plowdirt 0 #51 January 14, 2005 Lets get back to the basic question, and give it a transition. HOW CAN WE MAKE SKYDIVING MORE LUCRATIVE? I'm Inn, than all you haters will be thanking me and Jonathan one day, AIR WORLD A PLACE TO SKYDIVE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Paige 0 #52 January 14, 2005 Quoteas I was saying BAD MARKETING. don't you think?? Maybe in addition to bad marketing or no marketing dept. at all, they waste valuable money sponsoring people who do not positively promote their product. Sponsorships aren't the only way to market in this sport but it seems to be the only one that the manuf. have time for. Most of the time the marketing is given to someone who already has enough on their plate.Tunnel Pink Mafia Delegate www.TunnelPinkMafia.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
happythoughts 0 #53 January 14, 2005 QuotePeople can't understand it, they can not relate to it. I feel that way about womens figure skating. I've never tried it and I don't understand it. I like to watch it a lot though. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites happythoughts 0 #54 January 14, 2005 QuoteI completely disagree with that stament because popularity is what make an sport to grow, to get better, to evolve. don't you think?? No, not at all. The sport is getting better right now because of the committment of the individuals and the improvement of the training. The people in the sport who train hard and work at improvement are what is leading the evolution of the sport. Using digital cameras and wind tunnels as coaching aids has vastly improved the effectiveness of training. Quoteany way I will like to see that 12 year old in a DZ asking to let him jump solo because he want to do transition in head down. You are essentially talking about an inexperienced person becoming involved at a level beyond their experience. It happens currently. In the recent incidents, there is a low-time jumper doing a 4-way headdown jump. Right now, people who wish to have involvement in the sport understand that it is dangerous. It should stay that way. Let's not market to the totally clueless. The resulting increase in injuries would damage the sport and may create sport-specific insurance increases. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 2,396 #55 January 14, 2005 >it's our job to conduct ourselves as senior jumpers and make sure we look out for low number jumpers. We can't do it now - how can we do it if there are ten times the numbers of newbies at the DZ? At those levels, someone with 100 jumps will be one of the most experienced people at the DZ and will be listened to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Casurf1978 0 #56 January 15, 2005 QuoteF*ck the money, I'm thinking more about human life and the reputation of the sport. I agree with Phree here that we'd have a hundred kids wanting to be Swooper X, and that would just be the BEGINNING of the problem. Imagine what it would be like if every wannabe "EXTREME sportist" (people who do crazy shit cuz they think it makes them look cool) got turned on to skydiving. I can see it now...."I have 20 jumps, I'm gonna take it to the EXTREME and hook this in!!". Really good points wrongway. As an example I've been kiteboarding for a little over 4 years now. I can get decent air 20+feet and stay a loft for a good 10+ seconds in good wind 20-25+ knots. I've also done crazy shit in Cape Hatteras jumpng over small docks . Now that kiteboarding is going somewhat main stream I'm seeing a bunch of newbies yuppies and rich teenagers that dont have the training nor the respect kiteing deserves. It's nowhere near as dangerous as jumping out an airplane, but I saw this guy get lofted off the beach and shear the top of a light post off. Due to this new influx of newbies several beaches here in southern cali are closed to kiters. I use to kite in HB during the summer, well guess what. Not anymore. Also some beaches near my house are talking about banning us in the summer, this is mainly attributed to idiots who dont have the training to be safe. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freeflycracker 0 #57 January 15, 2005 QuoteHere is a question... how many hours a day do you spend running and hitting the gym to get better at jumping? In the summer I actually work my back a lot more for jumping.-good commercial idea-Kinda like the old VW comercial with the girl working her clutch muscle. Just put her on a lat pull down for swooping! Quotethis is mainly attributed to idiots who dont have the training to be safe. Same thing happened at my kite spot. Guy pulled 10k worth of stadium lighting on himself. POOF. Spot denied Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ChangoLanzao 0 #58 January 15, 2005 Amen! ******************************* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites LuvToFly 0 #59 January 15, 2005 QuoteQuotethere are many not spectator sports that are lucrative raly for example "you only see the car pass ones" I think the primary reason why skydiving is not a lucrative sport is simply BAD MARKETING. Most people have no frame of reference for skydiving. NASCAR is big, but most people who watch it drive. Football is big, but most have run and thrown a football before. Very few folks have made a skydive and most of them were just tandems. People can't understand it, they can not relate to it. That's very true Ron. Even deeper in the reasoning: 1) Almost everyone I have ever spoken to about the sport - with a few brave exceptions are scared sh*tless about the very concept. Even young males - not all, but much more than you would expect - They think we're freaks basically; daredevils only - not skilled - 2) Shows like "Real Video" love to show takes of people spinning in, breaking legs - with a "stupid people" notation attached. The jump off the space needle was just on the other day - Basically, a mockery. 