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canadianjumper

Which risers/velcro-less toggles would you buy??

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OK,
I have a VooDoo, love the rig, hate the velcro-less toggle set up.. Way to many toggle releases on opening >:(and no means to stow access brake lines.

Have browsed the forums and have narrowed it down to either the RWS "Tru-Lok" or Velocity sports! I really like the PdF but cannot find website. Are they still in Business??

Any input on this subject is greatly appreciated! :)
Thanks
T

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I had some velcro risers convereted to "tru-lock -like" risers. It's fairly simple - you unpick the velcro, add a pocket for the straight pin on the bottom, and add the elastic for keeping the line. On the toggle you just add the straight pin on the bottom.
Should be a $25 jobbie by any competent rigger with a straight and zigzag machine. And you can have the risers YOUR way :)

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Just curious, what year is your Voodoo? I also have one, and mine are great, and have a keeper loop of material on the back side for the excess brake line. Edit to add ... put together with a Triathlon ... risers come with it, or the rig ... I'm not sure .... riggers??
As long as you are happy with yourself ... who cares what the rest of the world thinks?

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risers come with the rig.

a friend had an issue with brake fires on a javelin, and was told by derek thomas that the keepers for the tip of the toggle are tight when new, but tend to curl around a bit with wear, resulting in a loose toggle. the solution was a row of stitches on the keeper to tighten it up again. no more brake fires!B|
"Hang on a sec, the young'uns are throwin' beer cans at a golf cart."
MB4252 TDS699
killing threads since 2001

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I am a HUGE fan of the RWS/UPT Truelock toggles.
~D
Where troubles melt like lemon drops Away above the chimney tops That's where you'll find me.
Swooping is taking one last poke at the bear before escaping it's cave - davelepka

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I have NEVER had a brake fire with either of my (true lock) V3's!
About 600 jump's and no problem. Yea i know 600 on true locks is not that much, but I figured if it was an issue I would have seen it by now!
Nothing opens like a Deere!

You ignorant fool! Checks are for workers!

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I have NEVER had a brake fire with either of my (true lock) V3's!
About 600 jump's and no problem. Yea i know 600 on true locks is not that much, but I figured if it was an issue I would have seen it by now!



I've had two in around 200 jumps.

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t:
In Reply To
I have NEVER had a brake fire with either of my (true lock) V3's!
About 600 jump's and no problem. Yea i know 600 on true locks is not that much, but I figured if it was an issue I would have seen it by now!

I've had two in around 200 jumps.



I've not havd a brake fire with my true lock risers in honestly 3000 jumps, vector equpiment remains in great shape for it's long lifespan if it is well looked after.

Get tru lock and you won't be dissapointed, you will also be assured your 3 rings and riser loops are manufactured correctly as they are made by the company that designed the 3 ring system.
"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

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I have NEVER had a brake fire with either of my (true lock) V3's!
About 600 jump's and no problem. Yea i know 600 on true locks is not that much, but I figured if it was an issue I would have seen it by now!



Unless you've jumped sufficiently different opening canopies. Made a bunch of Sabre (original) or Monarch jumps? Made a bunch of Stiletto jumps? Spectre and Sabre2 openings are different in terms of how fast the slider comes down the lines.

Or in different environmental situations. Made a bunch of openings at different density altitudes? Parachutes open faster and harder at elevation and ground level is pushing 9000 density altitude places like Denver on hot sunny days.

Or different line/slider grommet friction. Have you jumped stainless, nickel plated, and brass gromets mated to all the vectran, dacron, hma, and spectra sizes? What about the rings used on RDS systems?

Or are doing something different. Some things are more resilient to operators doing different things. Here it might be sitting up on opening, what happens to the lines, I don't know.

There are a lot of variables. People usually only die when they stack up - thin new line (HMA/Vectran just getting popular), grommet might be a little off, packing/deployment which causes a snag, horseshoe, main which won't cutaway cleanly, main/reserve entanglement. Oops! Only killed a few people, but in hind sight was something which needed fixing.

Given the small number of skydivers to start with and fewer using problematic subsets a single incident that gets analyzed is enough to identify a problem and a couple or more unexplained ones a pattern.

I vote for Velcro toggles.

1. I've only seen Velcro with an elastic keeper "fail" when it was very worn.

2. I've seen packers cause toggle locks with velcro-free but not velcro.

3. It gives you a place to park the toggles.

4. If you stow your toggles on landing, with Spectra the lower steering lines have shrunk too much so they need replacement at 250 jumps even though they don't look worn. It's not necessarily a maintenance reduction. Vectran is just starting to fray a little (perhaps just from the little ring) and replacing it "early" isn't a big deal.

Next might be snap toggles with a cloth stub.

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I've had two in around 200 jumps.



Get tru lock and you won't be dissapointed, you will also be assured your 3 rings and riser loops are manufactured correctly as they are made by the company that designed the 3 ring system.



Those two are with my new Tru-Lock risers...

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I love my UPT (formerly RWS) "Tru-Lok" and I hate the VooDoo toggle set up. I have 1,500 plus jumps on tru-lok's and have never had a toggle fire or any other sort of problem. When the brake lines are stowed per the instructions I don't even know how it would be possible. Plus the stowage of the excess line is superb. Nothing is in the way to accidentally get snagged, etc. Just my opinion but I LOVE the Tru-Lok's. :)
"We've been looking for the enemy for some time now. We've finally found him. We're surrounded. That simplifies things." CP

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I'd buy risers and toggles with velcro. They're more secure, they provide a place to put the toggles if I don't want to hang on to them (up high, of course), they provide for secure stowage of the excess line and they're easier to unstow when it's time.

The only argument I've ever heard against them is wear on the lower steering lines. If non-velcro toggles are supposed to cure that problem, then why do so many people jumping non-velcro toggles need to have their lower steering lines replaced?

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I'd buy risers and toggles with velcro. They're more secure, they provide a place to put the toggles if I don't want to hang on to them (up high, of course), they provide for secure stowage of the excess line and they're easier to unstow when it's time.



And the velcro destroyng your lines?

i don't think they would be more secure than the tru lock system, and domes/snaps are not as smooth to release as the tru lock system, they also are subject to matal fatigue and require maintenence.

Tru lock risers do not need maintenance (of the stowage system) for the lifespan of the risers.
"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

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