A simple question: Helmets

[wolfriverjoe 1,339]

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Free-fly-friendly helmets are the exact opposite offering almost no facial protection and precious little cranial protection, but they are COOOOL!.

I see the teams doing serious VRW are mostly wearing full face helmets.

Probably for the same reason as the RW teams. When you are trying to turn points that fast, the occasional puch or kick is inevitable. And a foot to the face hurts.

To the OP: I wear a hard helmet on every jump. My Pro-Tec has a lot of scratches and scrapes. Most of them would have drawn blood from an unprotected scalp. Doing a PLF one time, I found a fist-sized (or a little smaller) rock on the edge of the grass runway. With my head. It made a hell of a noise when I hit it. Probable concussion, possible fracture had I not been wearing a helmet (although a frap hat probably would have protected me just fine).

It's your head, it's your choice.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[Master_Yoda 0]

Hey Jimmy, looks like we got our D licenses about the same time.
You - D12122
Me - D12016

[Master_Yoda 0]

Just a little story about my first cutaway.
I had about 130 jumps at the time and was jumping a club loaner rig. Can't remember what the container or main was but the reserve was a 26' lopo.
I deployed at 3ish and a low speed spinning malfuction... no big deal. Look, reach, look, reach, pull PULL. I had a reserve over my head at about 2000 ft. BUT my Pro-Tec helmet had been knocked off during the reserve deployment. What I believe and what was the popular theory by everyone else was that the spring loaded pilot chute caught the back edge of my helmet and pushed it off my head as it sprung out. The buckle was what caught a piece of my cheek and cut it. Yes, it WAS buckled properly. And I had blood all over my jumpsuit...
I ended up landing in a small opening in the forest on the edge off the dropzone doing a plf on a decomposing log. It was actually very soft! Lucky me.
I ended up with a bunch of stitches across my face and a good scar to remember it by. It has faded quite a bit over the years but it's still there.

I guess the only point here is that a frap hat wouldn't have come off like that.
But I also admit that it COULD have been any number of things that cut my face. A riser edge, maybe a piece of the three ring assembly, or maybe a wayward cutaway cable all could have conceivably done the deed.

[Master_Yoda 0]

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Some of the coolest skygods even went bare-headed in the late 1980s!

Sorry if my sarcasm does not translate well into the written word.

LOL! No worries. No one has ever seriously accused me of being a "skygod" before. I think it's kinda funny. At Lugoff, S. Carolina in the late 80's, the only people who wore helmets were students!

[MikeJD 0]

I've been jumping long enough to remember how 'cool' frap hats once were. And yet they're the one item of skydiving gear that always get a laugh from friends and family of tandem students.
I've heard it said - and I've no evidence for or against this - that a frap hat actually provides better protection to the crown of the head than a typical full face helmet. But when it comes to a kick in the face, obviously there's no contest. And the comfort provided by a full face helmet is hard to argue against.

Regarding scrapes on the shell of the helmet, I don't agree that these would have been applied to your head had you not been wearing it. Most full-face helmets makes your head a lot bigger, so you're more likely to catch it when climbing out. I think that's when most scrapes happen.

[KermieCorleone 0]

I think frap hats are the bees knees ...

- Neil

Never make assumptions! That harmless rectangle could be two triangles having sex ...

[popsjumper 2]

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Frap hats went the way of Bell Bottom trousers and Cabbage Patch dolls ... Ugly one and all

While I was too old for cabbage patch, I DID have bell-bottoms and I STILL wear my frap hat.

Speak for yourself you old fart.


Hard helmets only mean that you can't take a punch...wimps.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[riggerrob 558]

Sounds more like a riser snagged the edge of your Pro-TEc.
I wore a PRO-Tec for many years, but quit after the left edge dis-connected my RSL too many times.
Now I wear a Hard shell HR2 that is slightly smaller than a Pro-Tec. I have not had any SLs accidentally release with my new helmet.

[skycc 0]

I was a late convert and was the only frap hat on many dives, and made quite a few jumps with no helmet years ago. Looking back I'm almost surprised I did that running out of a DC-3, as I have managed to clock myself with just a frap hat running out of an Otter door and it hurt.

I finally got a full face and do enjoy some aspects of it. However, I never wanted to use it when teaching AFF (I preferred to have my students see my mouth/smile and also hear commands during climbout). Luckily, in all my years of teaching AFF, I only got one glancing blow to the face during a ride-thru, and one punch to the face at pull time.