3) Football and baseball are great, 'cause someone can sit in an armchair and shout out "what a bum!" as if they could do it better, run farther, not have fumbled. Armchair quarter backs. The fantasy is not there with skydiving. They know most would never get in the plane, let alone get out of one. One could find exceptions to this, of course, but not a lot. It'z not about money either. People can spend a lot of money on Golf if you go to the right courses with $1,000 drivers. A years worth of cigarettes for a heavy smoker is big bucks too - People will find the money if they want to do it (didn't we?) TOM "The helicopter approaches closer than any other to fulfillment of mankind's ancient dreams of a magic carpet" - Igor Sikorsky Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Belgian_Skygirl 0 #60 January 15, 2005 I think it is bacause very few people familiarize with the sport. What do I mean... when it comes to f.i. tennis, soccer, baseball, basket ball, gymnastics, ... people can learn it at school, in sport clubs, ... everybody knows somebody who does a sport, but they are more common sports.... and when you sponsor a sport that everybody knows, you can make publicity for a larger audience... of course I am just guessing, but it could be the reason... On the other hand... why is car racing f.i. that sponsorred as it is not open to anybody... Well, I have a theory as well about this one: most adults can drive... people feel more familiarized with that kind of sport. Howevver, it is a pitty that no bog companies are interested in sponsorring skydivers.------------------------------------------------- No dive, like skydive... wanna bet on it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JoeyRamone 0 #61 January 15, 2005 You bring up a very vaild point, I do not know why but it would be great to get some exposure on a box of wheaties!!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites plowdirt 0 #62 January 15, 2005 We have gone back and fourth with this issue, pro&con. look at those high profile DZ's. always slammed, when you get there whats your first thought Ohh yea I'm getting on a bunch of loads today,or this weekend. You don't get there and say doh whacko whuffos, my out look on this is more people more loads. Now phree you may be right and my views may change in a few years after a coupl thousand jumps but I like to pull up to DZ's like Z-hills, and any other DZ and see a crowd, how about if you pull up to your DZ and theres 3 people looking up at the sky, and you know you could use some isp students or who ever to make the load. I'm sure you have to have a coach rating by now, you'll get to teach the philosophy of phree and the proper way to a grasshoppa, that doesn't apply to just you but all skydivers, not all want to coach , I'm sure all want to jump. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhreeZone 15 #63 January 15, 2005 Go to a tandem factory DZ where you are being bumped for 4-5 loads due to nothing but tandems showing up and see how long you like that. Tandems pay the bills at a DZ, Fun jumpers are a break even for the DZO. Skydiving is not for everyone. I no longer try to drag my friends and family out to the DZ and a lot of my new co-workers don't even know I jump. http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1308288#1308288 Read that thread. Look at the jump numbers of the people that have been around a bit and seen the dark side of the sport vs the ones that have'nt. I'm lucky. I've only been directly involved for 1 fatality on skydivingfatalities.info, but I've been on the same DZ at the same time as 2 others. Thats 3 people in 5 years I've been on the same DZ as them when they died. Only 3 of my skydiving friends have broken a leg in the same time. More then a few people I know should have died but did'nt, myself included. It takes someone that realizes just how stupid we are to jump from a plane with death stalking us at every second to continue to do it. Those are the only people that should be out jumping. Not every couch pototo needs to be out there.