Riggers!! what do you do with the main????

[tsalnukt 1]

what does everyone do with the main canopy when you are doing a reserve pack job? just wondering.

Also what are people's policies on packing main canopies if they come in to the loft for a reserve repack with an opened main?

[ficus 0]

You can't really do a repack with the main still in the container and fully attached, since the main risers cover the reserve risers. I suppose you could disconnect the risers and leave the main packed in the container, but I don't know anyone who does that.

I tell people not to bring me the main at all unless they want me to inspect and repack it.

[Unstable 8]

I'm pretty mellow - 90% of the time I inspect, repack, and even do minor repairs on the main canopies. It just depends on the customer. If they give me their rig in a big ball of shit tangled together, I give it back to them in the same condition. If they give it to me packed, ready to jump, I return in the same condition. It's a good test to see who really respects their own gear...

=========Shaun ==========

[councilman24 36]

The problem with this is that you can't fully evaluate the function of the reserve without the main in it. I don't insist on it but I prefer the customer bring me the rig with the main packed. If they're available I then have them practice their emergency procedures and pull the reserve while I'm watching. If they just drop it off I can still pull the reserve with the main container closed to evaluate the reserve function.

This is how I found an issue with the Quasar II which resulted in a recall of all Quasars with the PRO 'flinger' system! And some of the other, smaller rigs with full size PC's don't want to launch well.

No matter how I get it I remove the main from the harness after it's open. When I'm done with the reserve I reattach the main, cleaning the cutaway cables, ensuring it's on straight. But the customer gets it back unpacked. This dates from a time when almost everybody packed their own main and preferred to do so. If people pack their own mains, they'll prefer to do it. If they pay a packer, well they're not paying me to pack it.

Over the years there has been lots of discussion and even presentations including how to detach a packed main, leave it in the bag, keep the risers straight, and reattach it straight. This included various methods and tools to keep the risers straight. This has just never seemed like it was worth the risk.

I have packed and/or closed a rig with the main in it. Usually my own or one I'm very familiar with. But certainly this is not my normal practice.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[pchapman 261]

I take the main off the rig carefully, keep the risers weighted down away from where I'm working, and reattach the main carefully after the reserve pack job. So it is all hooked up again.

I tell the customer that I do this as part of standard procedures and as a courtesy -- and that it is their responsibility to do a line check to confirm that the main went back on correctly. They have to do a repack on the main.

That's been the way I've seen it done around my area.

I often temporarily pin the main back in the main tray, using just two flaps, just to make it easier for the customer to carry the rig away.


(Then there's the other issue of whether one inspects the risers. While risers come with the harness/container, I consider risers to be part of the main canopy system when it comes to inspections. But I do twist the bottom ring on the riser to reduce stiffness in the riser - as I know users never do that themselves - and glance over the risers for any obvious major safety defects.)

[riggerrob 558]

I am with councilman on this issue.

When customers drop off their rigs, I offer to review emergency procedures with them, then clamp the main risers to the edge of a bin.
After repacking the reserve, I reattach the main risers, carry it next door - to the main packing hangar - and do a six line check.
Then I wait for one of the staff packers to pack the main.
If customers insist on taking their rigs before the main is repacked, I encourage them to stretch it out to ensure that the lines are straight.

This is a habit that I picked up years ago while working in Perris Valley, California. Given the desperately litigatous nature of Southern California, riggers used every trick they could to limit liability. They considered it "bad luck" to have the same person to pack both main and reserve. To reinforce that point riggers charged double or triple the rates of packing rats.

That concept was reinforced a few years later when a retired Canadian Army Sargent Major chewed me out for "packing him a malfunction." His version of the story started with doing hop-and-pops from 2,000 feet (My eye!) When his Heatwave (close copy of Stiletto) did not inflate instantly, he ignored his cutaway handle in a rush to pull his reserve ripcord. The next thing he remembered was hanging under two fully-inflated canopies. Then he tried to blame me for packing a main malfunction.
That was the last time I ever packed a main for a customer!

[madhatter 0]

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No matter how I get it I remove the main from the harness after it's open. When I'm done with the reserve I reattach the main, cleaning the cutaway cables, ensuring it's on straight. But the customer gets it back unpacked. This dates from a time when almost everybody packed their own main and preferred to do so. If people pack their own mains, they'll prefer to do it. If they pay a packer, well they're not paying me to pack it.

Agreed!

Not rigger certified, but I tend to connect my own reserves when ordering new rigs & have packed my own reserve under supervision. Please note that in SA we don't need to have senior riggers supervising packers for mains & anyone can pack their own main.

I recently had my rigger, whom I trust implicitly, install a Vigil during a scheduled repack & also inspect my main, resulting in a trim correction on the outside lines.