I also have an open face hard helmet I wear occasionally, but as an organizer I usually go with the full-face. I admit to getting a bloody chin once from a fairly new jumper when I wore my open face.

The full face is without a doubt the best protection, but it is a personal choice.

I STILL have my old frap hat, though, just haven't worn it in years.

[Master_Yoda 0]

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Sounds more like a riser snagged the edge of your Pro-TEc.
I wore a PRO-Tec for many years, but quit after the left edge dis-connected my RSL too many times.
Now I wear a Hard shell HR2 that is slightly smaller than a Pro-Tec. I have not had any SLs accidentally release with my new helmet.

Rob, thanks for your reply. I figure the riser is as likely as anything else. I really don't know exactly what took my helmet off or what cut my face. But after starting this thread and hearing various opinions and such, I have to admit that a full face helmet most likely would have prevented the cut.

[Master_Yoda 0]

I'm likely to get both an open face and a full face helmet. I won't have to hear how passe they are from the youngsters. Not to mention custom frap hats are no more. And it'll give me an excuse to get creative with my airbrush. Then I'll look really cool! lol

[grimmie 173]

We were doing 16 way at the Lost Prairie boogie last month. On our second jump the pilot made a series of errors and laumched us off of the plane at 130+kts and a 30 degree downward right turn. It was a pretty crazy launch to say the least. Very violent. I was outside center giving the count. Instantly and with tremendous force we were launched out of the door on "Set". I knocked heads with the inside jumper across from me and was knocked out for 3 or 4 seconds. I have a "Platinum" full face hard shell. The impact put a crack in my helmet about one inch long in two different spots. The jumper I hit lost his face piece and was knocked silly, but not out.
A frap hat or no helmet would have been a disaster. IMHO
Note: the pilot bought the entire 16 way and video man another jump ticket. That was a class thing to do.

I also think that jumpers with full face helmets have a better chance of surviving a crash on take off or some other aircraft problem. IMHO

I was in an Otter and a Skyvan that each had take off issues. Everyone was scrambling to get their helmets on. It amazes me that long time jumpers still don't wear their helmets on take off.

Wear your helmets kids.

Note: I don't wear it in Belize because I have seen a jumper almost drown during a water landing wearing a full face. But I plan on getting an open face hard shell soon for the boogie.

[Amazon 7]

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We were doing 16 way at the Lost Prairie boogie last month. On our second jump the pilot made a series of errors and laumched us off of the plane at 130+kts and a 30 degree downward right turn. It was a pretty crazy launch to say the least. Very violent. I was outside center giving the count. Instantly and with tremendous force we were launched out of the door on "Set". I knocked heads with the inside jumper across from me and was knocked out for 3 or 4 seconds. I have a "Platinum" full face hard shell. The impact put a crack in my helmet about one inch long in two different spots. The jumper I hit lost his face piece and was knocked silly, but not out.
A frap hat or no helmet would have been a disaster. IMHO
Note: the pilot bought the entire 16 way and video man another jump ticket. That was a class thing to do.

I also think that jumpers with full face helmets have a better chance of surviving a crash on take off or some other aircraft problem. IMHO

I was in an Otter and a Skyvan that each had take off issues. Everyone was scrambling to get their helmets on. It amazes me that long time jumpers still don't wear their helmets on take off.

Wear your helmets kids.

Note: I don't wear it in Belize because I have seen a jumper almost drown during a water landing wearing a full face. But I plan on getting an open face hard shell soon for the boogie.

I saw a young jumper yesterday get a not so nice reminder of why a helmet is a good piece of kit to WEAR. ( he was jumping with NO HELMET)
He was jumping a C-182 and the flap is one sharp little piece of aluminum that he walked into with his forehead

[KermieCorleone 0]

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We were doing 16 way at the Lost Prairie boogie last month. On our second jump the pilot made a series of errors and laumched us off of the plane at 130+kts and a 30 degree downward right turn. It was a pretty crazy launch to say the least. Very violent. I was outside center giving the count. Instantly and with tremendous force we were launched out of the door on "Set". I knocked heads with the inside jumper across from me and was knocked out for 3 or 4 seconds. I have a "Platinum" full face hard shell. The impact put a crack in my helmet about one inch long in two different spots. The jumper I hit lost his face piece and was knocked silly, but not out.
A frap hat or no helmet would have been a disaster. IMHO
Note: the pilot bought the entire 16 way and video man another jump ticket. That was a class thing to do.

