tdog 0 #1 June 1, 2006 Page 22 of Parachutist this month has an ad that talks about the troubles and efforts in making the new "Large Katana". "Resignation ultimatums to get their own way: 3. Resignation ultimatums to get their own way that worked: 0." I went to the PD web site to get more info and they still list the 120 as the largest, and the wingloading chart, as expected, has "not suggested" for anything less than "advanced". So, who is the target audience for a Katana 150 or 170? What are the characteristics of the larger versions - do they become more of an "intermediate canopy"??? Who on your dropzone do you see flying a larger Katana? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
upndownshop 0 #2 June 1, 2006 From what I understand they will start taking orders today. I also believe they took a while with those sizes because they wanted them to fly like the smaller ones. The larger sizes are probably for the larger jumpers who want the Katana's flight characteristics. Or a different loading. They will have them available to demo at certain events this year. I know they will be at SkyFest July 12-17 at SD Spaceland Maybe a PD rep will reply here as well. Hope that helps Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Floats18 0 #3 June 1, 2006 Call Ward at PD... I'm sure he'll tell you everything you need to know regarding the new katana sizes. I can't wait till I'm expierenced enough to jump one!--- and give them wings so they may fly free forever DiverDriver in Training Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #4 June 1, 2006 QuoteSo, who is the target audience for a Katana 150 or 170? What are the characteristics of the larger versions - do they become more of an "intermediate canopy"??? Who on your dropzone do you see flying a larger Katana? Guys like me. Big guys that have a little bit of experience and have worked their way up on swooping to a canopy of that performance level. For instance, I've been jumping a XF2 149 for about 2 years now. Been competiting in the CPC with it too.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kolla 0 #5 June 1, 2006 Matter of fact, I think AggieDave has been pestering me for a big Katana since the day I started working at PD... and back then we didn't even know we were going to build it Kim, our Demo Chick, is already building a waiting list for the larger sizes and the demos are being made. I can't wait to hear what jumpers will think of the 3 new sizes. I own a 107 and am 155-160 out the door, but have to tell you that 135 was one of the most fun canopies I have ever flown! And J - I just might see you in TX ;) Blue ones, KollaBlue Skies Magazine Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tdog 0 #6 June 1, 2006 QuoteMatter of fact, I think AggieDave has been pestering me for a big Katana since the day I started working at PD... and back then we didn't even know we were going to build it Kim, our Demo Chick, is already building a waiting list for the larger sizes and the demos are being made. I can't wait to hear what jumpers will think of the 3 new sizes. I own a 107 and am 155-160 out the door, but have to tell you that 135 was one of the most fun canopies I have ever flown! And J - I just might see you in TX ;) Blue ones, Kolla Ya, but AggieDave is not flying a 170, even if he calls himself big. Are the 150 and 170 going to be targeted to the nitche football linebacker sized swoopers, or is that starting to be targeted to the middle of the road very active skydiver who wants something sporty and fun to fly, but also does not want a 1.7 WL and is into canopy control but not the ultimate swoop???? Do you see, for an example, someone loading the 170 at 1.2-1.3? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #7 June 1, 2006 QuoteDo you see, for an example, someone loading the 170 at 1.2-1.3? I loaded my old 170 Heatwave at about 1.7:1... Although the "big guy" market isn't huge, it is there. There are also folks who will want something zippy and fun, but will load a 170 at 1.3-1.4 AND have the experience to fly something like that.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nbblood 0 #8 June 1, 2006 Quote And J - I just might see you in TX ;) Yeah! That's what I'm talking about! Oh, and bring that 135 with you too! See you there!Blues, Nathan If you wait 'til the last minute, it'll only take a minute. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyMan 7 #9 June 1, 2006 It's pretty rare that I get forced to eat my words. This would be one such occaision.... Previously, I posted: " As a bigger guy, it really sucks that the market leader simply won't make a canopy to sell me - not because it's unsafe, just their bean-counters say it's not worth it. It sucks even more that they won't admit to it, it's incredibly disrespectful of PD to string people along for years with a line of "just wait, it's coming!" It's clear to me that it isn't coming. I'm disapointed, but moreso - I'm angry with the years of lies". I think I'm going to go request a demo. :) _Am__ You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tdog 0 #10 June 1, 2006 which size are you demoing? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
