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skydiverek

Stuffing the outer 4 cells on both sides into the center cell Q

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When people say:

"I stuff the outer 4 cells on both sides into the center cell."

What deos it mean?

Into, meaning physically into the cell's 'hole' and touching center cell's interior, OR 'into' meaning 'towards' the center cell, and resting them just next to the center cell (touching center cell's exterior)?

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[You would physically be pushing the nose of the outer cells (typically folded to face inwards and back, or rolled more), into the nose opening of the center cell, on the appropriate side.

A more modern way would be to roll both sides (noses of the outer cells all together on each side) and tuck them on either side of the center cell, but not actually into its nose opening.

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As inside the cell.




This. While it may not be done by many in the civilian sport market any more, there are systems today that require you to roll sections of the nose towards the center cell and place them inside the nose of the center cell respectively.
"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required"
Some people dream about flying, I live my dream
SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING

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Well, I tried this today on my Spectre 190, and got massive line twists. My theory is that probably left or right (three) cells got out of the center cell first, causing the uneven canopy inflation.



Why have you done it? You don't need that with Spectre at all.

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Well, I tried this today on my Spectre 190, and got massive line twists. My theory is that probably left or right (three) cells got out of the center cell first, causing uneven canopy inflation.



Why have you done it? You don't need that with Spectre at all.


I know. I was just curious :)

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Well, I tried this today on my Spectre 190, and got massive line twists. My theory is that probably left or right (three) cells got out of the center cell first, causing the uneven canopy inflation.



That's one reason this idea went out of style a decade or so ago. Another reason is that it can damage the canopy.

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Well, I tried this today on my Spectre 190, and got massive line twists. My theory is that probably left or right (three) cells got out of the center cell first, causing the uneven canopy inflation.



That's one reason this idea went out of style a decade or so ago. Another reason is that it can damage the canopy.



How exactly?

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I would agree that some systems might roll the outer cells into the middle, don't know of any sport canopies that have that as suggested packing method.

Unless it is done evenly on each side, rolling can cause off heading openings. When I first got my Sabre 170, I did every trick I could to prevent a possible slammer opening that Sabres were supposed to have. I ended up with lots of off heading openings depending on which side unrolled first. Never had a slammer. With some trial and effort, found out I had much more consistant openings by just stuffing the nose, all 9 cells.

This works for my Sabre 150 as well. When I went to a 135, it had some brisk, wonky openings. After giving it a new needed lineset and adding a pocket slider, it opens like a dream. So if you have a hard opening canopy, a pocket is the way I would go. Works the same every time without the worry of how the nose was packed/rolled.

YMMV.
50 donations so far. Give it a try.

You know you want to spank it
Jump an Infinity

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Well, I tried this today on my Spectre 190, and got massive line twists. My theory is that probably left or right (three) cells got out of the center cell first, causing the uneven canopy inflation.



*Cough* Bodyposition *Cough*
:P

If the canopy is slippery it can unroll itself while you are bagging the canopy.

My BT Pro is not slippery at all.
But if I don't roll the nose, it will give me horrible openings.
I had one opening a few weeks ago, It seriously feelt like a slider off jump.
I don't know what I did wrong when I packed the canopy, but something was not right.

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Man, some people make packing a lot more difficult than it needs to be.

Quarter the slider, keep your lines straight, and open in a stable position.

I haven't changed the way I've packed anything from my fathers challenger 220, to my comp velo 84 and everything in between.

Let the nose hang and keep the slider tight.

The thing that doesn't work well is stowing only one brake on a Crossfire2 :P

Losers make excuses, Winners make it happen
God is Good
Beer is Great
Swoopers are crazy.

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I would agree that some systems might roll the outer cells into the middle, don't know of any sport canopies that have that as suggested packing method.

Unless it is done evenly on each side, rolling can cause off heading openings. When I first got my Sabre 170, I did every trick I could to prevent a possible slammer opening that Sabres were supposed to have. I ended up with lots of off heading openings depending on which side unrolled first. Never had a slammer. With some trial and effort, found out I had much more consistant openings by just stuffing the nose, all 9 cells.

This works for my Sabre 150 as well. When I went to a 135, it had some brisk, wonky openings. After giving it a new needed lineset and adding a pocket slider, it opens like a dream. So if you have a hard opening canopy, a pocket is the way I would go. Works the same every time without the worry of how the nose was packed/rolled.

YMMV.



Just to clarify - you don't/didn't roll the nose on your Sabre 1? It is in the user manual to roll the nose and I have been reluctant to change due to their reputation. I have been having off heading openings though and it would be nice to lose them.
Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

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Just to clarify - you don't/didn't roll the nose on your Sabre 1? It is in the user manual to roll the nose and I have been reluctant to change due to their reputation. I have been having off heading openings though and it would be nice to lose them.