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites medusa 0 #64 January 15, 2005 Quote Here is a question... how many hours a day do you spend running and hitting the gym to get better at jumping? Generally skydivers are more out of shape then any other sport I can think of. have you seen sumo wrestlers?? skydiving required no effort other than walk to the plane??? I don't know about you, but after a long day of skydiving and ten or fifteen jumps I'm all beat up "and I'm not in bad shape" I feel tired and most of the time I fall on sleep, the next morning wooooo boy my muscles hurt , almost the same as If I went to the gym or something. to skydive you use almost all parts of your body from head to toes. to be a good skydiver you need skills, body coordination, talent, agility. as long as I'm concern that is what a sport is all about. skydiving demands more physical effort than chez, Archery, Equestrian, Shooting, Curling Etc.......Medusa Get Killed or Die Trying! Patent pending ATFK15456 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites plowdirt 0 #65 January 15, 2005 Not a good reference, drop me right on to an old post form CM, DZO,REP. almost asking the same question, and giving the same answers. I met him last year and to me he is the apitimy of skydiving. ALL ABOUT IT. now could he have sold canopies, traveled to boogies, or ran a DZ if it weren't for newbies coming into this sport. Lets say perhaps it dropped 50% of new jumpers comming over 5 years. where would we be. I'm just gonna leave it at this. my opinion is your wrong, you should want more people, Every tandem I see I say congratulations are you coming out next week for the AFF. Do you on the other hand say thanks for your money and supporting our DZ now get the f*ck out and don't come back. I hope not, but the way I read your posts sound s like that. I say tomato,you say tomato. Lets keep playing the game. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Kris 0 #66 January 16, 2005 QuoteI'm just gonna leave it at this. my opinion is your wrong, you should want more people, Every tandem I see I say congratulations are you coming out next week for the AFF. Do you on the other hand say thanks for your money and supporting our DZ now get the f*ck out and don't come back. I hope not, but the way I read your posts sound s like that. I don't read Phree's post like that at all. Then again, 6 years in the sport and an Instructor rating have shown me that there definitely are people that have no business skydiving at all. Personally, I hope it never becomes "mainstream".Sky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites dunesurfer 0 #67 January 16, 2005 Quote I don't read Phree's post like that at all. Then again, 6 years in the sport and an Instructor rating have shown me that there definitely are people that have no business skydiving at all. Personally, I hope it never becomes "mainstream". Amen to that! Mainstream=Yahoos radically changing skydiving, and not for the better. Higher fatality rates and frequent lawsuits would be the most likely immediate result, followed by stiffer regulation and fewer places to jump. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites medusa 0 #68 January 16, 2005 Quote Amen to that! Mainstream=Yahoos radically changing skydiving, and not for the better. Higher fatality rates and frequent lawsuits would be the most likely immediate result, followed by stiffer regulation and fewer places to jump. so now are we talking about fatalities?? off course if the sports grow more an it becomes more popular of course there are going to be more fatalities "fatalities grow proportional to the number of individuals that are involve in the sport" you guys are pointing fingers to the "newies" and if you check the fatalities "parachutist april 2004" says that in the USA only 26 fatalities. from those 26 fatalities 12% students 4% A license 8% B license 4% C license 72% D license and 44% were on landing "low turn". so I really think that you should't be pointing fingers to the "newis" they are not the ones that are cousing the fatalities. how many active skydivers in the US 40.000? lets say that they make only 10 jumps a year. 40.000 X 10 = 400.000 jumps 400.000 jumps with only 26 jump fatalities that like 0.0065% thats a low number. last year they were 6 fatalities that I know of playing soccer.Medusa Get Killed or Die Trying! Patent pending ATFK15456 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites dunesurfer 0 #69 January 16, 2005 I believe you missed my point. I believe that if Skydiving became a "mainstream" sport it would not change for the better. I did not say "newies" would cause more fatalities. I implied that if Skydiving had mainstream appeal it might attract people that are not willing to take proper responsibility for the risks involved. If I am maimed or killed participating in this sport, it is because I chose to participate. The sport we love would not benefit from people entering that are not willing to assume proper responsibility for the consequences of jumping out of aircraft. True, it would be nice to see the talent in this sport to get the props they well deserve, but at what cost? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhreeZone 15 #70 January 16, 2005 D licence used to be 200 jumps. Lots and lots of under 500 jump D licence holders out there. Active skydivers? They issued 2420 A's, 993 B's, 622 C's, and 720 D's in 2004. Lots of those are duplicates of a jumper getting an A in the spring and a higher licence later. Total number of active jumpers is under probally 15000 and more realistically under 10000 jumpers in the US. Lets see so far the only things I'm hearing are 1) Lets promote the sport so the rest of the world looks up and admires us 2) More jumpers means more loads fly at small DZ's Any other good reasons to make the sport mainstream? Both the above seem to be pretty ego driven.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites plowdirt 0 #71 January 16, 2005 There you go again, insert foot in mouth. go mainstream so the world will admire us. NO We admire each other, why not bring the rest of the world in on our enjoyment. And YES more loads, at least you got that right. This is not an ego thing, this is a promotional thing, a couple of people would like to see a more positive aspect of skydiving , a couple don't. Lets agree to disagree. leave it at that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites flyangel2 2 #72 January 16, 2005 Quote2) More jumpers means more loads fly at small DZ's Kind of like getting more people on the ski slopes. It just means longer lift lines. More jumpers will mean longer waits for slots in the aircraft.May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skydivingwill 0 #73 January 18, 2005 I think it's all poor marketing. Most people I talk to are surprised how accessible skydiving is. It's not the money. I was dirt poor when I started. There has got to be more then 1 in 10,000 people in this county that want to skydive on a active bases. I'm willing to bet 1 in 100 would jump if they saw the safe pure fun side of skydiving regularly. There was a big increase in jumpers when skydive movies came out and when there was the skysurf fad. We as a community need to bring in as many people as possible. And not just for a tandem so we can get one free ride. Some think skydiving for the masses is dangerous but what about driving? I know that is way more dangerous then skydiving. More skydivers means: cheaper R&D for manufactures more full planes: lower rates bigger voice for govement: less intrusion more dropzones: less travel I think more non-tandem tv commercials could help. "It is our choices...that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities." -J. K. Rowling willtofly.com Videos, Pictures & News Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skydivingwill 0 #74 January 18, 2005 Quote 2) More jumpers means more loads fly at small DZ's Quote Kind of like getting more people on the ski slopes. It just means longer lift lines. More jumpers will mean longer waits for slots in the aircraft. When I first started all 3 DZs had at least 2 planes going at all times on weekends. The smallest had 3 going (caravan/porter/206 with a 182 just in case). So if they got that busy either the business would spread out and/or the DZs would get more planes. "It is our choices...that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities." -J. K. Rowling willtofly.com Videos, Pictures & News Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 7 #75 January 18, 2005 QuoteThere has got to be more then 1 in 10,000 people in this county that want to skydive on a active bases. I'm willing to bet 1 in 100 would jump if they saw the safe pure fun side of skydiving regularly. Where did you get these numbers? I can tell you that they are in no way close to reality. If they were we would not have so much turn over of students."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 Next Page 3 of 7 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
happythoughts 0 #54 January 14, 2005 QuoteI completely disagree with that stament because popularity is what make an sport to grow, to get better, to evolve. don't you think?? No, not at all. The sport is getting better right now because of the committment of the individuals and the improvement of the training. The people in the sport who train hard and work at improvement are what is leading the evolution of the sport. Using digital cameras and wind tunnels as coaching aids has vastly improved the effectiveness of training. Quoteany way I will like to see that 12 year old in a DZ asking to let him jump solo because he want to do transition in head down. You are essentially talking about an inexperienced person becoming involved at a level beyond their experience. It happens currently. In the recent incidents, there is a low-time jumper doing a 4-way headdown jump. Right now, people who wish to have involvement in the sport understand that it is dangerous. It should stay that way. Let's not market to the totally clueless. The resulting increase in injuries would damage the sport and may create sport-specific insurance increases. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,396 #55 January 14, 2005 >it's our job to conduct ourselves as senior jumpers and make sure we look out for low number jumpers. We can't do it now - how can we do it if there are ten times the numbers of newbies at the DZ? At those levels, someone with 100 jumps will be one of the most experienced people at the DZ and will be listened to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Casurf1978 0 #56 January 15, 2005 QuoteF*ck the money, I'm thinking more about human life and the reputation of the sport. I agree with Phree here that we'd have a hundred kids wanting to be Swooper X, and that would just be the BEGINNING of the problem. Imagine what it would be like if every wannabe "EXTREME sportist" (people who do crazy shit cuz they think it makes them look cool) got turned on to skydiving. I can see it now...."I have 20 jumps, I'm gonna take it to the EXTREME and hook this