billvon 2,396 #76 September 15, 2010 >It could be argued that the mandatory inspections are actually a weakness >in comparing device reliability. I could suggest that Brand A needs this >because their self-test has limited ability to detect faults in sensor outputs, >whereas perhaps Brand B has multiple redundant or complementary >sensors allowing it to validate the precision of sensor outputs. An ideal system (in terms of reliability) would do both, no? >Meanwhile, a Brand B device has similar precision drift but it gets >detected as soon as it goes outside of allowable tolerances. Unfortunately, without using calibrated pressures, it's difficult to detect that in modern silicon strain-type pressure sensors. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #77 September 16, 2010 QuoteThis line of discussion started when Dave stated that he found it hard to believe that a device could be made that could be relied on to work without regularly scheduled testing and maintenance. Since I'm the stepping off point for this line of discussion, let's be clear that I did not say I found it hard to believe that a device could be made to work for long periods of time without regular maintenence. What I found hard to believe was that a jumper would be happy to jump a device featuring a cutter around their reserve closing loop, and a computer calling the shots, without regular maintenence. The truth is that the ideal situation is both. You build the device to the best of your abilities AND you bring it in for regular check-ups to be sure everything is how you intended it to be in the first place. This seems a far more prudent SOP than, 'Here you go, I'm sure this thing will be fine for 20 years, have a nice life'. Considering the current 'standard' for reglar AAD check-ups is every four years, and as previously mentioned, rigs need to be opened every six months anyway, submitting to such a schedule is not much of an imposition. It just seems to me that to be resistant to such an idea is nothing more than a case of severe denial. To wrap that thing around your reserve closing loop and just, 'hope for the best', for an, 'undetermined length of time', hardly seems like an intelligent approach to skydiving, or skydiving equipment maintenence. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #78 September 16, 2010 How often are airbags in cars inspected and or require preventative maintenance of their electronics? Don't they have a diagnostic check of their functionality when you start the car up? Things that make you go HMMM."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 93 #79 September 16, 2010 QuoteHow often are airbags in cars inspected and or require preventative maintenance of their electronics? Don't they have a diagnostic check of their functionality when you start the car up? Things that make you go HMMM. At least some (Honda) have requirements in the owner's manual that they be serviced after 10 years. I don't know what is supposed to be done at the time (I should know, really). I suspect many other mfgs require such at least officially in their manuals, although it is usually ignored of course.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #80 September 16, 2010 QuoteHow often are airbags in cars inspected and or require preventative maintenance of their electronics? Don't they have a diagnostic check of their functionality when you start the car up? Things that make you go HMMM. That makes me consider the amount of time and money the auto companies have invested in airbags and airbag systems. Literally tens of millions of dollars or more. It makes me go on to think of the number of airbags that have been on the road, and the track record they have of 'doing no harm' without any sort of periodic checks. Then I move that thinking over the AADs and skydiving, and I realize that far less time and money went into developing any AAD. Even if it was considerable when compared to my checkbook, the combined airbag R&D money at Honda, Toyota, GM, BMW, ect, dwarfs any budget Airtec ever had. Then I go on to think of the number of AADs out there in succesful operation for more then 4 years without any checks, and I compare that to the number of ADDs out there that have been checked on a 4-year cycle. I end up thinking that having your AAD inspected on a regular basis is a good idea. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 93 #81 September 16, 2010 Plenty of airbags have activated when they should not have. Not a high percentage of course, but they are not without incident.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likestojump 3 #82 September 16, 2010 Let's also not forget that airbags are not subjected to the extreme pressure/temperature changes nor the G-forces that the AADs are subjected to on every jump. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
timmyfitz 0 #83 September 16, 2010 QuoteLet's also not forget that airbags are not subjected to the extreme pressure/temperature changes nor the G-forces that the AADs are subjected to on every jump. If you live in an area that has 4 seasons your airbag will go through some temperature extremes. Below zero in the winter and above 100 degrees in the summer. Also during the winter the airbag will be very cold while the car is sitting. Once you get in and start driving/turn on the heat, the airbag is going to warm up. On the other hand, during a skydive to 13,000 feet the average temperature change you are likely to see will be about 45 to 50 degrees. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likestojump 3 #84 September 16, 2010 I was more concerned with how fast the change occurs. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
timmyfitz 0 #85 September 16, 2010 QuoteI was more concerned with how fast the change occurs. I would think an AAD buried inside a container would be fairly insulated and wouldn't see that much of a change for the short period of time you are in the air. I could be wrong though. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likestojump 3 #86 September 16, 2010 you are probably right as far as the temperature is concerned, but the rapid pressure changes and the G forces should not be affected by the location inside the container. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kevin922 0 #87 September 16, 2010 Just so i'm clear, we're all in agreement that the FXC 12000 is the best AAD right? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 3 #88 September 16, 2010 Quote Just so i'm clear, we're all in agreement that the FXC 12000 is the best AAD right? I would prefer a Sentinel AOD. http://www.flickr.com/photos/43867826@N07/4387443550/ SparkyMy idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites