V304 Micron packing problem PLEASE READ!

[RPetrie 0]

Hey ,
I just got in my Vector 3 Micron V304 and am having some issues with acceptable closing loop(main), and cypres loop tensions.
Background: I have a PD Optimum 113R and a Velocity 90 main, both new. According to the website, this container should hold a PD Optimum 113 and in this configuration is considered “full fitting”. My main canopy is considered “standard” fitting and I chose this incase I wanted to go up or down a size. This container is equipped with a skyhook, and I am jumping a cypres 2.
Packing the reserve: I am not a rigger, but am completing my pack jobs to get my ticket in the future. Since I have never packed a skyhook, I elected to have my master rigger pack the reserve, in its entirety, to learn how to properly install the specific system. After the canopy was in the bag (which at this point did not look any different, or specifically “overstuffed”) we took the pre installed cyres loop, which I believe was at 4” and tried that. Not even close. Using tensioning devices, we could not even get the loop through all the flaps WITHOUT the pilot chute installed. Long story short, the reserve container is closed with a 5” closing loop and the pull tension is just legal, but legal none the less. Also, the grommets of the flaps are stacked. However, I spoke to a rigger at UPT and he stated they do not recommend a closing loop length for the 304 in excess of 4.5”. You touch the reserve container and it feels like there is a cinder block in there.
Main: The reserve is now packed. However, no matter how I pack my main, roll it over like normal, leave the bottom of the d bag pointing straight up, it isn’t even close to acceptable. In either circumstance, the grommets from the left and right flap are 2.5” apart, it’s so tight I’m not sure that the PC has the balls to pull it out, and b/c of the spacing of the grommets, my pin and closing loop are over a half inch outside of my pin cover when it’s closed. Also, I had my main packed properly in the d-bag. I have it in the bag so tight there is NO fabric exposed whatsoever.
The reserve was packed as the rigger at UPT instructed. Not separating the pack job as shown in the Sunpath manual (not saying that is wrong in the case of the odyssey) and with as little fabric as possible in the ears. I fully trust the abilities and competencies of the rigger who packed the reserve, who has been in the industry for 35 + years and has thousand upon thousands of R pack jobs, countless of which have been on Vector 3’s.
I am basically trying to figure out if this is common and if there is some packing trick/technique etc.. I am missing for this specific rig. I just thought I would ask you guys first before I call UPT back and bother them more than I already have. Any responses at all are greatly appreciated….sorry for the long post.
Best,
BK

[councilman24 36]

Even though it's a long post it's very hard for someone not seeing the rig to diagnose what's going on. But beaware that any individual set container and reserve that are supposed to fit but be tight may not. Container size varies from individual to individual of the same nominal size and reserves vary by up to 10%. (at least 0-3 cfp fabric reserve, I don't know for sure if the optimum has the same issue) So, even if the manual says it fits, if it's supposed to be on the tight end any individual reserve may not fit in a specific container. I HATE customers that buy the absolute largest reserve that is supposed to fit. It often times doesn't and is always difficulte to pack.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[davelepka 4]

You're a fucking retard. You should call that 'college' you're going to and get your money back.

I hope your rig needs to go back to UPT for adjustments. Then you'll be gald you waited until the last second to place your order. Maybe they'll do you a favor and burn your container (like the last one) and keep you on the ground.

Hey, maybe we can get together for dinner tonight?

[riggerrob 558]

Dave,

Try to be more polite in public forums.

[riggerrob 558]

Sounds like your reserve container is "over-stuffed" and bulging into the main container.

The only solution is to order a larger reserve container.
That means building an entirely new rig.

[davelepka 4]

Quote

Dave,

Try to be more polite in public forums.

Hey, I did invite him to dinner.

[packing_jarrett 0]

try repacking it. Try an optimum 106. Try it without the cypres. And like you said, upt says it will fit. If all else fails you should be able to send them the system and pay them to pack it.

http://www.uptvector.com/PDF/Sizing-Chart.pdf

Na' Cho' Cheese

[parafredo 0]

I have two customers with 304. Both have 106, skyhook and the new mod as well. One of them is using a Vengeance 89 and the other one using a precision 88. They are both perfect fit but tight like a little brick.
I believe you should use pictures over the rigging dept at UPT and they will be more than happy to help you. I know some jumpers are closing their main d-bags standing up position, lines down to avoid having lines at the bottom of container. They say it is easier to close and they improve the look. Good luck

[parafredo 0]

By the way, they use 106R regular

[MartinOlsson 0]

I have a 304 (2008) with a Velo 90 and a Optimum 126. I know that is one size more than UPT recommends but I let my rigger test it and it worked out surprisingly well. I even have a cypress 1 installed. Another rigger who have packed it also found it to work out pretty good. Tight but no where near impossible. I don't know what loop length were used though.

/Martin

[lilchief 0]

now that the cutter for the Cyrpes i moved on top of the PC, isn't the length on the reserve loop less important as long as the grommets are stacked and pull force within range?

"Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you long to return." - Da Vinci
www.lilchief.no

[RIGGER 0]

Wrong move buddy the V304 is too small for the OP126.

Be Safe !!!

[RIGGER 0]

RWS / UPT never changed the AAD cutter location & it is still on Flap #1 in between the free bag & flap # 1.

FYI - even the cutter is on top of p/c the length of the Cypres loop is still valid as always for the reserve p/c to be well set & the reserve container to be well closed & well looking.

Be Safe !!!

[RIGGER 0]

Please fill your profile.

Cheers.

[lilchief 0]

Roger! =)

"Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you long to return." - Da Vinci
www.lilchief.no

[billvon 2,379]

Sounds like you have the largest possible reserve in the container and close to the largest possible main. (Velocity 96 is listed as the largest that will fit.) Under those conditions I would expect you to have some difficulty closing it; that's sort of the definition of "full fitting."

But as always UPT will be your best source of information on this.

[MartinOlsson 0]

Could you please elaborate on why this isn't a good idea if the fit is reasonable.

/Martin

[teknik 0]

I'm about to order a new Micron 304 as well and was considering a Xfire 2 109 and a Optimum 113 which looks like a similar setup. It would pretty much be a full fit as well according to UPT.

(I've already checked with UPt and they should pack fine)

Would y ou mind posting a picture of your rig from the front and the side so i can have an idea of how "brick-like" it looks?

Thanks

[billvon 2,379]

The Micron V306 lists the Optimum 113 as "standard fit" and the V304/OP113 as "full fit" (i.e. very very tight.) Why would you go with a reserve/container that's pretty much guaranteed to be a hassle to pack?

[riggerrob 558]

Expect a ten percent difference in pack volume, between any two canopies of the same model, size, etc.
Expect a ten percent difference in pack volume between a dry environment versus an humid environment.
Expect a ten or twenty percent difference in pack volume between different riggers, on different days, etc.
If you started with a canopy/container combination that is close to the top edge of the envelope and you start adding other variables, you soon end up with a rig that is difficult to close.
I wish I could charge extra for the extra hour or two required to close tight rigs.
That's engineering folks!
The only (long term) solution is to order a larger container.

[MartinOlsson 0]

I Actually had a 306, but the problem was that I wasn't satisfied with the tension I would get on the loop of the main container. If UPT made a rig that could hold a op126 and a crossbraced 90 / 9 cell 107 with maintained loop pressure I would stand in line. I was weighing my options and after having two separate riggers (who packed my specific container) tell me it was s an ok fit I went with the 304 with the op126. How come manufacturers won't make riggs that fit big reserves and small mains? It's seems as if the old line length argument has become obsolete... Please enlighten me...

/Martin

[mark 102]

Quote

. . . we took the pre installed cyres loop . . .

Does UPT ship with a "pre-installed loop" already knotted at the recommended length?

Mark

[matt3sa 0]

This is hilarious. I just got my new Micron V304 S#48577. I wanted to put a Velocity 96 and an Optimum 113 in it. My rigger took 2 days to finally come to the conclusion that the closing loop had to be extended 15/16 from what their records showed. He was breaking closing loops as we incresed it's length by 1/8 each attempt. The freakin thing is a ridiculous brick. It may also be why my harness is ridiculously tight. Upt has been half way decent about making corrections to the harness. They paid for shipping on the way back to them. Unfortunately I have to wait 2-3 weeks and I won't have a rig to jump. Not to mention that I don't believe that container is designed for that reserve. Love their products but hope they figure this one out.

[wmw999 2,114]

This thread should be required reading for everyone who wants to know just how big a reserve they can stuff into their container.

Wendy W.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Reginald 0]

Quote

This is hilarious. I just got my new Micron V304 S#48577. I wanted to put a Velocity 96 and an Optimum 113 in it. My rigger took 2 days to finally come to the conclusion that the closing loop had to be extended 15/16 from what their records showed. He was breaking closing loops as we incresed it's length by 1/8 each attempt. The freakin thing is a ridiculous brick. It may also be why my harness is ridiculously tight. Upt has been half way decent about making corrections to the harness. They paid for shipping on the way back to them. Unfortunately I have to wait 2-3 weeks and I won't have a rig to jump. Not to mention that I don't believe that container is designed for that reserve. Love their products but hope they figure this one out.

I don’t get your point. You put a “full fitting” reserve AND a “full fitting” main in a container. It would likely pack fine with one or the other but common sense dictates that if you try and put both in it will be overstuffed. What is UPT supposed to figure out? I don’t think the issue is with UPT. The issue is that you ordered a 304 when a 306 is clearly marked as the proper size container to fit both your main and reserve.

When will people learn to buy a rig that properly fits their equipment today? It’s like people buying clothes that are too small because they are “going to lose some weight” and then complain their clothes are too tight.

"We've been looking for the enemy for some time now. We've finally found him. We're surrounded. That simplifies things." CP