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swoopfly

AADless

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Why was this a fatality? 2000ft dosent seem to low to uhh fumble fumble where the handle? why did he just use his other hand as someone so easily mentioned in this thread? Did someone with 5 times my jump numbers not come up with this theory? after all thats why they put the reserve handle on the main lift web right?

Do you think and RSL or ADD would have made a difference in the report? the skydiver had niether!



This is a different scenario than you presented. This incident involved a missing/obscured/entangled handle. I don't know what happened, but I would bet my eye-teeth this jumper used both hands to try to find the missing handle. An RSL or AAD might have prevented that fatality.

You said your left arm is unreliable and you will wait for your AAD to fire. You didn't say anything about being unconscious - you said you would just wait for your AAD to fire.

That's a completely different kettle of fish - or lane of pins. :|



I like a rush my friend but i stand to see where i stated i would sit and wait for my good old cypres to activate before attempting anything else??!

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I like a rush my friend but i stand to see where i stated i would sit and wait for my good old cypres to activate before attempting anything else??!



You've stated in clear terms (in my interpretation) that you are choosing your gear configuration on the assumption that you won't be able to attempt anything else.

You appear to think that an AAD will help you if you cutaway low, and that an RSL is more of a hazard than jumping with questions about your ability to deploy on your own.

Most people here haven't questioned whether or not having an AAD is paramount, or having as RSL is paramount, but almost everyone has reacted to your process by suggesting that given the concerns that you have, your decision to not wear an RSL does not make sense,

Just consider that one point....
Owned by Remi #?

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Post 8
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I should add in that my left shoulder has suffered a dislocation before. If i ever found it dislocated on a skydive, i had peace of mind knowing my ADD will still fire if nothing is pulled. Or after a routine cutaway if my reserve arm was unusable.



This is one place where you said you would wait for your AAD. If your reserve arm is unusable you should use your right arm to reach for and pull the reserve.

Post 11:
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So in that case i would rather have any device after a cutaway to get a reserve out than no backup device at all! Keep in mind both these devices can fail but i would take the chance over nothing being activated at all. All this is of course if i found myself with a dislocation in freefall!



This is another place where you indicated you would wait for an AAD fire.

Post 14:
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1... Cutaway from 2000ft with cypres and no rsl. lets say its a no pull on reserve(a reason could be dislocated left shoulder.)... Your cypres is set to fire if your still in freefall, so cypres should deploy reserve in this situation.



This is another place you indicated you would wait for an AAD fire.


In Post 24 you mentioned a concern of becoming unconscious at some point on or after leaving the aircraft - but you didn't mention that concern up front. That is for many jumpers the primary reason for having an AAD, not a concern that their left arm, due to a prior injury, will be incapacitated.

It happens to be my opinion based on what you've said in this thread that you should sell your gear and invest in a ball, bag, shoes and accessories and join a friendly bowling league.
"Even in a world where perfection is unattainable, there's still a difference between excellence and mediocrity." Gary73

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i thought i explained it well. I dont use an rsl because its something that can be routed wrong, its something that can snag on my camera gear, it something that can become an entanglement. I jump a katana loaded at 1.6-7, you can make your own determination if that is a high wingloading.

i dont have problem pulling my own reserve handle, i do have a problem missing gear that would make sure something gets out if i never pulled my reserve handle after a cutaway.

let me just put these scenarios out there

1... Cutaway from 2000ft with cypres and no rsl. lets say its a no pull on reserve(a reason could be dislocated left shoulder.)... Your cypres is set to fire if your still in freefall, so cypres should deploy reserve in this situation.

2. Cutaway from 2000ft with no cypres and rsl and no pull on reserve handle . RSL should pull reserve pin upon cutting away, deploying your reserve.

3. Cutaway from 2000 ft with NO cypres and NO rsl and no reserve pull (reason could be dislocated left shoulder). No device equals no reserve deployment which means your fucking dead.

Did i clear this up for you? i would rather either of the first two scenarios than the latter.

Seeing as i dont have the first scenario cypres, i am willing to take the risk of camera entanglement, snag factor, mis routed in case of a cutaway i have something pulling my reserve!




If you are affraid of your RSL being misrouted or snagging on your camera gear why do you put so much trust/ faith in your AAD? They are both man made and can both malfunction. I jump neither an AAD or RSL. I have had 3 reserve rides and every time I have not had a problem saving my life. Seeing someone sit here and say your AAD will get out your reserve when you never pull your reserve after a cutaway. If you are driving down the rode and drift into the other lane into on coming traffic are you going to just wait for your buddy to grab the wheel or would you grab the wheel? Why wouldnt you pull your reserve and just rely on your AAD?

Just my 2cents.

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Post 8

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I should add in that my left shoulder has suffered a dislocation before. If i ever found it dislocated on a skydive, i had peace of mind knowing my ADD will still fire if nothing is pulled. Or after a routine cutaway if my reserve arm was unusable.



This is one place where you said you would wait for your AAD. If your reserve arm is unusable you should use your right arm to reach for and pull the reserve.

Post 11:
Quote

So in that case i would rather have any device after a cutaway to get a reserve out than no backup device at all! Keep in mind both these devices can fail but i would take the chance over nothing being activated at all. All this is of course if i found myself with a dislocation in freefall!



This is another place where you indicated you would wait for an AAD fire.

Post 14:
Quote

1... Cutaway from 2000ft with cypres and no rsl. lets say its a no pull on reserve(a reason could be dislocated left shoulder.)... Your cypres is set to fire if your still in freefall, so cypres should deploy reserve in this situation.



This is another place you indicated you would wait for an AAD fire.


In Post 24 you mentioned a concern of becoming unconscious at some point on or after leaving the aircraft - but you didn't mention that concern up front. That is for many jumpers the primary reason for having an AAD, not a concern that their left arm, due to a prior injury, will be incapacitated.

It happens to be my opinion based on what you've said in this thread that you should sell your gear and invest in a ball, bag, shoes and accessories and join a friendly bowling league.



So you assume the guy with 2,500 jumps was trying everything to find his handle? but you assume since i said if nothing ever got pulled, i still had a small hope that my cypres i purchased would still do its job if all else fails? Does that mean i am just sitting there checking my altitude as i pass through 800ft to you? I simply implied in my post that if shit ever hit the fan,(but we know that doesnt happen) just like the post with the fatality report, that i have something there as a backup.
I guess its common sense that you would pull your handle if you could, just like the guy who burnt in because he didnt have a cypres or RSL, just like you assumed i am sure if i was him i would try anything aswell, instead of waiting around for a backup device.
i still yet to see my post where i said " if i cant use my arm, i would just wait till my cypres fired". there is a difference in that and saying, "if for some reason i tried everything and still could not get the reserve pulled, i would hope that my cypres would activate, just like if i was knocked out and didnt pull anything i would hope my cypres would activate then too!!

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I guess its common sense



Common sense would state that if you have a non-traditional view of a safety related topic in this sport, and a number of people who don't know you or jump with you take the time to point out that you have figured incorrectly, that you would heed that adivce and realize that they have no dog in this fight other than helping you to get your shit together.

Nobody is agreeing with you. Many people are dis-agreeing with you. If your version of common sense doesn't come to the conclusion that you are incorrect, then I would advise you not to subscribe to that brand of common sense in the future (which, of course, is a waste of time, because you won't listen to that either).

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I don't use an AAD or an RSL...My reasons are well thought out and logical, it's actually a safety concern having said items on me, during a lot of the jumps I do...not MY safety but the people I'm jumping with.

Long discussions regarding numerous various scenarios went along with the decision not to incorporate those things into my rig...It's an odds game and hopefully I don't get bit betting the wrong way.

However in your case, the reasoning you state regarding your choice...why you do it....why your are thinking of changing it...is on it's face flawed.

You are either intentionally 'betting bad odds' by eyeing rather obscure possible problems instead of getting ready for 'most likely'....OR....you may not fully understand the functions and capability parameters of your equipment.


Either way, it's just Skydiving...you do whatever ya want, i'm not here to insult you.
Just give some serious thought to the responses you are getting and consider the possibility you need to take a harder look at WHY you do it - the way you do. ;)










~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

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After seeing, a cut away followed by no outs, i believe in having one or the other.
No cypress, rsl
No rsl, cypress.
To add, i used to believe that if you have cypress you don't need rsl until last weekend.

And how bad of a linetiwst can it be under f111 super square reserve??? Much better than fumbling, fumbling, and bounce.
Bernie Sanders for President 2016

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I just dont get how you have a C license, decent amount of jumps, and are this cluless on how the gear is intended to work. Pretty scary if you ask me.

Like stated 1,000,000 times in the past, you cutaway at or below 1000 AGL, the odds of your AAD even firing are slim to none, let alone getting your reserve out.

Do yourself and others you jump with a favor, learn your gear, understand its functionality and make logical choices. You choose to jump with a bum shoulder, take as many precautions as you can.

also, WHY ARE YOU "AADLESS" FOR A FEW MONTHS?

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