Dealing with the reality of death and injury – enlighten a rookie!

[OlympiaStoica 0]

Ten months ago, following a divorce, I decided it is time to live life for myself and through a friend, I booked my first jump – a tandem. It was love at first jump for me and a few days later I was a new student skydiver in the first jump course. I was terrified out of my mind through my first 25+ jumps, but completely hooked on my newfound passion – no matter how hard I tried, I couldn’t find the “strength” to quit. At the time, I read the statistics, I made peace with them … and I moved on.

In my first few months, I heard of people breaking their legs and even a couple of them dying, but I didn’t personally know any of them; 10 months, 124 jumps and a couple of boogies later the situation has changed a bit.

Based on my limited experience so far, it seems that deaths are relatively limited in numbers (I say “relatively” because even one death is one too many), but injuries are commonplace. Recovering from a minor ankle fracture myself as we speak, in the past few weeks, four people I know got injured, all of them seriously (requiring surgery and months of recovery). This, for me, gives a new meaning to those same statistics I read 10 months ago – all of the sudden they aren’t numbers on paper anymore … they’re names, they’re faces, they’re people …

Reading the forums in the past few days, I came to realize I’m dealing with a “tough crowd” … I wouldn’t expect anything else from a group of people that defy death just for fun. However, I do hope to spark some serious conversation, beyond the inherent (and expected) smart ass remarks
Those of you that have been around awhile, how do you deal with the reality of having friends get injured or die? Does it give you any pause? Does it cause you to re-evaluate your decision of being in the sport?

O

[wmw999 2,120]

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Does it give you any pause? Does it cause you to re-evaluate your decision of being in the sport?

Everything gives me pause. None have caused me to re-evaluate my decision to skydive.

I quit for 13 years due to an incident where my husband was the survivor; he didn't want to jump any more, and, frankly, skydiving isn't all that compatible with raising a small child the way we wanted to. I took it up again once our son was older. Skydiving isn't safe, and it's very time-consuming. I don't regret doing it, and I don't regret the time I spent not doing it.

But each and every incident and accident gives me pause, because I try to think of what chain of events would find me in that situation, and how would I break that chain as early as possible? There's no way I can imagine everything, but by imagining some, I hope it keeps me making better decisions earlier, instead of being forced into decisions later.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[downwardspiral 0]

I'm on a skydiving hiatus and always had the intention of returning. Over the years I've had a few friends die. It hurts every time but I spend a night drinking to their memory and move on. Though, the last friend that died I haven't been able to shake. I am now officially on the fence about whether I will return.

oh fuck I'll probably return.

www.FourWheelerHB.com

[wmw999 2,120]

By the way, this is a really good topic, and well framed. Thanks for your post.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[karlm 0]

The reality is that if any of us, even the weekend tandem pax, does not accept that if we survive the plane ride to altitude, then the 60sec once we leave the plane could be your last, then we have no place in this sport.

I have lost good close and dear friends, but they all understood and accepted the risk, I have friends injured for life, and survivors.

Each person that leave us due to this sport will be missed, and we should learn from them and from our own mistakes and situations and make the choice to either stay in the sport or walk away with good and sad memories.

Injury is almost inevitable as time goes on ...

Better never to have met you in my dream than to wake and reach for hands that are not there.

[skittles_of_SDC 0]

I broke my leg Jan 1, 2009. I now have a plate and 10 screws (plate and 8 in the Fib 2 in the Tib). About 5 weeks after that one of my friends broke his ankle down in PR from something that wasn't even his fault. His foot got stuck in a hole and broke. Another friend broke fingers down in PR. I'd be lying if I said I didn't think about quitting. But then I think about how much fun I have while skydiving and all the great friends I've made that I would be leaving behind. Thinking about quitting lasted maybe a week if that. Now that I'm healed and have been back for the last 5-6 weeks I'm glad I didn't throw in the towel. I've made some major mistakes in my life but for me personally, that is to say not everyone will agree, quitting (because I'm scared) would probably be one of the biggest ones I could make.

[txhoss 0]

To me it is a very calculated decision. I have studied the statistics, read a lot in the "incidents" forum and tried to glean anything that I can from the posts and information passed on. I feel like I understand the risks. The being said, I have chosen gear and procedures that I feel do not push the limits of my experience and ability.

Bottom line is that I will quit when my perception of the risks or detriment to my "family" life exceeds the satisfaction that I get from jumping.

Have Rig will travel ...

[billvon 2,395]

>they’re names, they’re faces, they’re people …

Yes, that's the basic problem. People die every day, but we don't know most of them. When we skydive, we get to know people in a sport which may well kill them.

I've lost a lot of friends over the years. The ones that affected me hardest were Harry Rosenblatt, John O'Hara, Diego, Taz, Shannon, Barb, Harry O'Connor and Brooke. These were all people I'd gone drinking with, jumped with, commiserated with, and usually, survived with. And in skydiving they don't fade away. I can't be in the Bomb Shelter without seeing that big picture of Harry, and I can't look at a picture of the 400-way without searching out Taz's slot.

But on the other hand, I would have never gotten to know these people at all if not for skydiving to begin with. So am I better off for knowing Taz for a few years than never knowing her at all? It hurts more to have met her and then lose her, but I think overall I'm glad I had the chance, even for a short time.

[JohnMitchell 14]

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then the 60sec once we leave the plane could be your last.

Hmm, maybe 70 seconds or so. Remember, you'll get at least an extra 10-15 seconds of freefall.

Easy to joke about, but tough to bear. I work as hard as I can to make the sport as safe as I can in the memory of all of my friends that are gone. Skydiving will break your heart sometimes.

[madhatter 0]

I took an unintentional break from skydiving for about 2.5 years 2001 - 2004.. Life just got in the way.

The death of a previous instructor and good friend shook me to my core, but it also reminded me of of skydiving and what I owed to the sport - the friends, experiences & lessons it had brought me. Much as I mourn Graham, his death is what motivated me to buy a rig & start jumping again.

Some of the comments around here might seem harsh, but it's no less insensitive than discussing a motor vehicle accident. If a friend were to roll their car, you'd firstly be concerned, then you'd want to know what happened. Someone'll always speculate that it was negligence or some such mistake on the driver's side and sometimes it might actually be proven in the case of a DUI or the likes. The final outcome doesn't matter - for a few days you'll probably concentrate more on your own driving and being safe, but the event doesn't stop you from getting in your car and driving.

The same goes for the Air France disaster last week - people are still boarding planes and flying across the globe.

Skydiving, being the small community it is, tends to bring incidents much closer to home, but it still comes down to acceptance of risk - as does most our daily activities. I'd like to believe I'm not "defying death just for fun", but rather enjoying experiences and sights that many people unreasonably fearful of death will never be able to appreciate.

Disclaimer: It's late here in SA, so I hope all of this makes some kind of sense

A VERY MERRY UNBIRTHDAY TO YOU!!!
D.S # 125

[madhatter 0]

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>they’re names, they’re faces, they’re people …

Yes, that's the basic problem. People die every day, but we don't know most of them. When we skydive, we get to know people in a sport which may well kill them.

I've lost a lot of friends over the years. The ones that affected me hardest were Harry Rosenblatt, John O'Hara, Diego, Taz, Shannon, Barb, Harry O'Connor and Brooke. These were all people I'd gone drinking with, jumped with, commiserated with, and usually, survived with. And in skydiving they don't fade away. I can't be in the Bomb Shelter without seeing that big picture of Harry, and I can't look at a picture of the 400-way without searching out Taz's slot.

But on the other hand, I would have never gotten to know these people at all if not for skydiving to begin with. So am I better off for knowing Taz for a few years than never knowing her at all? It hurts more to have met her and then lose her, but I think overall I'm glad I had the chance, even for a short time.

Excellent explanation.

A VERY MERRY UNBIRTHDAY TO YOU!!!
D.S # 125

[TheBachelor 4]

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Those of you that have been around awhile, how do you deal with the reality of having friends get injured or die? Does it give you any pause? Does it cause you to re-evaluate your decision of being in the sport?

It's only a matter of time before someone you know dies or is seriously injured in this sport. The first one for me was a cameraman at the DZ I did my first 100 jumps at. It was tough to hear, but I didn't consider quitting the sport. Since that time, I've known another 10 or so who have died and a few more with serious injuries.

A couple of thoughts: 1) I know the risks in the sport, and I know how safe the equipment is. To me, the sport is safe. 2) I've gotten so much out of skydiving that, to me, if I end up dying as a result of doing it, it would have been worth it.

There are battered women? I've been eating 'em plain all of these years...

[OlympiaStoica 0]

While walking around in crutches these days, those that know how I acquired my injury are asking me if I’m quitting, kind of expecting I’d answer “yes”. I haven’t considered doing so, not even for a second, but than again … my injury is minor, and I haven’t yet experienced the death of a friend. I know that if I stick around that day is coming and I guess I’m sort of trying to prepare myself (if that is at all possible).

Thank you all for sharing your thoughts on a subject that is sensitive and at times taboo. Not many have been willing to engage in this kind of talk; than again, when I’m at the drop zone I don’t want to talk about death and injury either.

O

[JohnRich 4]

I've known plenty of people who have died in car accidents, but it doesn't make me want to quit driving - it makes me careful.

I've known plenty of people who have died of heart attacks and cancer, but it doesn't make me want to quit playing hard - it makes me be careful about my health.

I've know plenty of people who have died skydiving, but it doesn't make me want to quit skydiving - it makes me cautious about my gear and in the air.

You can hide inside your house the rest of your life and be more safe than people who drive, skydive and play hard. Or you can resolve to live life to its fullest, accept the risk, and do what you can to be careful.

There are never any guarantees.

[happythoughts 0]

As skydivers, we think of ourselves as "risk managers".
We believe that we can measure how much risk that we take.

We wish to enjoy the parts of life that matter.
Friendships, fun, exposure to adventure.

To step out of that door, you have to arrive at a point where
you believe in yourself. You take the training and check the gear, but ultimately it is that belief.

The friendships are sometimes more deep because it is wonderful
to share a common excitement for life. It is a stronger bond.

