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SFJason.

Better first canopy spectre or saber2?

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I actually used the search function and read reviews etc on the gear part of this website. I was curious from the more experienced jumpers what canopy would serve best. I have about 15 jumps on a saber2 at 1:1, and now am thinking about purchasing a canopy. I'm back on student gear at close to 1:1 at my new home dz. The rumors I've heard is that the spectre is a great canopy and would be a good choice. Your input is appreciated thanks!

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At an appropriate wingload they're both good canopy choices for a newer jumper; it really boils down to personal preference. If you can demo a Spectre you'll be able to compare it to the Sabre 2 you've already jumped and see which flight characteristics you prefer. Some DZs/gear shops will have demos available, or you can request a demo directly from PD.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

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I don't know if this applies to all 7 cells, but my Triathlon 160 seems to open a lot harder than the Sabre II's I used to rent (even if I roll the hell out of the nose and the tail).



The Spectre has a reputation as one of the softest opening canopies on the market; it's the choice of a lot of videographers for that very reason.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

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I recently demo'd both of these canopies...both 190 at about 1.1:1...two totally different canopies IMHO...

Sabre2 - Quick but comfortable openings, end cell closure on every jump (not a big deal, just a little annoying), tons of fun to fly, very responsive, fast turns, awesome flare

Spectre - crazy soft 800ft openings, not as responsive as the sabre2 but turns tight if you crank the toggle, not a boring canopy but not as fun as the sabre2, landings are meh...

Like everyone else said, demo both from PD...if I had to decide between these two Id buy a Sabre2

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Don't limit yourself to those two canopies. If you can demo more, go for it. I used a Sabre2 when I was a student, and it seemed strange to try out another canopy. I eventually tried out a Pilot and I've had it for about 260 jumps now.

Mine is loaded at 1.3. It is very responsive so you can have a lot of fun with it at altitude. You can pack it to open exactly how YOU want it. The flare is good. You won't get much at all out of the front risers, but that doesn't matter much for your first canopy. I've been in love with it since I've had it. Try one out if you can!

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Never jumped a Sabre, but I have about 450 jumps on Spectres. I'm not sure why you have limited yourself to these two canopies, but I think there are a lot better choices out there than the Spectre. I like my Storm better, and I like my Pilot much better! Pilots open comfortably without that long, long snivel of the Spectre, and the landings are MUCH better.
"Here's a good specimen of my own wisdom. Something is so, except when it isn't so."

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My Triathlon 160 seems to open a lot harder than the Sabre II's I used to rent



There's a video out there that Aerodyne put out back when they were Aerodyne Research; IIRC it was even shipped with Tri's for awhile. It shows a method of packing that makes the openings much better. Ask a few jumpers who've been around for awhile, someone has got to have a copy laying around.

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I like the Spectre but I need soft openings. I would say the average opening takes about 400ft and they are very soft. I also like the performance of both my 210 and 230. You can also shut them down in zero wind without more than a step or 2
You live more in the few minutes of skydiving than many people live in their lifetime

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If you like a steep descent and less flare than a nine cells, the Spectre would be the one to choose, if you want an extra forward speed + an improved flare you should get a Sabre 2. If you want forward speed, a good flare but still want to have a 7 cells, choose the Storm.
Personally, i find that the Sabre 2 is an all around canopy, actually, the most popular in the world now. One of the cause is that the Sabre 2 has a wide range of loading factor making that canopy good for advanced students and for people who are looking for relatively high performance as well.
Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

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You can also shut them down in zero wind without more than a step or 2



Thats not my opinion about my Spectre.
You might be correct that you can do so in lighter wingloads, but i really hate zero wind days when it comes to landing.
The canopy has enough flare to give you a soft landing, and enough to correct if you flared too early, but there is not enough flare to get rid of the forward speed.
I usually have to run like crazy in zero wind.

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I don't know if this applies to all 7 cells, but my Triathlon 160 seems to open a lot harder than the Sabre II's I used to rent (even if I roll the hell out of the nose and the tail).


How many jumps does it have in the lineset? My Tri160 opens like a dream no matter who packs it.

