Another spectra vs. dacron thred

[antonija 0]

What I'm looking for is a photo of lines PD uses on their canopies (Spectre and PD reserve) side-by-side. I've found some images of the lines on paragear catalogue but they are always single line. They also have several different braids of each material plus several different strengths.

If anyone can provide me with a photo of spectra and dacron PD uses side-by-side with some kind of reference to size I'm looking at (like a penny or a ruler placed next to the lines)...

I understand the need for conformity. Without a concise set of rules to follow we would probably all have to resort to common sense. -David Thorne

[likestojump 3]

here you go. Spectre with microline on the left, and dacron on the right

Why do you want to see a pic ?

[riggerpaul 1]

Are those two pics taken from the same distance?

I didn't see anything in the pic that gives me some scale.

To me, it looks like the left pic is closer.

(Not a big deal to me. My Spectre has a Dacron CF lineset already.)

[antonija 0]

Well the only dacron lines I've seen so far were some really wide ones used on a student canopies I jumped during my course. I have seen images of round braid dacron and not-as-wide-as-my-student-canopy dacrop, and I want to know what kind of lines PD uses for their canopies. I know how spectra looks so the comparison should make some sense to me.

I will be ordering new canopies in near future and I wanted to know what I'll get.

I've read several times that dacron adds ______ (some/quite few/alot) of bulk to the packjob. I've also read and heard from others that the difference is barely noticeable and I shouldn't make my decision based upon the added bulk thigie. This picture request is so I can better understand what kind of added bulk I'll be dealing with.

EDIT: Thanks for the picture!!

I understand the need for conformity. Without a concise set of rules to follow we would probably all have to resort to common sense. -David Thorne

[skydiverek 54]

I think it is safe to assume that Dacron is twice as bulky as Spectra, and adds from half to one pack volume (as in "next canopy size up").

See this document for Spectra vs Dacron pack volumes:

http://www.pia.com/piapubs/TSDocuments/TS-104CanopyVolume.pdf

[JerryBaumchen 1,047]

Hi antonija,

Let me suggest that you call PD and discuss this with them. Email works also.

There are people there who will take the time & have the knowledge to discuss this in detail with you.

Also, I think that if you ask, they would be willing to send you a small sample of each line type. Would a foot or so of each type answer some questions for you?

Best of luck & I admire your wanting to be an informed buyer/jumper,

JerryBaumchen

[faulknerwn 36]

They're actually pretty close. I had a Triathlon 99 with Spectra line, and this summer bought a new lineset that was dacron. When we first got it, several of us thought they screwed up and sent us spectra because it was so close in size. I jump that thing in a small Power Racer - the pack volume increased maybe 1-2% in size. It was a pretty small difference.

(Definitely made the openings softer though!)

[antonija 0]

Quote

I think it is safe to assume that Dacron is twice as bulky as Spectra, and adds from half to one pack volume (as in "next canopy size up").

This is the kind of reply I get from the internet forumz. When I talked to my rigger about this he said he likes to pack dacron reserves over spectra ones because dacron lines fold better (or dacron actually folds when spectra kind of "breakes"; not really breakes, but stays folded far longer while dacron "springs" back when released from container).
He also said in his experience dacron does not add enough bulk so one would notice it while packing main (which are not packed as tidy as reserves).

I do appreciate efforts of trying to scientifically measure pack volumes and different factors affecting it, but when field reports (my rigger for example) can not confirm those findings (they are either so small that one doesn't notice them or they are not there at all) then I prefer to hear from people who have worked with different materials and can tell me first hand if there was indeed a difference between two linetypes.

I've contacted PD about this and they said they will provide me with a samples of lines they use on their canopies. The only downside is that I don't live in US and shipping will take looooong time :\
But having a physical example of materials will make it much easier to estimate pack volume difference and neatness of folds :)

I understand the need for conformity. Without a concise set of rules to follow we would probably all have to resort to common sense. -David Thorne

[antonija 0]

I asked and I recieved
(I must say that the main canopy Dacron line (3rd one from the top) they sent me is just about the thickest line I've ever seen. I think they only use this one for steering lines... )

I understand the need for conformity. Without a concise set of rules to follow we would probably all have to resort to common sense. -David Thorne

[Ronaldo 0]

If you’re not buying a high performance canopy then Dacron may be a good option. Spectra (Microline) is thinner and presents less drag but it transmits more opening shock and loses a lot of trim. Dacron is more dimensionally stable and also more “elastic”.
For high performance canopies IMHO Vectran and HMA are the best lines (unless you’re planning to jump a totally out of trim canopy for a long time).

Engineering Law #5: The most vital dimension on any plan drawing stands the most chance of being omitted

[antonija 0]

As far as I know microline (spectra) will go out of trim in few hundred jumps. From talking with experienced canopy pilots I know I was told that when you jump high performance canopies at competitive level you will notice change in trim over time, but with bigger, more docile canopies (in my case even 7 cell) the difference is so small that I probably wont be able to notice it.

Also Dacron line for main canopies PD sent me is like 5-10 times thicker than 825 spectra. Now my canopy is already listed by container manufacturer as "full fitting" so I really don't wanna push it with thicker lines.

So from information I got from other people and from PD I will probably have dacron (untreated) lines on my reserve and 825 spectra on my main.

I understand the need for conformity. Without a concise set of rules to follow we would probably all have to resort to common sense. -David Thorne

[iwanttofly 0]

525 Dacron (top) vs Spectre 825

[riggerrob 558]

... Dacron line for main canopies PD sent me is like 5-10 times thicker than 825 spectra. Now my canopy is already listed by container manufacturer as "full fitting" so I really don't wanna push it with thicker lines.

So from information I got from other people and from PD I will probably have dacron (untreated) lines on my reserve and 825 spectra on my main.

................................................................................

Agreed!
If you buy Dacron (main) lines, your packers will hate you and they will pack slower.
825 Spectra lines will last about as long as 800 pound Dacron lines ... about 800 jumps. After 800 jumps, the Spectra will have shrunk so far out of trim that openings will turn "ugly" and it will flare like a bag-lock.
After 800 jumps, you will start breaking Dacron lines. Dacron steering lines fail first.

[Di0 1]

Can I pitch in the discussion?
I have a new Saf2 149 that came with Vectran 500 lines. I'm very happy with them, always had soft openings even with my crappy pack jobs, very "smooth" to the touch, I'd say almost pleasant to spool them around.

I also have a 12 years old Saf2 149 that is in serious need of a re-line and who knows what line size/type is on it. I was thinking of re-lining with Vectran 500 as well, since that seems to be the "default" lineset I got on my new canopy from NZ Aerosport without asking for anything special, just curious though: what type of lines are they? How long do they usually last? Do I have other comparable options? Just so that I can make a somewhat informed decision. I tried to look for info but somehow I didn't find anything clear.

I'm standing on the edge
With a vision in my head
My body screams release me
My dreams they must be fed... You're in flight.