topper 0 #26 January 8, 2009 We now have magnetic riser covers which seem fantastic, how about magnetic line stows? Has the same ease and use as velcro, just without the maintenance and pile > line issues??? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #27 January 8, 2009 Quote Quote Velcro actually becomes a better and better idea the more high-performance your canopy gets, because of the increased severity of a brake fire. what has the velcro to do with that ? If you had ever seen a PArachutes de France toggle, you would definitely adopt that system. No I wouldn't.I don't believe pins or snaps belong on risers. I do think Velcro is almost fool proof, but then I haven't met every fool.I think the nicest riser/toggle combination on the market today are sold by Velocity Sports Equipment, makers of the Infinity. It's the ONLY hard housing that I'm sure will stay in place.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peek 20 #28 January 8, 2009 QuoteWe now have magnetic riser covers which seem fantastic, how about magnetic line stows? That's entirely possible, and a good idea! It wouldn't surprise me if someone is working on that now. Update: I just got a PM from someone who said they didn't realize that their reserve had Velcro type toggles, and had a difficult time unstowing the brakes during the excitement of a reserve ride. That is something I had never thought of. I guess Velcroless toggles have been around long enough now that some people may not know about the Velcro type. Riggers and manufacturers, you might want to make note of this for your customer briefings and owners manuals. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #29 January 8, 2009 QuoteQuoteWe now have magnetic riser covers which seem fantastic, how about magnetic line stows? That's entirely possible, and a good idea! It wouldn't surprise me if someone is working on that now. Update: I just got a PM from someone who said they didn't realize that their reserve had Velcro type toggles, and had a difficult time unstowing the brakes during the excitement of a reserve ride. That is something I had never thought of. I guess Velcroless toggles have been around long enough now that some people may not know about the Velcro type. Riggers and manufacturers, you might want to make note of this for your customer briefings and owners manuals. .................................................................... Tee! Hee! I have only seen Velcro-less reserve toggles in Wings and a recent Javelin. Maybe we do need to instruct customers .... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jurgencamps 0 #30 January 9, 2009 QuoteQuoteWe now have magnetic riser covers which seem fantastic, how about magnetic line stows? That's entirely possible, and a good idea! It wouldn't surprise me if someone is working on that now. http://www.pgasus.be/start.php?pg=text&item=mPOD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jurgencamps 0 #31 January 9, 2009 QuoteI met someone this weekend who had a mod done to their bridle... Its a collapsible PC, so it must be cocked before every jump. A rigger moved the closing pin to the inside of the bridle, and created a window (much like the window that lets you view your kill line color). The pin would only be visible through the window (and therefore able to be inserted in the closing loop) if the pilot chute had been cocked. I couldn't tell you how to make this mod yourself, but the theory seemed sound. PDF sold this kind of system, but there were some problems with (what if the kill line shrinks, breaks, ...). This solutions solves a problem, but also creates some other problems. I believe that there is an old thread about it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 3 #32 January 9, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuoteWe now have magnetic riser covers which seem fantastic, how about magnetic line stows? That's entirely possible, and a good idea! It wouldn't surprise me if someone is working on that now. http://www.pgasus.be/start.php?pg=text&item=mPOD i think he may have been refering to the brake line stows"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jurgencamps 0 #33 January 9, 2009 mhh, I think you are right, but nevertheless I made some promotion for him Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 3 #34 January 9, 2009 and i would think that a magnetic linestow like on that bag would make it more likely to have a line dump/knots... but thats just what i think"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ozzy13 0 #35 January 9, 2009 I like this for the pilot chute http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=axCeYlY_6io&feature=channel_pageNever give the gates up and always trust your rears! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ozzy13 0 #36 January 9, 2009 Quote Quote Quote Velcro actually becomes a better and better idea the more high-performance your canopy gets, because of the increased severity of a brake fire. what has the velcro to do with that ? If you had ever seen a PArachutes de France toggle, you would definitely adopt that system. No I wouldn't.I don't believe pins or snaps belong on risers. I do think Velcro is almost fool proof, but then I haven't met every fool.I think the nicest riser/toggle combination on the market today are sold by Velocity Sports Equipment, makers of the Infinity. It's the ONLY hard housing that I'm sure will stay in place. Vector had the true locks. They seem to work wellNever give the gates up and always trust your rears! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 135 #37 January 9, 2009 Quote I don't believe pins or snaps belong on risers. I do think Velcro is almost fool proof, but then I haven't met every fool. no more snaps on the PdF toggles (which is a good thing) Almost is the word... in my short skydiving carreer, I saw scarily maltreated velcro making it as useful as .. nothingscissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jurgencamps 0 #38 January 9, 2009 Quoteand i would think that a magnetic linestow like on that bag would make it more likely to have a line dump/knots... but thats just what i think If that is the case, do not jump your reserve. It uses the same kind of linestows. Jurgen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #39 January 9, 2009 Quoteand i would think that a magnetic linestow like on that bag would make it more likely to have a line dump/knots... but thats just what i think Just to add to the comment about the reserves, they do use that type of line stow, only with velcro to hold the flap shut instead of magnets. Additionally, there are main d-bags being used today with the same system only with tuck tubs to hold the flaps shut. BASE canopies have a tail pocket that stow the lines the same way as well, generally closed with velcro. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
topper 0 #40 January 9, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteWe now have magnetic riser covers which seem fantastic, how about magnetic line stows? That's entirely possible, and a good idea! It wouldn't surprise me if someone is working on that now. http://www.pgasus.be/start.php?pg=text&item=mPOD i think he may have been refering to the brake line stows Yes sorry I should have been more clear, I was referring to Brake Line Stows using magnets instead of velcro. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nitrochute 2 #41 January 9, 2009 unfortunately,the only way to make gear mistake proof is to remove those jumpers who make mistakes from the sport, but since everyone is human and makes mistakes you would have to eliminate 100 % of the jumping population. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
drjump 0 #42 January 9, 2009 Most of the jumpers that make mistakes remove themselvs from the sport. Just read the fatality reports. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ficus 0 #43 January 10, 2009 Quote Quote I don't believe pins or snaps belong on risers. I do think Velcro is almost fool proof, but then I haven't met every fool. no more snaps on the PdF toggles (which is a good thing) Almost is the word... in my short skydiving carreer, I saw scarily maltreated velcro making it as useful as .. nothing It doesn't make sense to compare one system, poorly maintained, to another system in good shape. I have had more than one brake fire jumping a set of risers with pin-based toggle keepers, because the pocket the pin went into was old and stretched out and put poor tension on the pin. I don't know if the PdF design is susceptible to this because I still haven't seen a picture or heard an explanation, but the point is this: no gear is maintenance free, and at equal levels of repair, I don't know of a toggle keeper system that will outperform Velcro in the prevention of accidental brake release. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,047 #44 January 10, 2009 Hi guys, If it works correctly, here is a jpg of the PdeF pin toggle system. It might not work as I am not much of a computer guy. JerryBaumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryan_d_sucks 0 #45 January 14, 2009 QuoteMost of the jumpers that make mistakes remove themselvs from the sport. Just read the fatality reports. Actually I think the more correct way of saying that is "Most jumpers who remove themselves from the sport made mistakes." There are a lot of close-calls and learning experiences (mistakes) in this sport. I've had a few already in my very limited time. Its back to filling up those buckets-- one of luck and one of experience.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