To the OP: the main difference for you at this stage will probably be the glide ratio. The Sabre2 will glide much better than the Spectre (even if flown at brakes). Flare on Sabre2 is much better also but probably won’t be a big deal at a low wing loading.
Since you are considering the Spectre, see if you can find an old Triathlon cheap for sale and jump it. You may save a lot of money to jump which is the most important thing for you now. Also, since an used Tri should be already depreciated it will lose only a small fraction of its resale value.
Engineering Law #5: The most vital dimension on any plan drawing stands the most chance of being omitted

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I actually used the search function and read reviews etc on the gear part of this website. I was curious from the more experienced jumpers what canopy would serve best. I have about 15 jumps on a saber2 at 1:1, and now am thinking about purchasing a canopy. I'm back on student gear at close to 1:1 at my new home dz. The rumors I've heard is that the spectre is a great canopy and would be a good choice. Your input is appreciated thanks!



both good canopies! alot of vid people use a spectre because of the openings, try both and see what you like!
Look out for the freefly team, Smelly Peppers. Once we get a couple years more experience we will be a force to be reckoned with in the near future! BLUES!

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I don't know if this applies to all 7 cells, but my Triathlon 160 seems to open a lot harder than the Sabre II's I used to rent (even if I roll the hell out of the nose and the tail).


How many jumps does it have in the lineset? My Tri160 opens like a dream no matter who packs it.



With one exception where I messed up the pack job to cause it, mine has always been really soft opening too ... also a 160. I was taught to never roll the nose on a tri. I use a basic pro pack and barely even tuck the nose.
As long as you are happy with yourself ... who cares what the rest of the world thinks?

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Have some one check out your landing tech, it sounds like your not finishing your flare and running out a 3/4 to 7/8 stroke.

I have been jumping Spectre's from 107 up to 170 for a few years now pretty consistent and I find i only run out the ones I don't finish my flare on.

But I am web diagnosing, so take it with a grain of salt.

Matt
An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

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Thanks for everyones replies, I haven't ruled out a pilot but was curious in the comparison of these two canopies. I would prefer a canopy with more glide that's just my personal choice at this time and skill set right now. I have jumped a spectre and a spectre 2 also but found them a bit more aggressive atleast the spectre but enjoyed their flight characteristics but I don't know much anyways so take it witha grain of salt. Thanks again everyone, I'm leaning towards the saber2 at this moment but would happily jump a spectre if given the chance.

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No, im giving it all i can.
The brakelines are a little shorter than factory setting, so i can reach it all.

But i got a pm from a rigger, and we are discussing if my lines are out of shape and/or if my brakesettings are correct.
And i really do think my lines are out of trim.

So to the OP (and everyone else), my opinion above might be wrong about the flare of the Spectre.
If you are going to buy a out of shape Spectre, be prepared to run ;)

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I would prefer a canopy with more glide that's just my personal choice at this time and skill set right now.



If that is truly what you are aiming for try and demo a PD Pulse and see how you like it since it is one of the best gliding canopies out there. Its quite responsive in toggles with quick but very comfortable and predictable openings, not to mention that its easier to pack and packs a size smaller due to the different bottom skin material. It also has quite a powerful flare IMO.

G'luck finding the canopy that is right for you! ;)
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If you're looking for glide, the Spectre's not the right choice for you. As others have mentioned, the Pilot (Aerodyne) and Pulse (PD) are both canopies that are trimmed with a very flat glide. (FWIW I did my first 200 jumps on a Spectre, the next 300 on a Pilot, and all since on a Pulse, so I've had a decent amount of experience with each). The one thing about a Pulse that might make it a less appealing choice is that since it hasn't been on the market that long, there's not as many on the used market, so you may have to be considerably more patient to come across a used one.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

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You can also shut them down in zero wind without more than a step or 2



Thats not my opinion about my Spectre.
You might be correct that you can do so in lighter wingloads, but i really hate zero wind days when it comes to landing.
The canopy has enough flare to give you a soft landing, and enough to correct if you flared too early, but there is not enough flare to get rid of the forward speed.
I usually have to run like crazy in zero wind.



What size are you flying? Are you slowing it down with a bit of brakes before the flair? Do you have a few inches of slack on the brakes like recommended?

I will admit there are occasions that I have a little forward speed when I shut it down, but only with a little wind at my back. Maybe its technique.
You live more in the few minutes of skydiving than many people live in their lifetime

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