Pull-out PC

[Airviking 0]

The rig I'm buying has one.
Never jumped one.
Any comments?

I believe you have my stapler.

[Jbag 0]

Don't fly a wingsuit

IHYD

[Airviking 0]

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Don't fly a wingsuit

No problem here...

I believe you have my stapler.

[airtwardo 6]

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The rig I'm buying has one.
Never jumped one.
Any comments?

I've had rigs with them, the only benefit I saw is you won't have a pilot-chute in tow and it does make the rig smoother...of course I've never had a pilotchute in tow with a throw-out either.

I thought about getting one on a rig I ordered a year back but read some logical comments against by Bill Booth and decided to go with a 'standard' throw-out.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[davelepka 4]

Get the rig, put it on packed with both canopies you'll be jumping, and see if you can reach behind you and touch the main pin. The reason is that if you end up with a floating pull out handle, the procedure is to reach back to the pin, and sweep your hand toward the bottom corner of the container. This manuver is designed to let you 'catch' the handle by the bridle, and still be able to open your main.

Floating handles are not all that uncommon on a pull out system, with some designs being more prone than others. If you cannot reach back far enough to be able to rescue a flaoting handle, you shouldn't jump a pull out.

If you find that you can easily reach back and touch the pin, then I'm sure some of the pro pull-out guys will chime in with all of the upsides, and then some other guys will point out the downsides. The truth is that you can jump either one safely if you know how, and keep your equipment properly maintained.

If you cannot comfortably reach the pin, converting a rig to a thow out is easy and should cost about $150, mostly for parts. You need a new pouch and PC/bridle, and a rigger to sew the pouch on the rig. The upside is that you end up with a fresh pouch, which is a spandex deal that eventaully wears out anyway. There's a chance if you bought a throw out rig, it would have needed a fresh pouch anyway.

[Rover 9]

Look around you, see what system the majority of people are using, and ask yourself why. If you decide to go with a 'pull-out' do yourself a favour and buy an AAD...

2 wrongs don't make a right - but 3 lefts do.

[Airviking 0]

I'm gonna look it over when I get it, maybe jump it a few times. And if it makes me uncomfortable, I'll have it converted to a BOC throw-out.

I believe you have my stapler.

[Southern_Man 0]

Think about packing. I think I remember you saying you are going to do all your packing yourself. That is an advantage. I've only been packing a couple of months but I have not seen a pull-out and would not know how to pack one. I am not sure anybody on my drop-zone jumps one.

Anyway, just know that if you use paid packers they may not be familiar with Pull-outs.

"What if there were no hypothetical questions?"

[virgin-burner 1]

i think in my country, out of the 500 or so jumpers i know or have seen, there's one guy jumping a pull-out..

of course, i know shit, and he maybe right, but personally, i'd definitely go for the throw-out; but i also like to put on a wingsuit every now and ten..

“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.”
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda

[Skydave103 0]

have had one since the late 90's. you will have a floating handle 1 time...it will never happen again.

I had it converted to have the pud on top of the pilot instead of under it.

1.no chance of it getting ripped from your hand before
getting a good throw (which you should always do)
2. just in case you have to hold your handle because
some one is above you (i wouldn't hold it long seeing
how you pilot, bridal, lines and bag are very close to
being out!)
3. get rid of the velcro and get a magnetic pud. It will
never come out! Best mod I ever came up with.
Have had it about 2 years and love it. If you don't
know where to get it done. Chuttingstar will do it.

LifeshouldNOTbeajourneytothegravewithawellpreservedbody,buttskidinsideways,cigarinone hand,martiniintheother,bodythoroughlyused upandscreaming:"WOO HOO!! What a ride!!!"

[Airviking 0]

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...I had it converted to have the pud on top of the pilot instead of under it.

Interesting...That makes it very close to a throw-out, no? But if a do make any mods, it'll be the total conversion to throwout.

I believe you have my stapler.

[chuckakers 369]

They work just fine and are pretty much "in-tow" proof.

Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

[Rover 9]

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They work just fine and are pretty much "in-tow" proof.

You could say that to a friend of mine who had been junping for 30 years before he nearly went in feeling for his floating pull out that was pretty much 'in tow proof'.

He switched to BOC and bought an AAD

2 wrongs don't make a right - but 3 lefts do.

[Skydave103 0]

but its not! no BOC to wear out, no bridle hanging out, clean rig on the bottom and eliminating a horse shoe mal.

definitely NOT the same. a small modification is better than a BOC

LifeshouldNOTbeajourneytothegravewithawellpreservedbody,buttskidinsideways,cigarinone hand,martiniintheother,bodythoroughlyused upandscreaming:"WOO HOO!! What a ride!!!"

[Skydave103 0]

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They work just fine and are pretty much "in-tow" proof.

You could say that to a friend of mine who had been junping for 30 years before he nearly went in feeling for his floating pull out that was pretty much 'in tow proof'.

He switched to BOC and bought an AAD

floating handle is a user error, not an equipment error.

LifeshouldNOTbeajourneytothegravewithawellpreservedbody,buttskidinsideways,cigarinone hand,martiniintheother,bodythoroughlyused upandscreaming:"WOO HOO!! What a ride!!!"

[Para5-0 0]

I have been jumping them for about 6 or so years now. Love them. Except the time my packer didnt cock the P/C and it was a dead p/c in tow. Not enough force to pull out the dbag...ugly.

[sundevil777 93]

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but its not! no BOC to wear out, no bridle hanging out, clean rig on the bottom and eliminating a horse shoe mal.

definitely NOT the same. a small modification is better than a BOC

A pull out PC does not eliminate horseshoe mals, and does not eliminate a PC in tow mal.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[Airviking 0]

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They work just fine and are pretty much "in-tow" proof.

You could say that to a friend of mine who had been junping for 30 years before he nearly went in feeling for his floating pull out that was pretty much 'in tow proof'.

He switched to BOC and bought an AAD

floating handle is a user error, not an equipment error.

That user error is the only thing that I'm concerned about.

A half-hearted pull on a throw-out can easily result in a floating handle, that I'll have to hunt for, or dump the reserve.

A half-hearted pull on a throw-out is no biggie. If it comes out of the pocket, it'll most likely deploy. If it stays part-way in the pocket, I know where to find it.

As far as PC in tow goes, the way I see it, it is usually the result of a packing error, mis-routed bridle, curved pin turned the wrong way or such. Packing errors like that can happen on either type of rig.

I think what it boils down to, is how confident I am that I can capture a floating handle. (Dave mentioned this.) If I don't feel 100% about it, I'll convert.

I believe you have my stapler.

[Skydave103 0]

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but its not! no BOC to wear out, no bridle hanging out, clean rig on the bottom and eliminating a horse shoe mal.

definitely NOT the same. a small modification is better than a BOC

A pull out PC does not eliminate horseshoe mals, and does not eliminate a PC in tow mal.

really??? doesnt eliminate a horseshoe! the only way you could have a horseshoe mal is if you continue to 'HOLD" the pilot chute and let your bridle flop out there in no man's land and good luck with that!! never said anything about a PC in tow. pud in tow yes, but not a PC in tow.

LifeshouldNOTbeajourneytothegravewithawellpreservedbody,buttskidinsideways,cigarinone hand,martiniintheother,bodythoroughlyused upandscreaming:"WOO HOO!! What a ride!!!"

[chuckakers 369]

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They work just fine and are pretty much "in-tow" proof.

You could say that to a friend of mine who had been junping for 30 years before he nearly went in feeling for his floating pull out that was pretty much 'in tow proof'.

He switched to BOC and bought an AAD

Ah yes, the floating pud (a term many won't remember).

Most folks I know who jump them learn how to reach to the center of the rig to recover it. Not a big deal if you can.

This stiff ol' man would be into his reserve. Of course I'd hum it a bit first, but that's another story.

Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

[sundevil777 93]

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but its not! no BOC to wear out, no bridle hanging out, clean rig on the bottom and eliminating a horse shoe mal.

definitely NOT the same. a small modification is better than a BOC

A pull out PC does not eliminate horseshoe mals, and does not eliminate a PC in tow mal.

really??? doesnt eliminate a horseshoe! the only way you could have a horseshoe mal is if you continue to 'HOLD" the pilot chute and let your bridle flop out there in no man's land and good luck with that!!

Yes, really! It doesn't eliminate a horseshoe, because a horseshoe mal can have other causes. Among other things lines have been snagged by a grommet that is not set completely, lines have wrapped around the flaps of the main container. Both of these scenarios have happened plenty of times, and are completely independent of the type of PC.

A throw out can be packed into the BOC pocket in a way that is very likely to have it extracted in the scenario of a horseshoe caused by a broken closing loop/closing pin coming out. Even if the PC doesn't get extracted on its own, I think it might be as easy to find a throw-out PC handle in this scenario as it is to find the floating handle of a pull-out PC.

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never said anything about a PC in tow. pud in tow yes, but not a PC in tow

You never said anything about it, but others did. I was adressing those comments. A PC in tow can still happen with a pull out, as shown by a post in this thread involving an uncocked PC.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[Skydave103 0]

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Yes, really! It doesn't eliminate a horseshoe, because a horseshoe mal can have other causes. Among other things lines have been snagged by a grommet that is not set completely, lines have wrapped around the flaps of the main container. Both of these scenarios have happened plenty of times, and are completely independent of the type of PC.

the horseshoe im talking about is where you bridle is out and your pin and pilot are still in.
Like you stated there are many kinds of horseshoe mal's.

LifeshouldNOTbeajourneytothegravewithawellpreservedbody,buttskidinsideways,cigarinone hand,martiniintheother,bodythoroughlyused upandscreaming:"WOO HOO!! What a ride!!!"

[sundevil777 93]

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Yes, really! It doesn't eliminate a horseshoe, because a horseshoe mal can have other causes. Among other things lines have been snagged by a grommet that is not set completely, lines have wrapped around the flaps of the main container. Both of these scenarios have happened plenty of times, and are completely independent of the type of PC.

the horseshoe im talking about is where you bridle is out and your pin and pilot are still in.
Like you stated there are many kinds of horseshoe mal's.

For a belly flyer, that kind of horseshoe wouldn't even matter much, because you would still have a normal deployment after pulling out the PC. It might scare your friends, and you wouldn't want to do flips with the bridle out, but it is not the traditional horseshoe mal where the container is open.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[Andy_Copland 0]

First Jump: Floating handle
Second Jump: About tore my arm off
Third Jump: Finally i get it.

They are great when the user isn't a complete idiot

No wingsuiting though.

1338

People aint made of nothin' but water and shit.

Until morale improves, the beatings will continue.

[hookitt 0]

I love the pull out. However. for some reason, manufacturers still put out poor designs. My first pull out I built myself. I modeled it after a VooDoo pull-out I used a few times. On my current rig, I fixed it the day I got it. I've had zero trouble with either one. Mind you I've only put a few thousand jumps on a pull outs.

Floating handles are not that common. If they are, it's a bad design or it's rigged incorrectly. If it floats, chances are it was a hard pull.

When you pack a throw out, the bridle must have a clear shot from the pouch to the pin, right? The same thing goes for a pull-out. The handle needs a clear shot to the pin and it comes right out.

My opinion is that a properly designed pull-out is superior to almost all throw outs.

Pull the handle, and put it straight out to the side and let go. An aggressive throw is not required. (Same goes for a throw out actually)

In my case there are no cons to owning it. My rig isn't suitable for winqsuit flying. It simply doesn't hold a reasonable canopy so it's not a concern. I'm primarily a freeflyer and AFF instructor and have been a rigger for most of my jumping days. It has been by far, the easiest pilot chute for me to maintain.

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto