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Gators1240

Financing Gear

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Im sure there have been multiple threads on this before but the most recent thing I could find was 3 years ago and lets be honest, things change. Has anyone ever financed their first rig? I am depserately in need of a rig and it is getting expensive to keep renting something. However I dont have the multiple thousands of dollars required to buy one. Does anyone know anywhere that would offer financing for skydiving gear?

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Lot's of people finance their first rig, It's big hunk of change, especially after getting licensed and renting gear of awhile.

Try looking into 'creative' options before you go the conventional route. Ask around the DZ, the staff, DZO, fun jumpers, riggers, etc. See if anyone has anything that would work for you, a canopy, container, or reserve, and see if you can score a 'pay over time' deal. You may have to agree to leave the rig at the DZ unitl it's paid, but sooner or later it will be yours.

I don't know if you pack, but you can trade pack jobs for gear with the DZO, or even other jumpers. If you can find a guy with a main for $500, maybe you can owe the guy 50 pack jobs and $250 cash. Even if not, pakcing is an easy way to make a couple hundred dollars a weekend, money you can put toward your rig. Just like conventional financing, if you have some money to put down, you stand a better chance at getting financed. If a guy has a container for $800, and you can give him $500, and $50 a week for 6 weeks, he might go for it.

Let's keep in mind that his might not be 'top shelf' stuff, but if it's airworthy and gets you in the air it does the trick. What you do is put together a cheapo rig for $1500 or $2000, and save your pennies while you jump it for 6 moths or a year. once you have $1500 or $2000 saved up, sell the cheapo for what you paid for it, and take your $3000 or $4000 dollars and get something a little more 'modern'.

Once you get that first 'modern' rig, the rest is easy. When you want to change rigs, keep your eyes peeled for a good deal and often times you can upgrade for little or nothing out of pocket. Sell what you have and use the cash to buy the next one. Even if you ened to kick in some cash to get what you want, again you have time to save your money wihile you jump the rig you currently own.

Otherwsie, credit cards are probably the easiest way to finance anything, and with Paypal available to anyone, you can use your CC with private sellers. It's not the cheapest, but probably the easiest.

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signature loan based upon a savings account at your local credit union (at a bank even?).

I know they cost some cash nowdays; I just bought a new rig w/aad.. Back in the day (~90's), 2500 would go a long way.. but you didn't get an AAD and the increased performance/longevity of zeroP.

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I recently bought my first rig, sounds like I was in the same dilema as you!
I went to my bank and applied for a personal loan. The interest is fixed, (very low too!), and I could choose how long I wanted to pay it off (I picked 2 years) and the monthly payment is directly debited out of my checking account. The payment amount will not change over that time period.
I found my rig on a facebook group called "buy/sell skydiving gear", the guy lived about 2 hours from me, drove it up, wrote him a bank check, and it was a deal :)

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Save up and pay cash for it. Going into debt for something that will lose value is not a wise financial move.

Yes, I know that you want it BAD, but think about the financial mess people are in and in most cases they put themselves there by not being responsible.

I am 99% sure this advice will be ignored, and about 90% sure that someone will claim I am being stupid and to "live for the moment".... But all it takes is one look at the financial situations of so many people to know that going into debt for toys is not a good move.
"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

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Depending on your job and credit situation getting a signature loan at your financial institution could be a good way to go. And although rigs do depreciate in value, if you get a popular container in very conservative colors, are of an average build, and take good care of the system you will find that you will be able to resell it for near what you paid for it.

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And although rigs do depreciate in value, if you get a popular container in very conservative colors, are of an average build, and take good care of the system you will find that you will be able to resell it for near what you paid for it.



No way would a rig with 500-1000 jumps sell for close to retail.

If you think that, I have a Vector 3 that I'll gladly sell for the bargain price of 1500 bucks to you.
"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

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And although rigs do depreciate in value, if you get a popular container in very conservative colors, are of an average build, and take good care of the system you will find that you will be able to resell it for near what you paid for it.



No way would a rig with 500-1000 jumps sell for close to retail.

If you think that, I have a Vector 3 that I'll gladly sell for the bargain price of 1500 bucks to you.



While new gear takes a huge depreciation hit; used gear holds it's value fairly well, doesn't it?

The big drop has already happened, and reselling used gear can give you a decent return.

Depreciation of a buck or so per jump for canopies, age on AADs (Cypres anyway) and wear and tear on contaiers.
At least that's what I've been told.
"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

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used gear holds it's value fairly well, doesn't it?



If the price paid for it when it's first purchased (used) is a fair one, then it'll be likely to hold that value reasonably well. If you overpay at first ... you may take more of a hit.

My own personal examples:

Spectre 230, purchased with 400 jumps and a new lineset for $850. Sold 2 years later with a total of 600 jumps on it for $800. Total cost of ownership = $50 or $0.25/jump.

Pilot 210, purchased with 200 jumps on it for $900. Sold 3 years later with a total of 500 jumps and a new lineset ($300) on it for $1100. Total cost of ownership = $100 or $0.33/jump.

Of course, a lot depends on the demand for a particular size/style of canopy. Pilots and Spectres are very popular, and mine were in sizes that are often hard to find but desired by newbies. I was able to and willing to wait for my price.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

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It can also depend on the number of jumps you would do while saving up for your own gear. I'll use my case as an example. I did about 15 jumps a month right off student status. My DZ charged $25 per jump including pack job. That would run me $375 per month. At six months it would be $2250 paid and nothing to show for it. I found a complete system of a '94 Talon with PD canopies on here that included an AAD with 2 years left of it. It wasn't pretty, but was affordable. Even with some minor maintenance, final cost was under $2k. I paid cash, but even if I financed it in the six months of the rental period example, current interest rate on a personal loan would push final around the $2250. So at the end of the six months, loan is paid off and I have the rig as well. I bet I could sell the rig today minus the AAD and get near $1500 since the used gear market follows price increases of new gear. I put 400 jumps on the rig and still have it.

I encourage every jumper to buy resellable gear as soon as possible. It doesn't have to be pretty or the newest. There is always some new jumper looking for an affordable newbie sized rig to use as they get enough jumps for a canopy size they will stay on long enough to warrant a new/pretty container.
50 donations so far. Give it a try.

You know you want to spank it
Jump an Infinity

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What is going rate for new? $7K?



Very rough numbers. Haven't priced a full rig lately, but figure $1500-2000 for basic container, $1700 for main, $1000 for reserve and $1400 for AAD, you do the math( or maths for our non US of A readers).

Dealer final prices can vary widely.
50 donations so far. Give it a try.

You know you want to spank it
Jump an Infinity

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I may not have worded my post in the way that I was thinking it. To keep it easy:
If you pay $6K for a whole rig with AAD (most people take it out and put it in their next kit). Your a 5'8"-5'10" 170 lb male and you have a mostly black Javelin Odyssey with some blue accents, throw in a standard 170 reserve and a popular 170 main (Pilot, Sabre2, etc).
You have it for two years and jump it 500 times and in the mean time you take quite good care of it. Now, if you have the upper end size of container it could possibly fit a 190 main which are in quite high demand for people just off student status or people who are happy flying something a bit more conservative. I dont think it would be out of order to ask $4.5K for it and maybe get talked down to $4K maybe high $3K. Now you have sold it for $2K-$3K less than you bought it and you still have an AAD in your pocket, and you are 500 jumps more experienced. Your mileage may vary, of course. Thats what I meant when I said "near". I didnt mean a couple hundred bucks.

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I dont think it would be out of order to ask $4.5K for it and maybe get talked down to $4K maybe high $3K. Now you have sold it for $2K-$3K less than you bought it and you still have an AAD in your pocket, and you are 500 jumps more experienced.



Just a quick look at the complete gear kits for sale on here don't show 4k being a reasonable asking price. 3k seems like a more reasonable number (based on a peek, not a number crunch).

For 2-3k you could get a used rig -AAD (again,based on the classifieds here and personal exp).

And a 2-3k hit on a 7k purchase is not really a good return, IMO. Add in finance charges too. taking out a 12% loan on 7k would add 1680.00 to the total *if* it was paid in 2 years.
"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

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My DZ charged $25 per jump including pack job.



