Did I make the right decision not to cut away?

[wildcard451 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

After snagging the freebag

Ack. You got brasser balls than I do.

For the record, anyone new/inexperienced out there, this is NOT a good idea, nor to try it with a main canopy. People much better than you have died trying it.

Um, I only mentioned it in the story because it compounded my decision, but you get pretty good at it with experience.

But for the record, it should never be done by those not experienced and only at an altitude you can comfortably cut-away if it causes a problem. I only catch with a hand, not teeth, lines or any other gear!

Not noticing big hole in canopy- no problem to commentators
Catching freebag- problem to commentators

top

Hey boss, wasn't trying to crack on you. You've got a shit load more time jumping and rolling around under canopy than I do. I just didn't want a kid with 50 jumps watch his buddy cut away, try to catch his bag/main, and fuck himself up.

You said everything else in the rest of your post.
Not hating, just trying to throw some useful advice out in here.

[jjalert 0]

Quote

Below 1000' no student should EVER cut away and if a canopy is questionable on landing it at that point you should disconnect RSL and pull reserve.

It's probably good to note that on a 2-handle student rig with an SOS system on the reserve side, pulling the reserve handle is a really bad idea under 1000', since this will also chop the main.

To perform a canopy transfer under 1000' on a system like this, you can disconnect the RSL and yank the RSL line itself to deploy the reserve without chopping the main. Or, on the student rig I used, there was enough cable sticking out of the reserve D-handle that I could have grabbed the cable/swage and pulled there, without removing the reserve handle and triggering the SOS system.

Since equipment can differ greatly, it's always a good idea to know your equipment inside and out when considering scenarios like this. :)

[Andy9o8 0]

Quote

To perform a canopy transfer under 1000' on a system like this, you can disconnect the RSL and yank the RSL line itself to deploy the reserve without chopping the main. Or, on the student rig I used, there was enough cable sticking out of the reserve D-handle that I could have grabbed the cable/swage and pulled there, without removing the reserve handle and triggering the SOS system.

Yeah. Easy as pie, especially for a student.

[shropshire 0]

At your next re-pack time ... try it (do I really need to add - ON THE GROUND) ... and see just how easy it would be...... Please , let us know.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[Robdiver 0]

Quote

If the handling was questionable or the canopy was much smaller, I'd fly it to a better spot and cut it away.

No one made any comments on this statement and it caught my eye. I am a new jumper so I am asking some more experienced guys to clarify this. In my (inexperienced) opinion, I would say that getting to a better spot is the last of your worries. If you know the handling of the canopy is questionable, you might be loosing more altitude than you realise. If you cut away and get a good reserve, you can worry about your spot then. If you get a bad reserve, you will need as much altitude as you can get... (?)

Once again, newbie opinion. I'm asking not giving advice.

[MarkM 0]

Quote

No one made any comments on this statement and it caught my eye. I am a new jumper so I am asking some more experienced guys to clarify this. In my (inexperienced) opinion, I would say that getting to a better spot is the last of your worries. If you know the handling of the canopy is questionable, you might be loosing more altitude than you realise. If you cut away and get a good reserve, you can worry about your spot then. If you get a bad reserve, you will need as much altitude as you can get... (?)

Generally yeah, but hookitt was giving what he'd do in this specific situation. A damaged canopy at, what, 4k? And while the safe thing to do if you're gonna cut is cut right away and work on getting a clean reserve above your head, it wouldn't be a big deal for someone with that much altitude to fly it down some for a better main recovery.

Compare that to a normal pull that puts you in the saddle at 2k with a damaged canopy, then yeah, you shouldn't be screwing around when you're at your hard deck.

One thing to keep in mind is sometimes a really experienced jumper might deal with a situation in a way not completely recommended. For newer jumpers it's best to keep things simple, black and white, less confusing. When you get more experience you may vary your EPs a little within a situation.

[dragon2 0]

If you've got plenty of altitude to spare, you can fly yourself to a better spot (or rather, a better spot to cutaway so you have more chance of retrieving your stuff). Say you're on a CRW jump and on opening you broke a line, are you gonna cut it away at 7k if it flies and behaves pretty much normal otherwise? My last reserve ride was due to 2 broken lines, I knew I wasn't going to land it but I did fly my main canopy back to the DZ and cutaway at 2.5k, the main and freebag landed pretty close to where I was where otherwise due to the amount of low clouds eh haze I might have had big problems locating my stuff afterwards. Chopping at ~2.5k still left me plenty of altitude to get familiar with my reserve (this was one I hadn't jumped before, and the smallest yet) and I had just bought myself an excellent spot for a sinky small reserve as a bonus.

Of course potentially losing gear is not a priority but in the rare case where you have a "tame" mal, got the altitude to spare, and have likely had reserves rides before so you're cool about the whole thing, you got the oppertunity to think about a better spot so why not. Priority #1 is getting a good canopy overhead and fly yourself to a safe landing, as you get more experience you can elect to land with your chopped gear or keep an eye out for it so you know where it is, make a decision about WHERE and WHEN you chop, stuff like that. No-one will critise you for "just" doing #1, but they will when you try to do more and screw it up

ciel bleu,
Saskia

[JohnMitchell 14]

Quote

I think if more jumpers are getting hurt landing damaged canopies it could be two factors: smaller mains in general and PLF's are not taught like they used to be.

I don't know if you saw my earlier post, but I got injured landing a 5-cell Cirrus Cloud with a broken A-B line. Flew fine up high but bad L/D ratio and dropped rapidly when flared. I knew I was in trouble when I passed the treetops way too quickly.