It is painful to lose friends. It is extremely sad when they
are people who are excited about life.

[taylor.freefall 0]

I just had a baby, about 3 months ago, and I've been told I'm being selfish for continuing (or more wanting to) skydiving, (not by my wife I might add).
So much so that it's sown that seed of doubt into my head and every time I jump now it certainly gives me more to worry about.
The injury or dying aspect didn't bother as much as what it does now, of course it was always there, but...
The only other problem with skydiving is that every other hobby seems boring in comparison.

[LongWayToFall 0]

Got life insurance?

[cocheese 0]

how do you deal with the reality of having friends get injured or die? Go jump.

Does it give you any pause? No

Does it cause you to re-evaluate your decision of being in the sport? No

(I'm a man of few words)

[tbrown 26]

While skydiving is inherently dangerous, I don't really accept the claim that it "isn't safe". I'm a rather cautious person and if jumping was really that dangerous, I wouldn't do it. Which is why I choose not to BASE jump or get into canopy swooping.

I did take a 22 year break from the sport, partly to raise a family, and partly because I'd lost so many friends in the old days that I was finally spooked into believing my number was coming up if I didn't quit. My list of friends who have died is at least two dozen names long and I can never remember all of their names at any one time. Thankfully, almost all of them are from the old days and have been gone for a long time. After returning six years ago there are finally two new names as well, plus one good friend who was seriously injured last month. But even though I broke a leg five years ago, I'm feeling pretty upbeat about jumping these days.

I believe the sport IS safer than it used to be. The reward so far outweighs the risk that it's not bothering me these days. But that can always change, in a year or in a day. It's a very personal equation and I respect anyone's choice as to whether or not they want to stay in "our little sport".

Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity !

[airdvr 197]

Everyone I know who has spent any time in the sport has had moments when they consider the risk v. the reward with more than just a casual glance. Probably several times. When the reward no longer outwieghs the risk it'll be over for you.

Please don't dent the planet.

Destinations by Roxanne

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

I haven't been injured yet, nor have I had anyone I know personally get hurt or killed.
I did have a close call early on, and I've seen a couple scary looking landings by friends. (Oh shit! He's gonna hit HARD!! and then barely pulled it out).

I do realize that leaving the plane may well be the last thing I do.

On the flip side, I could get killed driving down the freeway, riding my motorcycle, walking my dog, ect, ect.

If not jumping meant I was guaranteed to live to 90+ and die in my sleep, then I'd quit in a heartbeat. But nothing is guaranteed.

It all boils down to risk/reward calculation. It's worth it to me.

There was a Thread in the Womens forum that was similar - reserve ride instead of injury. Its easier to link it than repeat all of what I said there. It still applies and is still how I feel.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[DaGimp 0]

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Those of you that have been around awhile, how do you deal with the reality of having friends get injured or die? Does it give you any pause? Does it cause you to re-evaluate your decision of being in the sport?

I havent read the whole thread...just your post, but ill give you my insight which may have already been posted....but oh well...

I have been jumping almost 10 years, and in that time I myself have been injured four times, three of which required surgery. Did that make me slow down....not in the least, its a risk we take to participate in the sport we love.

I have also in my ten years have had four very close personal friends die, and another that I personally witnessed. Did that make me slow down, no.

Reason being, Skydiving isnt just a sport, or a hobby, to alot it is a lifestyle, not just a weekend recreation. We all know the risks and dangers involved within it, and face that risk every time we step on that airplane. Would I every stop because one of my skydiver family died in the sport....never, I would raise my glass at the end of the day, toast them to Blue Skies, Balck Death, and continue jumping the next day, cause thats what any true skydiver would want. Keep them in your memory and do what you both loved to do!!

"Professor of Pimpology"~~~Bolas

[JohnMitchell 14]

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I just had a baby, about 3 months ago, and I've been told I'm being selfish for continuing (or more wanting to) skydiving, (not by my wife I might add).

Children deserve to have loving parents that are themselves fulfilled. Our children are all teenagers and older now, but looking back, I think growing up at the DZ was enriching for them. All those interesting, amazing, intelligent people we all love at the DZ were friends with our children too.
+1 on the life insurance, and make sure it pays off if you get killed skydiving. It could happen to anyone.

[virgin-burner 1]

did the same as you, inquired, read a lot, kinda thought, looks somehow safe..

did the training, there was a dude that almost killed himself hooking low when i was still a student.. and i sat next to impact, felt the ground shake.. moved on, thought, injuries, maybe, but maybe i can go on without knowing someone dying personally..

i was wrong!

planecrash, two friends gone. a third i partied witth for sure but cant remember just recently..

but i love skydiving! now, i'm just trying to be careful myself, sometimes, i have this feeling that on the jump i'm about to take, something will happen. i dont like that feeling tough, but if it helps to keep me on my toes..

“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.”
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda

[OlympiaStoica 0]

Got a laugh out of it on this Saturday morning. "Flaring is a sign of weakness"? LOL ... I guess I'm strong than ... strong with a broken ankle :)

And "nylon coffin flyer"... ha ha ... funny :).

All I got is:

- Muff Bros #4430
- S.L.U.T. # 11

O