Many DZ's have daily rental rates. SDC used to charge 60/day I think and only the last jump had to be packed by a rigger.

Dallas had daily rates also I think.... Where I learned they started charging me rental rates and then just stopped one day.

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So at the end of the six months, loan is paid off and I have the rig as well.



*IF* the loan is paid off. I have seen this time after time in my 18 years in the sport... People buy on credit and when the bill is due they can't pay it. I got caught up in the game years ago when I used to buy blocks of tickets on credit... My logic was that the discount was worth it.... But I ran out of tickets before I paid the card off... Whip out the card and get another 100 tickets. That year I made close to 500 jumps, I'd hate to do the math to find out how much OVER retail I paid due to finance charges.

If people are financially savvy enough, they don't normally have to finance a 2-3k dollar expense.

I have a buddy that has a new boat and a new motorcycle.... Of course his house is in foreclosure, but that does not matter... He has a new bike and boat, right?

I understand the passion of wanting everything now and making hundreds of jumps a year..... But the final cost has to be considered and should not be taken lightly... and the trend around skydiving is people leap first, and look later.

Buying a set of skydiving gear (hobby) on credit has to be the worst financial planning move since taking money out of your 401k to buy gear. A 7k purchase on a CC will add $1172.50 to the total price if you pay 375/mth.

*Based on an industry average of 16.75% right now.
http://www.indexcreditcards.com/credit-card-rates-monitor/

Also understand that I know people are just going to ignore me on this......

1. Buy used
2. Pay cash
"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

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Just a quick look at the complete gear kits for sale on here don't show 4k being a reasonable asking price. 3k seems like a more reasonable number (based on a peek, not a number crunch).

For 2-3k you could get a used rig -AAD (again,based on the classifieds here and personal exp).

And a 2-3k hit on a 7k purchase is not really a good return, IMO. Add in finance charges too. taking out a 12% loan on 7k would add 1680.00 to the total *if* it was paid in 2 years.



I looked on the classifieds as well but I didnt spend that much time, because I really dont particulary care. During my quick look I saw complete rigs that were mostly built in the 90s for that price, and some that fit a a more skilled demographic. I quickly looked at a dealer website that was offering a full kit for around $5K, but I didnt read the fine print so who knows what it really entails. I added 1K for the rounded out price of AAD for quick math purposes, hence my 6K figure.

My example was based on what wouid be a highly desirable used rig in a common configuration that would still be sought after by people looking for a first rig. And the rig in my example would have only been two years old. So of course I skewed the stats to make myself look like a used gear genius. I thought thats what we're supposed to do here. I guess Im doing it wrong.

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DO NOT BUY A SKYDIVING RIG WITH A CREDIT CARD!!

I did this when i started skydiving many moons ago, and ended up with over 9k in credit card debt. however, i defaulted on the card as there was no way i could make the payments, and then paid 2k to clear the balance 4 years later, and my credit score is now back up to where it was pre-purchase. so I guess on second thought, if you're cool with having a credit score in the sub 400s for a few years and settling for a fraction of the amount that you spent, and waiting a few more years for your credit to recover, then it works out. LOL.:ph34r:

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I never planned on using a credit card to purchase a rig for two reasons. One I don't own a credit card nor do I want one, and two I would end up paying way more than I should because of high credit card interest rates. I was thinking of taking out a small loan (2-3k) to go towards my rig (after my recent cross country move I only have about 2k left in the bank). My biggest problem currently is finding a good used rig that is the size I want. I've been jumping a 240 and don't want to downsize too much, possibly 230 but no smaller than a 210 for the time being. As far as what I have looked at most rigs I've seen are 190 or smaller

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>I am depserately in need of a rig and it is getting expensive to
> keep renting something.

I'd try to buy outright. There's a lot of reasonable cheap gear out there if you forego the latest shiniest stuff. A Vector II with a Raven I and a very used Sabre 1 170 can be had for around $1000.

Then you'll be able to jump, avoid rental fees and save for what you _really_ want.

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