upndownshop 0 #11 June 1, 2006 And J - I just might see you in TX ;) Quote Yooo hoo!! Of course that is if it doesnt ruin your other plans. If I remember right it was a decent trip you had planned?? Kolla in the dunk tank...Kolla in the dunk tank... shhhh... I know nothing....... Hope you can make it, it should be a good one.. J Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kolla 0 #12 June 1, 2006 I absolutely can see people flying the Katana at easy going wingloadings! I flew the 135 at roughly 1.2 and enjoyed every second. It's still a very lively canopy - built for an experienced canopy pilot no matter the wingloading. You may have noticed that the only canopy PD has posted "minimum wingloadings" for is the Velocity - and the minimum we recommend is 1.0 :) And J, enough with the dunk tank thing... although - if you quit smoking (for good!) I will agree to be dunked!!! Hows that for a bargain?? Bloooos, KollaBlue Skies Magazine Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ntacfreefly 0 #13 June 1, 2006 Kolla, When we're educating upcoming jumpers about the KA, especially at lower loadings, does Performance Designs have a minimum recommended number of jumps for the canopy? Basically I'd like to find out if a jumper with 200 jumps says they want to fly a 150/170 KA (instead of a S2) loaded at 1.2 what Performance Designs recommendation would be? I assume the same advice that would be given for a XF2 would be appropriate? Blues! IanTo the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders. ~ Lao-Tzu It's all good, they're my brothers ~ Mariann Kramer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks 0 #14 June 1, 2006 Kolla, not to hijack the thread, but THANK YOU GUYS at P.D. you know I just had my velo there, and I cannot say enough about the turnaround, the price, the service all around... you guys got it going on.... I am very very happy, expected it to take 2 times as long as it did, and cost 3X as much as it did. you will get a thank you letter from me soon. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bob.dino 0 #15 June 1, 2006 QuoteI loaded my old 170 Heatwave at about 1.7:1... Although the "big guy" market isn't huge... If it's loading a 170 at 1.7, it's definitely huge . I can see a lot of Katanas appearing at 1.3-1.7 loadings, roughly where a lot of people currently transition to XF2s. I wonder what it'll do to the sales of Stillettos? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ntacfreefly 0 #16 June 1, 2006 QuoteI wonder what it'll do to the sales of Stillettos? Hopefully put an end to them!!!! To the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders. ~ Lao-Tzu It's all good, they're my brothers ~ Mariann Kramer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites peek 20 #17 June 1, 2006 QuoteQuoteI wonder what it'll do to the sales of Stillettos? Hopefully put an end to them!!!! That is one of the stranger statements I've heard in quite a while. Care to elaborate? What has a Stiletto ever done to you to deserve that? [edited to add, "Is this tongue in cheek?"] Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AggieDave 6 #18 June 2, 2006 QuoteThat is one of the stranger statements I've heard in quite a while. Care to elaborate? What has a Stiletto ever done to you to deserve that? Well, more people have died under a Stiletto then under a Katana...--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Cloudi 0 #19 June 2, 2006 I'm so proud of our Engineering Dept. and test jumpers for not compromising and for making this happen!! They are simply the best! These larger sizes are going to be a beautiful thing for experienced canopy pilots who don't want to downsize, but want a more high performance wing than they are currently jumping. Putting a limit on minimum jump #'s is something I personally try to avoid. There are people with a lot of jumps who simply suck at canopy control and then there are people who have relatively few jumps who are excellent canopy pilots. I strongly feel there is a lot to be said for the experience someone can only gain by making the jumps, though. Always best to get that experience, make the mistakes, and learn as much as possible on novice and intermediate canopies, IMHO. I would venture to say it depends