saxboy 0 #1 July 31, 2011 Hello there! I want your opinion about my problem.. I am jumping a stiletto 135 for about 180 jumps right now. All my openings were perfect and on heading. Since i started wingsuit jumps(with this canopy) I decide to change my pilot chute with bigger and with longer bridle. The previous pilot chute was 24" and 80" (If i remember correct) the bridle.. The new one is 28" and 100" bridle.. After this "change" I lost my smooth and on heading openings of my canopy and "always" i have bad,strong openings.In the last two jumps I had line twist. I managed to clear it in the first jump but on the last jump(not wing suit) I used the plan "B" see the video..http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rprHFu3pbt4 What is your opinion about that? Is the pilot chute responsible for these opening? Note that I didn't change something on my packing... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
virgin-burner 1 #2 July 31, 2011 why did you change it in the first place? longer bridle is ok, but why a bigger PC?“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.” -Hunter S. Thompson "No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try." -Yoda Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
saxboy 0 #3 July 31, 2011 Because "they" recommend for wingsuit jumps, bigger p/c and longer bridle.. I will change it again and I will see the results... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phoenixlpr 0 #4 July 31, 2011 Quote Hello there! I want your opinion about my problem.. I am jumping a stiletto 135 for about 180 jumps right now. All my openings were perfect and on heading. Since i started wingsuit jumps(with this canopy) I decide to change my pilot chute with bigger and with longer bridle. The previous pilot chute was 24" and 80" (If i remember correct) the bridle.. The new one is 28" and 100" bridle.. After this "change" I lost my smooth and on heading openings of my canopy and "always" i have bad,strong openings.In the last two jumps I had line twist. I managed to clear it in the first jump but on the last jump(not wing suit) I used the plan "B" see the video..http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rprHFu3pbt4 What is your opinion about that? Is the pilot chute responsible for these opening? Note that I didn't change something on my packing... FYI: I jump WS with Cobalt 135 and Cazer 24" ZP kill-line PC. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ecll 0 #5 July 31, 2011 For what it may be worth, the video would seem to show that body position is not being maintained through the opening. Before the first spinup, the risers are 4 to six inches from being level with each other. It looks like the canopy only did what you told it to do with harness input. I would suggest that as the snatch force brings you upright, you force your legs straight, force your ankles together and drive your toes straight into the ground. This input into the harness will do a lot to keep the risers even. If the risers are even, it is going to be difficult for the canopy to do any thing other than fly straight. Looking up at the canopy, rather than at the level horizon, can also induce uneven harness input that you do not realize you are doing. I learned to stop looking up at canopy openings years ago. Also, in a spinup I would strongly suggest that you do not grab the risers with your whole hand. In that hand position, if the twists shoot down the lines onto the risers, your hand could easily be trapped, keeping you from cutting away. I use the heels of my hands and finger tips to grab the risers in a spinup. I also wear gloves As one more suggestion, as line twists are happening, immediately take a hold on the risers and start twisting them in the direction of the line twists (keeping your toes dug straight into the ground) This will shoot the line twists down onto the risers, increasing your mechanical advantage so that most of the time the line twists will spin you, or with very little leg rotation you can spin you, out of the line twists. This shooting the twists down onto the risers with your legs straight can (most of the time) allow the risers to even up, possibly keeping your canopy from going into a dive and give you more time to deal with the situation. YMMV Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #6 July 31, 2011 QuoteBecause "they" recommend for wingsuit jumps, bigger p/c and longer bridle.. Do "they" recommend the Stiletto as a good wingsuit canopy? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
captain_stan 0 #7 July 31, 2011 Quoteimmediately take a hold on the risers and start twisting them in the direction of the line twists Like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FD2I8OqbS0#watch-vid-title There's a thread in here somewhere on the subject, but the video says it all. And yes, this technique does work very well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
saxboy 0 #8 July 31, 2011 QuoteQuoteBecause "they" recommend for wingsuit jumps, bigger p/c and longer bridle.. Do "they" recommend the Stiletto as a good wingsuit canopy? Did I posted a wingsuit jump with line twist??? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
saxboy 0 #9 July 31, 2011 QuoteQuoteimmediately take a hold on the risers and start twisting them in the direction of the line twists Like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FD2I8OqbS0#watch-vid-title There's a thread in here somewhere on the subject, but the video says it all. And yes, this technique does work very well. Thank you guys for the tip!!! I didn't knew that! Very nice!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
captain_stan 0 #10 July 31, 2011 Quote Did I posted a wingsuit jump with line twist??? If you only get linetwist w/o the wingsuit, why not wear the wingsuit on every jump to prevent this? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
saxboy 0 #11 July 31, 2011 Quote Quote Did I posted a wingsuit jump with line twist??? If you only get linetwist w/o the wingsuit, why not wear the wingsuit on every jump to prevent this? Oh,come on...Don't start this guys... I only asked if the pilot chute is responsible for these openings... I told you that I have 180 jumps with this canopy (20 wing suits) and since I changed the pilot chute for "better" and "safer" I have worst openings.. Maybe my body position wasn't good (I don't know) but what about the last 179 jumps? I didn't change anything about my opening procedures... I know that the stiletto isn't for wing suit jumps,but I am trying to sell it for another canopy.. I can't afford a second rig or a new canopy.. I have to sell this first.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
