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Regis

Canopy not flying in a straight line

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I have bought a new canopy a Sabre 2 170 (my wing load is around 1.4, and I have 290 jumps), I downsized it from a Sabre 2 190. When flying my new canopy has the tendency to go for the right side, is not that strong but is quit uncomfortable (mainly for landing). I had asked for our rigger to take a look and he didn’t saw any problems with the brakes and visually it doesn’t seem to have other major problem also. I was told that would be the way that I fly or my container might not be well adjusted (Vector 3 that I’m flying it after 2 years). I’m trying everything in air to see if would be my body position or if I can detect something wrong with my container. I had done 12 jumps on it and no clue of what could be happening. Does someone have a suggestion? Thanks

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Send it back to PD. They have people who specifically go out and jump canopies that have been said to have certain problems and they figure out and fix the problem. If they can't fix the problem, they will usually send you a new canopy.

I would see if Kim has a demo for you to use while your canopy is being fixed. Just call PD and tell them your problem. They will help, they are an AWESOME company and stand behind their product.

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If there are no riser, brake line or other line issues it could be the leg straps or body position. Are the leg straps coming loose after deployment?

I have a Sabre2 150 (my second) and I am always amazed how fast the lines come out of trim. When mine won't fly straight it is usually the lines or the leg straps.

There could be a problem with the harness or container although since you have used it for 2 years, you should have noticed the problem with your old canopy also.

Have you had a very hard opening? If yes have the rigger check the container for harness attachment points for damage; Are the hip rings still shaped correctly?

Let us know what you find out.

Blue skies,

Jim

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Open, leave the brakes stowed (checking for traffic), be as straight in the harness as possible. Does it turn? Release the brakes, let go of the toggles. Does it turn? How fast?

I've seen lots and lots of jumpers over the years that flaired unevenly, turning the canopy at landing and swore the wind blew them or the canopy turns. Check that out.

If it really turns send it to PD to fix.

I had a Sabre 190 that always opened in a spin. PD never could fix it, and preplaced it.
Sometimes canopies have problems that you can't find.
I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

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Agree, measure the steering lines, it's not that difficult.
first, from the cascade to the cat aye, or full lenght.
Or simply lay the canopy on the floor and compare both sides (steering lines) - no measuring tape needed ;).
I did it with a cobalt (second hand) which I bought from a RIGGER, who was informed by the previous owner that after opening turns to the left. He ensured me that noting is wrong with the canopy. Obviously the canopy was turning to the left when I jumped it first time. The difference between the steering lines was about 15-20mm which was enough.
Always check yourself... that my advice. :P
Janusz

Back to Poland... back home.

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also, with the brakes released, how many inches (or cm) of toggle does it take to correct the problem?

I second the idea that sometimes it can occur even if all lines are perfectly right. Even if the harness is right. Even if you are not sitting lopsided. Sometimes a canopy will just turn in spite of those things. I suspect every manufacturer has a tolerance for how much toggle correction it takes to get it to fly straight. When you talk to them BEFORE you send it back, they will likely want to know the toggle differential.

-- Jeff
My Skydiving History

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We had a similar problem with a tandem canopy that needed a reline. It was only out of trim by 3/4 of an inch. New lines and all the TM's were complimenting me on how well they were flying. Of course I told them it was my packing-awesomeness.

-Michael

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I had the exact same problem when I purchased my brand new Pilot 168. There was a small turn to the right, and I found myself constantly giving it some left toggle to keep it going in the correct direction.

At first I assumed it was me and that my legs straps were uneven or something. Finally after about 20 jumps on it, I asked an instructor to jump it. He agreed, there was a problem with the canopy.

Aerodyne took care of it very quickly. I am very happy with the way Aerodyne responded and love my Pilot.