very much on the individual whether they are capable of handling a high performance canopy or not, regardless of canopy size & wing loading. My first instinct would be to say hell no to someone with around 200 jumps, but I would probably entertain the thought if they were extremely current, wouldn't be loading it aggressively, have been working closely with a canopy coach, have spent a lot of time on an intermediate canopy with some similar characteristics, have consistently safe, controlled landings, and their DZ feels strongly that it isn't beyond their skill level. The opportunity was there for me recently to try one in the same size I jump now (170), but I turned it down for the time being. I'm just not ready to take on the additional responsibility yet and I don't think I'm nearly current enough. I'm right where I think many people are at 300+ jumps. I have tons to learn, but I'm not completely oblivious either...and I probably think I'm a much better canopy pilot than I really am, too. I'm pretty conservative, though, so take my example, add currency, skill, and good instruction...you may find someone who will do ok with one. I can't wait to fly one when I'm ready. I just know I won't be disappointed! Oh, and AggieDave is 1st on the waiting list for a Katana 135 demo. He requested one last year... Demo's should be available around the middle of this month. Yippee!!! Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites nbblood 0 #20 June 2, 2006 QuoteOh, and AggieDave is 1st on the waiting list for a Katana 135 demo. He requested one last year... I'm right up there too, right?Blues, Nathan If you wait 'til the last minute, it'll only take a minute. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites diablopilot 2 #21 June 2, 2006 QuotePutting a limit on minimum jump #'s is something I personally try to avoid. They don't work anyway. The novices that won't listen always find someone to sell to them. That's why I'm sorry to see the larger sizes come out.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ntacfreefly 0 #22 June 2, 2006 QuoteThat is one of the stranger statements I've heard in quite a while. Care to elaborate? What has a Stiletto ever done to you to deserve that? I just happen to not like it's flight characteristics compared to more modern designs. For the right applications I still think it's a great canopy but I believe it's uses are more and more limited in the current market with newer designs available. Of course, to those pilots who still absolutely love their ST's. Party on - they're just not for me edit: Yes there was an element of tongue in cheek to the original post. Blues, IanTo the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders. ~ Lao-Tzu It's all good, they're my brothers ~ Mariann Kramer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ntacfreefly 0 #23 June 2, 2006 Thanks! That's pretty much the answer I expected Blues! IanTo the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders. ~ Lao-Tzu It's all good, they're my brothers ~ Mariann Kramer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Cloudi 0 #24 June 2, 2006 Oh, you were serious? Just kiddin'!!! Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites AggieDave 6 #25 June 2, 2006 QuoteOh, and AggieDave is 1st on the waiting list for a Katana 135 demo. He requested one last year... Cool Demo's should be available around the middle of this month. Yippee!!! Yeah! You know the DZ's address (Aggieland). Let me know so I can send you my CC info for the demo fee/shipping.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 Next Page 1 of 3 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
bob.dino 0 #15 June 1, 2006 QuoteI loaded my old 170 Heatwave at about 1.7:1... Although the "big guy" market isn't huge... If it's loading a 170 at 1.7, it's definitely huge . I can see a lot of Katanas appearing at 1.3-1.7 loadings, roughly where a lot of people currently transition to XF2s. I wonder what it'll do to the sales of Stillettos? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ntacfreefly 0 #16 June 1, 2006 QuoteI wonder what it'll do to the sales of Stillettos? Hopefully put an end to them!!!! To the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders. ~ Lao-Tzu It's all good, they're my brothers ~ Mariann Kramer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peek 20 #17 June 1, 2006 QuoteQuoteI wonder what it'll do to the sales of Stillettos? Hopefully put an end to them!!!! That is one of the stranger statements I've heard in quite a while. Care to elaborate? What has a Stiletto ever done to you to deserve that? [edited to add, "Is this tongue in cheek?"] Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #18 June 2, 2006 QuoteThat is one of the stranger statements I've heard in quite a while. Care to elaborate? What has a Stiletto ever done to you to deserve that? Well, more people have died under a Stiletto then under a Katana...--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cloudi 0 #19 June 2, 2006 I'm so proud of our Engineering Dept. and test jumpers for not compromising and for making this happen!! They are simply the best! These larger sizes are going to be a beautiful thing for experienced canopy pilots who don't want to downsize, but want a more high performance wing than they are currently jumping. Putting a limit on minimum jump #'s is something I personally try to avoid. There are people with a lot of jumps who simply suck at canopy control and then there are people who have relatively few jumps who are excellent canopy pilots. I strongly feel there is a lot to be said for the experience someone can only gain by making the jumps, though. Always best to get that experience, make the mistakes, and learn as much as possible on novice and intermediate canopies, IMHO. I would venture to say it depends very much on the individual whether they are capable of handling a high performance canopy or not, regardless of canopy size & wing loading. My first instinct would be to say hell no to someone with around 200 jumps, but I would probably entertain the thought if they were extremely current, wouldn't be loading it aggressively, have been working closely with a canopy coach, have spent a lot of time on an intermediate canopy with some similar characteristics, have consistently safe, controlled landings, and their DZ feels strongly that it isn't beyond their skill level. The opportunity was there for me recently to try one in the same size I jump now (170), but I turned it down for the time being. I'm just not ready to take on the additional responsibility yet and I don't think I'm nearly current enough. I'm right where I think many people are at 300+ jumps. I have tons to learn, but I'm not completely oblivious either...and I probably think I'm a much better canopy pilot than I really am, too. I'm pretty conservative, though, so take my example, add currency, skill, and good instruction...you may find someone who will do ok with one. I can't wait to fly one when I'm ready. I just know I won't be disappointed! Oh, and AggieDave is 1st on the waiting list for a Katana 135 demo. He requested one last year... Demo's should be available around the middle of this month. Yippee!!! Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nbblood 0 #20 June 2, 2006 QuoteOh, and AggieDave is 1st on the waiting list for a Katana 135 demo. He requested one last year... I'm right up there too, right?Blues, Nathan If you wait 'til the last minute, it'll only take a minute. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #21 June 2, 2006 QuotePutting a limit on minimum jump #'s is something I personally try to avoid. They don't work anyway. The novices that won't listen always find someone to sell to them. That's why I'm sorry to see the larger sizes come out.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ntacfreefly 0 #22 June 2, 2006 QuoteThat is one of the stranger statements I've heard in quite a while. Care to elaborate? What has a Stiletto ever done to you to deserve that? I just happen to not like it's flight characteristics compared to more modern designs. For the right applications I still think it's a great canopy but I believe it's uses are more and more limited in the current market with newer designs available. Of course, to those pilots who still absolutely love their ST's. Party on - they're just not for me edit: Yes there was an element of tongue in cheek to the original post. Blues, IanTo the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders. ~ Lao-Tzu It's all good, they're my brothers ~ Mariann Kramer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ntacfreefly 0 #23 June 2, 2006 Thanks! That's pretty much the answer I expected Blues! IanTo the mind that is still, the whole universe surrenders. ~ Lao-Tzu It's all good, they're my brothers ~ Mariann Kramer Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cloudi 0 #24 June 2, 2006 Oh, you were serious? Just kiddin'!!! Kim Watch as I attempt, with no slight of hand, to apply logic and reason. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #25 June 2, 2006 QuoteOh, and AggieDave is 1st on the waiting list for a Katana 135 demo. He requested one last year... Cool Demo's should be available around the middle of this month. Yippee!!! Yeah! You know the DZ's address (Aggieland). Let me know so I can send you my CC info for the demo fee/shipping.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
