Line stows...

[skydiverkeith 1]

Currently, I use single wrap 1.25 inch rubber on the grommet stows and double wrap 2 inch rubber on all others. However, I have heard from some that you shouldn't double wrap any stows...

Blue skies,
Keith Medlock

[tetra316 0]

It's not about single or double wrapping, it's about tension. It needs to be appropriate and even.

[SEREJumper 1]

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It's not about single or double wrapping, it's about tension. It needs to be appropriate and even.

+1 on above. I've used tube stows on my last 1200 jumps without a problem. I change them out about every 35-40 jumps or earlier if they show excessive wear. I really think that is the key, especially with tube stows. I use large tubes for locking stows, small tubes for line stows and thats for micro line.

We're not fucking flying airplanes are we, no we're flying a glorified kite with no power and it should be flown like one! - Stratostar

[skydiverkeith 1]

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It's not about single or double wrapping, it's about tension. It needs to be appropriate and even.

What would you define as "appropriate"?

Blue skies,
Keith Medlock

[Beatnik 2]

Your locking stows are the most important ones that they have good tension on them. The rest is mainly for organization and not critical or need the tension as much. If you look at your reserve freebag it works on this principle and it is completely reliable as it has been proven for years. Additionally, there are more and more main bags that are like this with just locking stows and the rest loosely held in a pouch.

On my rig the locking stows are tight and the rest of stows can almost fall out. There has never been a indication of a problem in hundreds of jumps because it is working like the mentioned above.

I have never figured out why people like double stowing. The parachute inflation is what you want slow, the lines unstowing isn't going to have an affect on the actual it. Plus your pilot chute creates a lot of force and a double stow is not going to slow it down.

[peek 20]

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I have never figured out why people like double stowing.

One of the reasons I have heard is that it is easier on the fingers than having a smaller rubber band.

I also think it is a leftover myth from those believing that "line dump" is causing hard openings (with any frequency.)

[tetra316 0]

I use large rubber bands on the first two locking stows and double wrap then. Small rubber bands are used on the rest. I use large and double stow simply because it is easier and quicker for me to stow them. I could use small and single stow for those two but it would be harder on my hands. Double stowing is just an ease of use method is all.

[FLJB 0]

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Your locking stows are the most important ones that they have good tension on them. The rest is mainly for organization and not critical or need the tension as much. If you look at your reserve freebag it works on this principle and it is completely reliable as it has been proven for years. Additionally, there are more and more main bags that are like this with just locking stows and the rest loosely held in a pouch.

On my rig the locking stows are tight and the rest of stows can almost fall out. There has never been a indication of a problem in hundreds of jumps because it is working like the mentioned above.

I have never figured out why people like double stowing. The parachute inflation is what you want slow, the lines unstowing isn't going to have an affect on the actual it. Plus your pilot chute creates a lot of force and a double stow is not going to slow it down.

This.

On all my rigs I only use small rubber bands on vectran lines and the non-locking stows are so loose there is barely any tension on them. i don't know when the last time i broke a rubber band was... I don't have hard openings or off heading openings or anything else weird with my openings and never have.

I think double stowing large rubber bands are a function of paid packers who save their fingers a little bit given the number of pack jobs they do... but they end up breaking quicker and have to be replaced. It all depends on who does your packing...

[Beatnik 2]

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In Reply To
I have never figured out why people like double stowing.

One of the reasons I have heard is that it is easier on the fingers than having a smaller rubber band.

I also think it is a leftover myth from those believing that "line dump" is causing hard openings (with any frequency.)

I think it is more of people being lazy on the paid packer side of things. When I started I paid for the sport packing and was doing 40+ a day. I used the rubber bands right for the occasion. Sure double wrapping is easier but I wanted to give them quality not a easy way out. Plus if packers use hand moisturizer during the day they will never have a problem. It might not be a manly thing but having torn up dry hurting hands sucks.

[spootch 0]

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On my rig the locking stows are tight and the rest of stows can almost fall out.

mmmm... lines coming unstowed in the wind leaves you open for a lot of other mals, knots etc. I think PD recomends 12 lbs?

[Beatnik 2]

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mmmm... lines coming unstowed in the wind leaves you open for a lot of other mals, knots etc. I think PD recomends 12 lbs?

Please explain. They don't fall out, they can almost. There is enough to keep them organized. Look at a lot of stowless bags that people have used for years. They don't have the tension you mention and haven't contributed to mals. Same thing with freebags. I don't really see any weight in the idea that it leaves me open to any mals whatsoever. If you know of something that can contribute to a mal in this situation and not in any other setup mention, I would really like to know. I collect a lot of data on things like this and cannot see any factor that would be unique to this situation that would cause concern.

[Chrisky 0]

A similar question cropped up last week or so in a different thread. In my post there is an article by PD about openings including a paragraph on line stows.
Ie how much pull force the rubbers should create, etc.

The mind is like a parachute - it only works once it's open.
From the edge you just see more.
... Not every Swooper hooks & not every Hooker swoops ...

[spootch 0]

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mmmm... lines coming unstowed in the wind leaves you open for a lot of other mals, knots etc. I think PD recomends 12 lbs?

Please explain. They don't fall out, they can almost. There is enough to keep them organized. Look at a lot of stowless bags that people have used for years. They don't have the tension you mention and haven't contributed to mals. Same thing with freebags. I don't really see any weight in the idea that it leaves me open to any mals whatsoever. If you know of something that can contribute to a mal in this situation and not in any other setup mention, I would really like to know. I collect a lot of data on things like this and cannot see any factor that would be unique to this situation that would cause concern.

Ask PD.

We could also ask the question whats wrong with having a "snug" stow?

[topdocker 0]

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mmmm... lines coming unstowed in the wind leaves you open for a lot of other mals, knots etc. I think PD recomends 12 lbs?

So why don't CRW jumpers that use a tailpocket/daiper get more tension knots/mals? They are exiting at a slower speed, have big, fat Dacron lines held with one stow, and jump all ranges of wing loading; but tension knots are almost unheard of on well-trimmed CRW gear.

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Jump more, post less!

[Beatnik 2]

I have done work for a few companies and they have never had or mentioned a problem with my setups.

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We could also ask the question whats wrong with having a "snug" stow?

On bags with unbalanced stows (typically older d-bags), having very tight stows or double stows can induce line twists and cause other problems. Like I mentioned before the locking stows are the main ones to be concerned with. You do not want those to come undone before the rest is unstowed.

[fcajump 153]

Missing option:

Single wrap on locking, double on all others - Tube.
(yea... I know... against MFG instructions... lets just say I've been "testing" it that way for only 20 years...)

'course I also keep the stows at ~2" at most and split stow... just to keep fanning the flames.

Its the way I learned, its worked for me/my gear in that time.

JW

PS- NO, I do NOT recommend doing this, I recommend you learning your own gear and what works best for you.

Always remember that some clouds are harder than others...