Have an instructor jump it, get a second opinion !
... Marion

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Are your leg straps even when you put your rig on? Do you have an tendancy to lean in the harness either one way or the other? Are you flying with your hands level? Do you have any twists in one of your brake lines?
Divot your source for all things Hillbilly.
Anvil Brother 84
SCR 14192

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Quote

We had a similar problem with a tandem canopy that needed a reline. It was only out of trim by 3/4 of an inch. New lines and all the TM's were complimenting me on how well they were flying. Of course I told them it was my packing-awesomeness.

-Michael



3/4 of an inch where?

Either:
A. Your TI's are VERY sensitive to the intricacies of canopy performance, or
B. Your tandem canopies are lined with HMA :D and relined all the time.

Not to downplay the importance of line trim to any canopy's performance. But usually a 'built-in turn' is just that. Crossport damage, unknown history/damage, stitching, component cutting, fabric weave, etc can all play a factor. Happily the folks at PD are the experts :)

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I've this happen a few times, in fact I had a X-fire with problem. Icarus fixed it trimming the lines of the other side. A friend of mine had the same issue with a brand new Pilot 150, Aerodyne replaced his canopy, great service. Dan Pointer's Parachute Manual also gives some info about this issue. If the lines are symmetric and you're wearing your harness correctly (also symmetrically) then it’s a problem with canopy construction. The panels in one side could have been sewn slightly out of bias and so the canopy inflates asymmetrically. Differences in thread tension during sewing may also affect the shape while inflated. I assume your canopy is new and has never been wet but reinforcement tape can also shrink and distort the shape. I’m sure PD has more possible causes and will handle your problem the best way possible.
Good luck
Engineering Law #5: The most vital dimension on any plan drawing stands the most chance of being omitted

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I do not want to raise any concern about any company, I was just asking for a help and I appreciate all the input that I got from the forum and I will be looking in all the possibility. For sure first I will have a experienced skydiver (that is not my case) jump on it, it was not done yet because are raining a lot lately up here. If is not OK I will send back to PD as suggested. Thanks

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Regis,

I am having a similar on-going problem with my Stiletto 150. It is very old, has oodles of jumps (I don't even know how many), and I'm not the first owner of it. It has a built in left hand turn. I had a master rigger look at it, and he adjusted two lines, but the problem never went away. I demoed a 135 from PD and that canopy flew straight (so it's not me or my rig).

Feeling your pain buddy! [:/]

http://3ringnecklace.com/

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No, it's not that PD will take offense, or that it's dissing the company. It's just that they, and everyone else, would lend more credence to what you're saying if you sound like you know what you're talking about. Using the phrase "built in turn" is universally accepted skydiver lingo for "my canopy won't fly straight."

NickD :)

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Sorry, I didn’t know this term “built in turn”, so I used canopy not flying in a straight line, because it’s what actually is happening, at least is what I feel when I’m flying it.
Before, release my toggles, there is already a small tendency to go for my right (always for that side), which seems increase a little bit after I release it. It’s manageable, so I can fly straight with few additional centimetres (maybe 10 cm) of input in my left toggle. I tried hard but it is not possible to compensate the turn only with my body position, I do need the left toggle to do that. Is a new canopy (12 jumps on it) and I didn’t had a hard opening in it. My container seems Ok (has around 250 jumps), but I will ask for our rigger take a look also. The straps do not come loose after opening…. It could be my impression but the first couple of jumps on it I didn’t notice anything wrong…I’m waiting for a better whether to ask for an experimented skydiver jump on it.
Thanks again.

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A note about leg straps.

Remember, the point isn't to have the leg straps exactly the same, the point is to have the three rings sitting at exactly the same level. Your legs will be slightly different sizes, so after you tighten your leg straps down, put your thumbs in the big ring of your 3-rings. Pull up and see if your thumbs are even.
--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

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Just an update…I asked someone experienced to jump with my rig and he had the same problem, to rule out a problem with my container we put my canopy on other container and the problem still their. We check (again) the brake lines and all the lines, not seems to be wrong. To fly straight I need to use the left toggle constantly, around 15 to 20 cm.

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