I also think that jumpers with full face helmets have a better chance of surviving a crash on take off or some other aircraft problem. IMHO

I was in an Otter and a Skyvan that each had take off issues. Everyone was scrambling to get their helmets on. It amazes me that long time jumpers still don't wear their helmets on take off.

Wear your helmets kids.

Note: I don't wear it in Belize because I have seen a jumper almost drown during a water landing wearing a full face. But I plan on getting an open face hard shell soon for the boogie.

'Platinum" helmet? which company make and model is it?

I currently wear a BandX Protec knockoff and most likely my next helmet will be a protec. If and when I do get a full face helmet I would like to get one with some crush material on the inside not just a shell with a fleece liner like most skydiving helmets. Anyone try jumping with full face downhill mtb/bmx helmets?

- Neil

Never make assumptions! That harmless rectangle could be two triangles having sex ...

[Master_Yoda 0]

I guess the whole thing about my desire to jump without a helmet is feeling the relative wind on my face. Knowing that it's distorting my facial features in some amusing way.. rippling the skin on my cheek bones.

Are you safer with a $300.00 full-face helmet?

HELL YES!

But it ain't anywhere near as much fun.
http://i211.photobucket.com/albums/bb117/Fishmonger_707/NSLF72.jpg

[jaffo 0]

I love my Oxygen full face helmet. I just put in a new lens. I don't have any experiences of my own to share,

"There I was about to DIE!!"..lol...

But I started wearing one after one of my skydiving mentors got kicked in the face by a student about 10 years ago. She came close to a Cypres fire. She wasn't knocked out, but took a bit to regain her composure. She called it "loopy".

*I also like the warmth,
*the noise reduction
*the place for my pro-dytter, (I love having an audible as a backup).
*I can close the shield after the door opens and not be fogged up.
* I can wear my expensive $10 sunglasses without them coming off.

I have ridden Harley's for years and had 2 different friends die from VERY minor incidents that would have been fine in a helmet.

I spent years riding broncs without one, but now many of my friends on bulls and broncs are putting them on.

NONE of these things are scientific, but all make me feel better...and there is a lot to be said for that.

Ryder

Take chances, just do it with all the information to make good decisions!!

Muff Brother# 2706 Dudeist Skydiver# 121.5

[Nightingale 0]

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So what's the deal today? Is this just a cultural safety thing gone excessive or are DZs requiring helmets? WTF, over???

I've never seen anyone require a helmet, but I haven't been to that many DZs. However, helmets were something that my instructors and other mentors discussed with me and I took a lesson from other peoples' experiences and decided it was a good idea.

I've only got 100 jumps and I just do RW for fun, but in that time, I've been kicked in the face hard enough to put a crack in the face shield on my helmet, and I've knocked my head on the door hard enough to leave a dent in the helmet when the person who was floating slipped before we were done setting up and had a hand on my chest strap and pulled me out too. Either one of those could've easily knocked me out if I'd been wearing something other than a full face helmet.

If I want to feel the wind on my face, I'll put my open face helmet on and go play in the tunnel. That said, everyone has their own level of comfort. I wouldn't ride a motorcycle without a good helmet, but I ride with friends who are comfortable with the absolute minimum required by law and take even that off as soon as they hit the state line, and that's their choice.

[nite97m 0]

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He was jumping a C-182 and the flap is one sharp little piece of aluminum that he walked into with his forehead

The ever famous Cessna Diamond forehead. Among the first few things taught when I was flight training with cessna's is paying close attention to the wing while moving around the aircraft.

[happythoughts 0]

I still own a frap hat. I usually jump my full face.
The function of a helmet is not necessarily to save your life,
sometimes it just save cuts and bruises.
Incidental contact with floater bars, peoples knees, or people playing bowling for skydivers.

I bought a full face when I started doing 4-way a while back. At some point, you get kicked.

A frap hat has a little inside pocket to hold my pro-track, but it won't hold a camera.

Many people are choosing hard helmets because they want to attach a camera, even the tiny go-pro cameras.

Skydiving hard helmets are not legally rated for hard impact in the way that a motorcycle helmet is.
It may not save your life in the same fashion, but it certainly may help.