The canopy I have the most jumps on is a Sabre. From 190 student gear down to my 135. Some might say it skews my opinion of what I consider a fast or slow opening, but I have gotten used to pitching and knowing the canopy is there. I like the term "brisk" to describe it. I define a slammer as one that makes you grunt and you wonder if you still have your shoes on.:o:D Only been slammed twice. Once on a Sabre2 and once on the 135 when it was out of trim and not slowing down from my track after doing a belly jump. To me, a slow, snivelly opening is a malfunction that eventually clears. The canopy I use the most is my 150, both for belly or WS. In either case, I do not roll the nose. I take all 9 cells together and and stuff them gently into the canopy so as not to disturb the lines. The deployment is smooth and soft in the WS, and a little on the brisk side for standard belly jump. I am a believer in adding a pocket to the slider instead of using packing tricks to slow an opening. I added one to the 135 because it was a bit too brisk for me for belly jumps. I also a have Nitro/n in 135 and 150 and love how they fly, but they open too damn slow in my WS. If I could dial them in to open like my Sabres, that would be my dream canopy.

*disclaimer*
Every individual canopy has its own personality. Pack the way you think is best. Mine are well behaved. Yours might secretly hate you.
50 donations so far. Give it a try.

You know you want to spank it
Jump an Infinity

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Well, I tried this today on my Spectre 190, and got massive line twists. My theory is that probably left or right (three) cells got out of the center cell first, causing the uneven canopy inflation.



That's one reason this idea went out of style a decade or so ago. Another reason is that it can damage the canopy.



How exactly?



im not real sure i agree with this, every time i pack my base rig the nose gets rolled and stuffed in the centercell, everytime! and we base-tards like onheading openings and not damaging our gear on every jump. but what do i know?
Flock University FWC / ZFlock
B.A.S.E. 1580
Aussie BASE 121

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As inside the cell.




This. While it may not be done by many in the civilian sport market any more, there are systems today that require you to roll sections of the nose towards the center cell and place them inside the nose of the center cell respectively.



Has nothing to do with skydiving, but the large ram-air cargo chutes we use in the military require rolling the nose or even tying it shut to protect the equipment.

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That is one of the systems I was eluding to along with a few military personnel systems that require doing something with the nose other than letting it hang. I can't say I'd recommend doing this for any of todays civilian canopies but I can say that damage to a canopy from stuffing the nose is not an issue I've seen. If it was, we wouldn't do it on the systems that require it. For civilian canopies I'd recommend a larger slider before I'd recommend stuffing the nose as described.
"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required"
Some people dream about flying, I live my dream
SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING

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I've always packed my Sabre (and Ariel) by flopping 4 cells together towards the center (not rolling); then the other 4 cells; then flop the center cell; didn't stuff them inside; then, making sure the slider is all the way down against the stops, pull the slider completely out front and over the nose. Then roll the tail tightly making sure all lines remained in the center. Always on heading and always "brisk" but not slamming. But, shoulders must remain level or it will open hard and in a spin. Most opening problems were after looking hard over my shoulder and not quite getting "square" again before pulling.

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Well, I tried this today on my Spectre 190, and got massive line twists. My theory is that probably left or right (three) cells got out of the center cell first, causing the uneven canopy inflation.



That's one reason this idea went out of style a decade or so ago. Another reason is that it can damage the canopy.




How exactly?


im not real sure i agree with this, every time i pack my base rig the nose gets rolled and stuffed in the centercell, everytime! and we base-tards like onheading openings and not damaging our gear on every jump. but what do i know?


I also don't understand how this should wear out the canopy.
You roll the tail of the canopy on every jump, if this rolling would cause wear you should see it on all canopys at the tail after just a few hundred jumps.

But if we are talking about just friction, the having a canopy that is streamin in the opening (as Sabre 2 for example) would wear out the canopy really fast as bottom/ribs and topskin keeps rubbing during the inflation.

The way I see it, stuffing the endcells in the center makes sure the centercell gets inflated first, thus setting the heading of the canopy.
Once this cell is inflated (or during the inflation) the endcells unroll.
When the endcells are out the can start inflating and get the slider to move down the lines.
But if you roll the endcells too tight and jump a canopy without crossports you can end up with endcell closure, as I noticed :$

But when I pack my BASEcanopy (slider on/off) I roll them in and place them behind the centercell, and then open the centercell as much as possible and hiding the other cells behind it.

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