He returned my rig with the main packed - something I didn't expect of him at all.

Doesn't matter how much I trust him, he's not getting paid to pack my main, I've never watched hm packing his own main (some guys just 'fling it in'). His name's on the reserve card only & there's no packing slip (like a student rig might have) for the main...

Personal preference, but I dumped my main when I got home, did my own 3-ring & '6' line check, checked the brake stowage & then repacked it.

We're all paying to have the harness & reserve inspected & the reserve repacked. The main pack job (even if work's been done to it) remains the person jumping it's responsibilty IMO.

A VERY MERRY UNBIRTHDAY TO YOU!!!
D.S # 125

[jdthomas 0]

I am in line with everyone else.. bring me your rig packed.. step into my hanging harness and go through the motions.

I then take the rig and carefully pull the reserve out looking things over as I go. after the reserve is on the floor i pull the main, drag it to the side with the risers attached to a board that I made to keep the risers in order.

I do a full inspect on teh reserve, air it and repack it. i then reconnect the main and unpack it, leaving it for the customer to repack and make sure it's hooked up correctly.. I won't be caught in the you hooked my main up wrong game! they can take care of the main from the risers on up!

I will only hook up the main and repack it if i am getting paid to do so and I charge a lot extra for that!

Joe

www.greenboxphotography.com

[mjosparky 3]

I do not pack mains. If I am cornered and forced to do one I charge the same for the main that I charge for the reserve. As a rigger I am held to the same standard on any canopy I pack and so give them all the same attention.

Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[floormonkey 0]

how can one fully inspect the container with the main canopy in the container (or connected, for that matter)?

[tsalnukt 1]

I totally agree, but I have seen this being done with my own eyes. The most common I have seen is to leave the main packed and hooked up, pull out the reserve, inspect and pack it, and right before you put it on the container take the main out of the main packing tray only, close the reserve and then close the main. I think this is just lazy.

I take the main off and attach it to a special board that I made (I thought I was the only one), Mine has straps to hold the packed main as well as for the risers. do the reserve and stuff hook the main back up and then give it to a packer to pack....they could always use and extra 6 bucks.

[Gary73 8]

As mentioned above, jumpers never do the required maintenance on the three-ring system, so I consider that to be part of the I&R.

I've also found several rigs with dangerously worn components on the main risers, including the webbing just above the medium ring, the retaining loop, and of course, brake lines. I wouldn't have found those problems if I had left the main in the container.

I prefer to receive the rig fully packed, since I usually take them home to I&R and have limited space in my car. I always return them that way for the same reason, and charge an extra $5 if I received the rig with the main unpacked or the owner wants a main I&R also.

"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan

[ficus 0]

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The problem with this is that you can't fully evaluate the function of the reserve without the main in it.

Can you elaborate on this? Are you referring to main container pressure interfering with reserve deployment? There's no way to know how the main will be packed in the future -- but I suppose an incomplete test is better than none.

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If they're available I then have them practice their emergency procedures and pull the reserve while I'm watching.

I just packed a rig for a guy who is coming back from a year layoff. I am really kicking myself for not doing this with him. Thanks for the idea, I will do this in the future.

[CrazyL 0]

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what does everyone do with the main canopy when you are doing a reserve pack job? just wondering.

Also what are people's policies on packing main canopies if they come in to the loft for a reserve repack with an opened main?

Main canopy and it's attached parts get more repair than the reserve or container. I like to have the main packed and jumper there when I get a rig for service. Jumper and I assess the gear and visit about their plan for various malfunction scenarios. Sometimes the jumper will/or has pull the handles. About the main: I like to only accept gear with the main packed. I can easily see issues with flaps , boc, loop tension, how well the bridle tucks under the side flap, etc. with the main packed. Main gets inspected every other pack cycle and packed every time i pack the reserve. With the main packed I take responsibility for the entire parachute system. Like to make certain the whole system is airworthy. More than that, when I service parachute equipment I like to know the condition of the entire system and that the jumper is prepared. I like the people I rig for. Regardless if I pack a main or a reserve, I still have a jumpers life in my hands. I always disconnect the main prior to reserve inspection. Do 3 ring maintenance each time I disconnect and connect main risers, just a habit. Don't care if the risers get twisted when the main is released because prior to reconnecting the main, the main gets a brake line check, 3 rings attached, then a full line check, every line. It's just easier. I can do a full line check faster than most jumpers can do a 4 line check. Full line check gives me a feeling of being thorough and complete. Like to inspect PD mains. It's real easy to go onto their website and print off a trim chart to do the main inspection with. They get me line kits faster than other manufacturers too. When I get done packing a reserve and a main, the rig gets shaped to perfection, gets one last gear check and is ready for service.