in!!". Really good points wrongway. As an example I've been kiteboarding for a little over 4 years now. I can get decent air 20+feet and stay a loft for a good 10+ seconds in good wind 20-25+ knots. I've also done crazy shit in Cape Hatteras jumpng over small docks . Now that kiteboarding is going somewhat main stream I'm seeing a bunch of newbies yuppies and rich teenagers that dont have the training nor the respect kiteing deserves. It's nowhere near as dangerous as jumping out an airplane, but I saw this guy get lofted off the beach and shear the top of a light post off. Due to this new influx of newbies several beaches here in southern cali are closed to kiters. I use to kite in HB during the summer, well guess what. Not anymore. Also some beaches near my house are talking about banning us in the summer, this is mainly attributed to idiots who dont have the training to be safe. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflycracker 0 #57 January 15, 2005 QuoteHere is a question... how many hours a day do you spend running and hitting the gym to get better at jumping? In the summer I actually work my back a lot more for jumping.-good commercial idea-Kinda like the old VW comercial with the girl working her clutch muscle. Just put her on a lat pull down for swooping! Quotethis is mainly attributed to idiots who dont have the training to be safe. Same thing happened at my kite spot. Guy pulled 10k worth of stadium lighting on himself. POOF. Spot denied Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChangoLanzao 0 #58 January 15, 2005 Amen! ******************************* Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LuvToFly 0 #59 January 15, 2005 QuoteQuotethere are many not spectator sports that are lucrative raly for example "you only see the car pass ones" I think the primary reason why skydiving is not a lucrative sport is simply BAD MARKETING. Most people have no frame of reference for skydiving. NASCAR is big, but most people who watch it drive. Football is big, but most have run and thrown a football before. Very few folks have made a skydive and most of them were just tandems. People can't understand it, they can not relate to it. That's very true Ron. Even deeper in the reasoning: 1) Almost everyone I have ever spoken to about the sport - with a few brave exceptions are scared sh*tless about the very concept. Even young males - not all, but much more than you would expect - They think we're freaks basically; daredevils only - not skilled - 2) Shows like "Real Video" love to show takes of people spinning in, breaking legs - with a "stupid people" notation attached. The jump off the space needle was just on the other day - Basically, a mockery. 3) Football and baseball are great, 'cause someone can sit in an armchair and shout out "what a bum!" as if they could do it better, run farther, not have fumbled. Armchair quarter backs. The fantasy is not there with skydiving. They know most would never get in the plane, let alone get out of one. One could find exceptions to this, of course, but not a lot. It'z not about money either. People can spend a lot of money on Golf if you go to the right courses with $1,000 drivers. A years worth of cigarettes for a heavy smoker is big bucks too - People will find the money if they want to do it (didn't we?) TOM "The helicopter approaches closer than any other to fulfillment of mankind's ancient dreams of a magic carpet" - Igor Sikorsky Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Skygirl 0 #60 January 15, 2005 I think it is bacause very few people familiarize with the sport. What do I mean... when it comes to f.i. tennis, soccer, baseball, basket ball, gymnastics, ... people can learn it at school, in sport clubs, ... everybody knows somebody who does a sport, but they are more common sports.... and when you sponsor a sport that everybody knows, you can make publicity for a larger audience... of course I am just guessing, but it could be the reason... On the other hand... why is car racing f.i. that sponsorred as it is not open to anybody... Well, I have a theory as well about this one: most adults can drive... people feel more familiarized with that kind of sport. Howevver, it is a pitty that no bog companies are interested in sponsorring skydivers.------------------------------------------------- No dive, like skydive... wanna bet on it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeyRamone 0 #61 January 15, 2005 You bring up a very vaild point, I do not know why but it would be great to get some exposure on a box of wheaties!!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
plowdirt 0 #62 January 15, 2005 We have gone back and fourth with this issue, pro&con. look at those high profile DZ's. always slammed, when you get there whats your first thought Ohh yea I'm getting on a bunch of loads today,or this weekend. You don't get there and say doh whacko whuffos, my out look on this is more people more loads. Now phree you may be right and my views may change in a few years after a coupl thousand jumps but I like to pull up to DZ's like Z-hills, and any other DZ and see a crowd, how about if you pull up to your DZ and theres 3 people looking up at the sky, and you know you could use some isp students or who ever to make the load. I'm sure you have to have a coach rating by now, you'll get to teach the philosophy of phree and the proper way to a grasshoppa, that doesn't apply to just you but all skydivers, not all want to coach , I'm sure all want to jump. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 15 #63 January 15, 2005 Go to a tandem factory DZ where you are being bumped for 4-5 loads due to nothing but tandems showing up and see how long you like that. Tandems pay the bills at a DZ, Fun jumpers are a break even for the DZO. Skydiving is not for everyone. I no longer try to drag my friends and family out to the DZ and a lot of my new co-workers don't even know I jump. http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1308288#1308288 Read that thread. Look at the jump numbers of the people that have been around a bit and seen the dark side of the sport vs the ones that have'nt. I'm lucky. I've only been directly involved for 1 fatality on skydivingfatalities.info, but I've been on the same DZ at the same time as 2 others. Thats 3 people in 5 years I've been on the same DZ as them when they died. Only 3 of my skydiving friends have broken a leg in the same time. More then a few people I know should have died but did'nt, myself included. It takes someone that realizes just how stupid we are to jump from a plane with death stalking us at every second to continue to do it. Those are the only people that should be out jumping. Not every couch pototo needs to be out there.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
medusa 0 #64 January 15, 2005 Quote Here is a question... how many hours a day do you spend running and hitting the gym to get better at jumping? Generally skydivers are more out of shape then any other sport I can think of. have you seen sumo wrestlers?? skydiving required no effort other than walk to the plane??? I don't know about you, but after a long day of skydiving and ten or fifteen jumps I'm all beat up "and I'm not in bad shape" I feel tired and most of the time I fall on sleep, the next morning wooooo boy my muscles hurt , almost the same as If I went to the gym or something. to skydive you use almost all parts of your body from head to toes. to be a good skydiver you need skills, body coordination, talent, agility. as long as I'm concern that is what a sport is all about. skydiving demands more physical effort than chez, Archery, Equestrian, Shooting, Curling Etc.......Medusa Get Killed or Die Trying! Patent pending ATFK15456 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
plowdirt 0 #65 January 15, 2005 Not a good reference, drop me right on to an old post form CM, DZO,REP. almost asking the same question, and giving the same answers. I met him last year and to me he is the apitimy of skydiving. ALL ABOUT IT. now could he have sold canopies, traveled to boogies, or ran a DZ if it weren't for newbies coming into this sport. Lets say perhaps it dropped 50% of new jumpers comming over 5 years. where would we be. I'm just gonna leave it at this. my opinion is your wrong, you should want more people, Every tandem I see I say congratulations are you coming out next week for the AFF. Do you on the other hand say thanks for your money and supporting our DZ now get the f*ck out and don't come back. I hope not, but the way I read your posts sound s like that. I say tomato,you say tomato. Lets keep playing the game. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kris 0 #66 January 16, 2005 QuoteI'm just gonna leave it at this. my opinion is your wrong, you should want more people, Every tandem I see I say congratulations are you coming out next week for the AFF. Do you on the other hand say thanks for your money and supporting our DZ now get the f*ck out and don't come back. I hope not, but the way I read your posts sound s like that. I don't read Phree's post like that at all. Then again, 6 years in the sport and an Instructor rating have shown me that there definitely are people that have no business skydiving at all. Personally, I hope it never becomes "mainstream".Sky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dunesurfer 0 #67 January 16, 2005 Quote I don't read Phree's post like that at all. Then again, 6 years in the sport and an Instructor rating have shown me that there definitely are people that have no business skydiving at all. Personally, I hope it never becomes "mainstream". Amen to that! Mainstream=Yahoos radically changing skydiving, and not for the better. Higher fatality rates and frequent lawsuits would be the most likely immediate result, followed by stiffer regulation and fewer places to jump. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
medusa 0 #68 January 16, 2005 Quote Amen to that! Mainstream=Yahoos radically changing skydiving, and not for the better. Higher fatality rates and frequent lawsuits would be the most likely immediate result, followed by stiffer regulation and fewer places to jump. so now are we talking about fatalities?? off course if the sports grow more an it becomes more popular of course there are going to be more fatalities "fatalities grow proportional to the number of individuals that are involve in the sport" you guys are pointing fingers to the "newies" and if you check the fatalities "parachutist april 2004" says that in the USA only 26 fatalities. from those 26 fatalities 12% students 4% A license 8% B license 4% C license 72% D license and 44% were on landing "low turn". so I really think that you should't be pointing fingers to the "newis" they are not the ones that are cousing the fatalities. how many active skydivers in the US 40.000? lets say that they make only 10 jumps a year. 40.000 X 10 = 400.000 jumps 400.000 jumps with only 26 jump fatalities that like 0.0065% thats a low number. last year they were 6 fatalities that I know of playing soccer.Medusa Get Killed or Die Trying! Patent pending ATFK15456 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dunesurfer 0 #69 January 16, 2005 I believe you missed my point. I believe that if Skydiving became a "mainstream" sport it would not change for the better. I did not say "newies" would cause more fatalities. I implied that if Skydiving had mainstream appeal it might attract people that are not willing to take proper responsibility for the risks involved. If I am maimed or killed participating in this sport, it is because I chose to participate. The sport we love would not benefit from people entering that are not willing to assume proper responsibility for the consequences of jumping out of aircraft. True, it would be nice to see the talent in this sport to get the props they well deserve, but at what cost? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 15 #70 January 16, 2005 D licence used to be 200 jumps. Lots and lots of under 500 jump D licence holders out there. Active skydivers? They issued 2420 A's, 993 B's, 622 C's, and 720 D's in 2004. Lots of those are duplicates of a jumper getting an A in the spring and a higher licence later. Total number of active jumpers is under probally 15000 and more realistically under 10000 jumpers in the US. Lets see so far the only things I'm hearing are 1) Lets promote the sport so the rest of the world looks up and admires us 2) More jumpers means more loads fly at small DZ's Any other good reasons to make the sport mainstream? Both the above seem to be pretty ego driven.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
plowdirt 0 #71 January 16, 2005 There you go again, insert foot in mouth. go mainstream so the world will admire us. NO We admire each other, why not bring the rest of the world in on our enjoyment. And YES more loads, at least you got that right. This is not an ego thing, this is a promotional thing, a couple of people would like to see a more positive aspect of skydiving , a couple don't. Lets agree to disagree. leave it at that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyangel2 2 #72 January 16, 2005 Quote2) More jumpers means more loads fly at small DZ's Kind of like getting more people on the ski slopes. It just means longer lift lines. More jumpers will mean longer waits for slots in the aircraft.May your trails be crooked, winding, lonesome, dangerous, leading to the most amazing view. May your mountains rise into and above the clouds. - Edward Abbey Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydivingwill 0 #73 January 18, 2005 I think it's all poor marketing. Most people I talk to are surprised how accessible skydiving is. It's not the money. I was dirt poor when I started. There has got to be more then 1 in 10,000 people in this county that want to skydive on a active bases. I'm willing to bet 1 in 100 would jump if they saw the safe pure fun side of skydiving regularly. There was a big increase in jumpers when skydive movies came out and when there was the skysurf fad. We as a community need to bring in as many people as possible. And not just for a tandem so we can get one free ride. Some think skydiving for the masses is dangerous but what about driving? I know that is way more dangerous then skydiving. More skydivers means: cheaper R&D for manufactures more full planes: lower rates bigger voice for govement: less intrusion more dropzones: less travel I think more non-tandem tv commercials could help. "It is our choices...that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities." -J. K. Rowling willtofly.com Videos, Pictures & News Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydivingwill 0 #74 January 18, 2005 Quote 2) More jumpers means more loads fly at small DZ's Quote Kind of like getting more people on the ski slopes. It just means longer lift lines. More jumpers will mean longer waits for slots in the aircraft. When I first started all 3 DZs had at least 2 planes going at all times on weekends. The smallest had 3 going (caravan/porter/206 with a 182 just in case). So if they got that busy either the business would spread out and/or the DZs would get more planes. "It is our choices...that show what we truly are, far more than our abilities." -J. K. Rowling willtofly.com Videos, Pictures & News Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 7 #75 January 18, 2005 QuoteThere has got to be more then 1 in 10,000 people in this county that want to skydive on a active bases. I'm willing to bet 1 in 100 would jump if they saw the safe pure fun side of skydiving regularly. Where did you get these numbers? I can tell you that they are in no way close to reality. If they were we would not have so much turn over of students."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
