC will be attached to the main risers) It's that detachment mechanism that's giving me a bit of pause - in the skyhook it's very apparent how it functions - the lanyard just slips off the thing with (I would assume) not a whole lot of effort. Reserve boost has some sort of small spectra line that passes into a grommet, through a metal ring and back to the other side of the grommet. When I look at it, I see a lot of spectra-grommet-ring friction which looks like it could be increased if there is adequate tension in the system. Does this release as easily as the lanyard hopefully does on the skyhook or does it cause more reserve PC hesitation? Am I asking a stupid question? :-/

[Deyan 31]

lyosha

in the skyhook it's very apparent how it functions - the lanyard just slips off the thing with (I would assume) not a whole lot of effort.

Your assumption is wrong. The highest force I ever measured is 26 lbs. ( 16-18 average) If that's not much, I don't know what it is! Now most people will tell you that this is not much, and they will probably be right until you will have to bail out of a hot air balloon.

Quote

Reserve boost has some sort of small spectra line that passes into a grommet, through a metal ring and back to the other side of the grommet. When I look at it, I see a lot of spectra-grommet-ring friction which looks like it could be increased if there is adequate tension in the system. Does this release as easily as the lanyard hopefully does on the skyhook or does it cause more reserve PC hesitation? Am I asking a stupid question? :-/

Much easier. 1-2 lbs at max.

Quote

It's that detachment mechanism that's giving me a bit of pause

It's your last chance. KISS principle works best
P.S. KISS is the opposite of MARD

"My belief is that once the doctor whacks you on the butt, all guarantees are off" Jerry Baumchen