captain_stan 0 #12 July 31, 2011 QuoteMaybe my body position wasn't good (I don't know) but what about the last 179 jumps? I didn't change anything about my opening procedures... Seriously, I'm wondering if your body position has been marginal all along, but "slightly non-symetrical" has now been amplified to "problematic" by the quicker openings with the larger PC. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phoenixlpr 0 #13 July 31, 2011 I hope you still had the old PC. Get it back and try jumping WS with it. If you find opening issues than try to fix them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
saxboy 0 #14 July 31, 2011 Quote Quote Maybe my body position wasn't good (I don't know) but what about the last 179 jumps? I didn't change anything about my opening procedures... Seriously, I'm wondering if your body position has been marginal all along, but "slightly non-symetrical" has now been amplified to "problematic" by the quicker openings with the larger PC. I don't know...Maybe you have right.. . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
saxboy 0 #15 July 31, 2011 QuoteI hope you still had the old PC. Get it back and try jumping WS with it. If you find opening issues than try to fix them. Yes I still have it.. And i am going to change it again... I never had this type of openings again....Only now with the new p/c.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PeteS 0 #16 July 31, 2011 I see uneven line groups on line stretch. You are raising your right leg. Try just touching your heels together when you feel the risers tug at you. Don't lock your legs, but push your heels together. Think "There's no place like home, there's no place like home". Look straight at the horizon with your hands just above your 3 rings. Be ready to _Harness steer_ though the opening if need be. How many jumps are on the canopy, lines, ect.? Short control lines can influence openings quite a bit. Hope this helps! Oh yea, one more thing, Stiletto is not a great ws canopy.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
saxboy 0 #17 July 31, 2011 Quote I see uneven line groups on line stretch. You are raising your right leg. Try just touching your heels together when you feel the risers tug at you. Don't lock your legs, but push your heels together. Think "There's no place like home, there's no place like home". Look straight at the horizon with your hands just above your 3 rings. Be ready to _Harness steer_ though the opening if need be. How many jumps are on the canopy, lines, ect.? Short control lines can influence openings quite a bit. Hope this helps! Oh yea, one more thing, Stiletto is not a great ws canopy.. Thank you for the tips I will change back to my old pilot chute and if the openings are the same I will start to thinking about my body position.. The canopy has about 600 jumps and 70-80 with new lines. Also I am checking the brake lines for twist very often. About the stiletto and wing suit ,I said I know that ,but...guys the jump was regular freely jump.NOT a wing suit jump.. ps:I see video of a friend chopping his sabre 2 135 with worst line twist on ws jump...I NEVER had even one line twist on ws jump or a regular jump with this canopy.. And everything started with the new pilot chute..That's why I posted here....Asking if it is possible.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PeteS 0 #18 July 31, 2011 Is the pilot chute made correctly? An error in manufacture can give worse openings than a smaller, correctly made one. Is the operation of this pilot chute cocking mechanism the same as your last one? Again, minute differences can add up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
P-dro 0 #19 July 31, 2011 QuoteBecause "they" recommend for wingsuit jumps, bigger p/c and longer bridle.. I will change it again and I will see the results... it's an urban legend, I did it for the exact same reason you did. I just came back to a standard sized PC, boy, what an improvement!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #20 July 31, 2011 Quote I know that the stiletto isn't for wing suit jumps,but I am trying to sell it for another canopy.. I can't afford a second rig or a new canopy.. I have to sell this first.. I only commented because I've seen several people have a few too many reserve rides after spinners under elliptical canopies with wingsuits. Your choice. Surely nothing that bad will happen to you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DSE 3 #21 July 31, 2011 the bigger PC is kind of an urban myth, IMO. The longer bridle is not. As Pete said, the Stiletto/Spinetto isn't really ideal for wingsuiting. More than that, a bad body position is merely going to be amplified in a wingsuit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
saxboy 0 #22 August 1, 2011 Quote Is the pilot chute made correctly? An error in manufacture can give worse openings than a smaller, correctly made one. Is the operation of this pilot chute cocking mechanism the same as your last one? Again, minute differences can add up. That's a RIGHT question..It is custom made from a rigger in England.. I have to check it with my rigger.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 3 #23 August 1, 2011 A larger PC will increase the felt snatch force. Snatch Force The force generated during deployment when the bagged canopy reaches line extension and the pilot chute is accelerated back to the speed of the jumper. The greater the speed is between the P/C and the jumper at line extension the greater the felt force. SparkyMy idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
P-dro 0 #24 August 1, 2011 QuoteA larger PC will increase the felt snatch force. Not only that, on my Crossfire, it makes the opening a lot less pleasant and predictable... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
saxboy 0 #25 August 6, 2011 Finally I changed again the pilot chute with the old one and the sweet openings are back:-) I did 3 jumps today and every opening was very smooth,with long snivel and on heading... I will never change the diameter of my pilot chute again..:-)) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