This was a big main with a former round jumper who knows how to PLF. Without the PLF, my injuries would have been more serious.

I've seen 2 other broken bone injuries because of broken lines.

Previously I had landed two canopies with broken lines, stand ups, no problem. I'm 2 for 3 on this, which are not good enough odds to keep me from using my reserve.

[topdocker 0]

Yeah, I saw that post, but since most people wouldn't know a DC-5 from a DC-3, I figured expanding on it would create more confusion.

It is up to the individual jumper to assess the canopy and determine the risks, benefits, and alternatives to landing damaged gear.

I think this young jumper did an excellent job of doing an assessment and maing a choice he was willing to go with. Even if he had chose to cut away, I would back that decision. A lot of armchair quarterbacking here, but I give him a thumbs up just for being heads up and thinking.

top

Jump more, post less!

[377 20]

Although I likely would have cut away, you landed safely so it's tough to second guess your decisions. I have, however, seen canopy damage that was pretty serious and not clearly visible from the viewpoint of the suspended jumper. If the opening did some damage that you could see, it might have also done some that was not visible. You looked, you flew, you found it controlable. You decided it was landable and not in the process of further structural failure during the remaining flight. Turns out you were right. Glad it all worked out.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[robskydiv 0]

Quote

This was my first jump on a new container (Used, but new to me). I have made several jumps on this canopy, but we just put it in this container the night before. My plan was to open pretty high and learn the equipment. I opened at 5000 feet and I had a really hard opening that broke a line and ripped my canopy. Since I was still about 4000 feet I decided to see if it was still stable instead of just chopping it and going to reserve. I hit the brakes really hard several times and put it in a full stall, turned both directions fairly hard and kept a really close eye on the rip. It didnt grow and seemed to fly fine so I made the decision to land it. Once I got below about 2500 I was really easy on it just in case, but thigs went fine and I made a good landing right on target.
My questions are...
Should I have just cut away?
If it didnt tear more with agressive manuvers up high, was I stupid to land it?
What would you have done?

Ive been skydiving for about 5 years but still under 100 jumps. I believe that learning is something we do forever in this sport so Im looking for other opinions to help me make decions in the future.

Im including a pic so you can see the hole in the canopy.

The point seems so mute. You are here in one piece posting about it. Man I commend you on your assessment of your situation. You made a plan, stuck with it and here you are. Very difficult for me to make a counter point considering your success/survival.

[skybill 18]

Quote

This was my first jump on a new container (Used, but new to me). I have made several jumps on this canopy, but we just put it in this container the night before. My plan was to open pretty high and learn the equipment. I opened at 5000 feet and I had a really hard opening that broke a line and ripped my canopy. Since I was still about 4000 feet I decided to see if it was still stable instead of just chopping it and going to reserve. I hit the brakes really hard several times and put it in a full stall, turned both directions fairly hard and kept a really close eye on the rip. It didnt grow and seemed to fly fine so I made the decision to land it. Once I got below about 2500 I was really easy on it just in case, but thigs went fine and I made a good landing right on target.
My questions are...
Should I have just cut away?
If it didnt tear more with agressive manuvers up high, was I stupid to land it?
What would you have done?

Ive been skydiving for about 5 years but still under 100 jumps. I believe that learning is something we do forever in this sport so Im looking for other opinions to help me make decions in the future.

Im including a pic so you can see the hole in the canopy.

Hi M-L-C,
Yup, good job. Had a similiar situation almost to the location of the hole on my old 1500+ jumps Dijango "Dragonfly." It was flyin' fine so I flew it into the peas at Scare-Us-Valley and landed. Gotta say I'm glad I landed in the peas as the hole was dumping some air!! Similar to your sitruation I'd hate to have cut away and spent the rest of my life trying to get my reserve out!!! Know what I mean?? Even if the landing would have been a buttslider or p-l-f-er I'd rather be buyin' beer at the bar and tellin' my,"No shit thereIwas!" story than makin' a crater or endin' up in ICU!! One thing for sure, 'ya got a hole, your sink rate has increased!! Be careful on figgurin' out how much!! One thing about tears, once they stop tearing, they stop. They happen at max pressure at opening. They probably won't continue unless you have some really bad fabric!! Remember that 2 things that you had on your side this time were "Time" and "Altitude!!" Use them both wisely!!

SCR-2034, SCS-680

III%,
Deli-out

[cphelan 0]

Your on the ground not broken and alive! I say you you made the right decision!

[Andy9o8 0]

Quote

Your on the ground not broken and alive! I say you you made the right decision!

No offense; but this expression is one of my peeves. A successful result is not always the definition of the best procedure. Just as it's true that "you can do everything right and still die", it's also true that sometimes you can do something clearly wrong and still be fortunate enough (that time) to get a good result.

This being said, re: the OP's particular situation, I don't think there is a clear single correct answer; there are reasonable arguments both pro and con.

[midlifecrisis 0]

Thank you all once again for your input on this subject.
All of your comments have given me things to think about and Ive already discussed many of them with the DZO his training staff and my rigger.
My goal, and I assume everyone on here has a similar goal with skydiving, is to have a great time and live to do it again. Ive always believed that education is extremely important.

[Ron 7]

You lived, so you did the right thing.

*I* would have most likely gotten rid of it. I have seen normally "good" canopy's turn to crap right on landing.

But, you did a controlability check and it passed. You made the right call.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334