Hvance 0 #1 November 7, 2010 Had a step-through yesterday (uneventful after a controlability check). I didn't pack this one, so I can't say whether it was packed that way or not. An instructor (popsjumper) had mentioned that the d-bag might have flipped through the lines on opening causing the same problem. How might that happen? A rare, random occurrence or caused by specific things? My deployment sequence felt normal. Canopy inflated in ~3-4 seconds. Was stable belly to earth.I wish Google Maps had an "Avoid Ghetto" routing option. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AndyMan 7 #2 November 7, 2010 It seems unlikely that it would flip through the lines on opening, the drag from the pilot chute should keep stop that from happening. However, I have flipped the dbag through the lines while packing. It's easy to do when you're putting the bag in the container if you're not paying attention. If you had a step through malfunction and you're sure the packer did a 3-line check, that would be my bet. _Am__ You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stratostar 5 #3 November 7, 2010 A wise old man once told me, "pack your own rig kid, you get out what you put in".... Pretty good advice, packers are for the lazy!you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
erdnarob 1 #4 November 7, 2010 I am pretty sure that problem was caused at the packing. The most important check at the packing is the line check. I speculate that a line check has been done and looking OK while the risers under the pack at the 3 rings level were turned side way out by 180 degrees including the rig "shoulders". If the risers/rig shoulders had been well placed under the rig, the lines check would have revealed the problem. A case of a mistake hidding another one. Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hvance 0 #5 November 7, 2010 Quote A wise old man once told me, "pack your own rig kid, you get out what you put in".... Pretty good advice, packers are for the lazy! I usually do pack for myself. That packjob was at the end of a boogie and I was tired. And now I see what happened... I wish Google Maps had an "Avoid Ghetto" routing option. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 3 #6 November 7, 2010 Quote Quote A wise old man once told me, "pack your own rig kid, you get out what you put in".... Pretty good advice, packers are for the lazy! I usually do pack for myself. That packjob was at the end of a boogie and I was tired. And now I see what happened... This wasn't packed at the farm last weekend and had a card on the rig that says something similiar to: You're welcome for the free packjob. I was drunk and blindfolded though, good luck! was it?"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hvance 0 #7 November 7, 2010 Quote Quote Quote A wise old man once told me, "pack your own rig kid, you get out what you put in".... Pretty good advice, packers are for the lazy! I usually do pack for myself. That packjob was at the end of a boogie and I was tired. And now I see what happened... This wasn't packed at the farm last weekend and had a card on the rig that says something similiar to: You're welcome for the free packjob. I was drunk and blindfolded though, good luck! was it? Haha, no. Someone else had that one..Travis maybe? That packjob opened fine I think. I wish Google Maps had an "Avoid Ghetto" routing option. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 0 #8 November 7, 2010 Quote Had a step-through yesterday (uneventful after a controlability check). I didn't pack this one, so I can't say whether it was packed that way or not It takes 1 second from pilot chute toss to line stretch. It was packed that way. There's simply no way it was packed correctly and it flipped through during deployment. Try and imagine how the pilot chute could have pulled the bag out of the container then have it flip through, it can't do it. Do it on the ground and you'll be certain it was packed up that way. The packer failed to perform a simple check to determine if the lines were correctly oriented. Luckily it was a flip through and not a step through one riser group. Whoever is allowing him to pack there needs to have a discussion with the packer. It's rather interesting flying with twisted risers isn't it? That's an easy one to deal with. A step through a riser group would have almost positively resulted in a cutaway. The simple line check would determine either one.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,047 #9 November 7, 2010 Hi hookit, Quote It was packed that way. Or one could do a complete forward flip when pulling. Yours truly did that on a main ripcord rig on an early 10-second or so jump. Not much chance of that with today's type of gear; thank goodness. JerryBaumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #10 November 7, 2010 On opening.....while threotically possible, it's highly unlikely given that the PC would have to be pulled through too. Rolling the bag through while packing is much more likely. We talked about that.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 0 #11 November 7, 2010 Honesly I doubt it. Rolling the bag through while packing takes a special kind of awareness. I'll try to roll it through a few times myself to see how awkward it is.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aerialfx 0 #12 November 8, 2010 Quote A wise old man once told me, "pack your own rig kid, you get out what you put in".... Pretty good advice, packers are for the lazy! or for the busy who would rather be skydiving than packing --------------------------------- www.skydiverustenburg.co.za www.skydiveqatar.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 3 #13 November 8, 2010 QuoteA wise old man once told me, "pack your own rig kid, you get out what you put in".... Pretty good advice, packers are for the lazy![/reply] No more calls....we have a winner. SparkyMy idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites fcajump 153 #14 November 8, 2010 QuoteHonesly I doubt it. Rolling the bag through while packing takes a special kind of awareness. I'll try to roll it through a few times myself to see how awkward it is. Actually, it could be done with a specific unawareness.... IF as you put the d-bag in the container, you lay it down on the bridle, then pull the bridle up the the side, it could be under a riser or line group. If it goes unnoticed, and the container closed, it would flip the bag through during deployment. That's why after putting the d-bag in the container, you need to check the bridle routing FROM where it exits the D-bag to the velcro (or pin for those without velcro) and on its way from there. JWAlways remember that some clouds are harder than others... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Hvance 0 #15 November 8, 2010 QuoteQuoteHonesly I doubt it. Rolling the bag through while packing takes a special kind of awareness. I'll try to roll it through a few times myself to see how awkward it is. Actually, it could be done with a specific unawareness.... IF as you put the d-bag in the container, you lay it down on the bridle, then pull the bridle up the the side, it could be under a riser or line group. If it goes unnoticed, and the container closed, it would flip the bag through during deployment. That's why after putting the d-bag in the container, you need to check the bridle routing FROM where it exits the D-bag to the velcro (or pin for those without velcro) and on its way from there. JW That makes sense. I could see that happening.I wish Google Maps had an "Avoid Ghetto" routing option. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites indyz 1 #16 November 8, 2010 QuoteHonesly I doubt it. Rolling the bag through while packing takes a special kind of awareness. I'll try to roll it through a few times myself to see how awkward it is. It is certainly possible. My first reserve ride was caused by a packer flipping the bag between the front and rear risers on one side (or more likely, by allowing the riser or line group to flop over the bag). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites hookitt 0 #17 November 9, 2010 Both you and fcajump proved my point. A special kind of awareness. I know how to make the errors which is why I tend to rule it out. I can duplicate either one anytime. It's actually challenging to make the errors because it takes a fair amount of odd manipulation to pack it that way if it was correct prior to stowing the lines. If you must pull the bridle and pilot chute through any lines, it's wrong. BTW, Are you sure he allowed just one riser group through after stowing the lines? Regardless, I still stand by my first post. My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites indyz 1 #18 November 9, 2010 QuoteI know how to make the errors which is why I tend to rule it out. I can duplicate either one anytime. It's actually challenging to make the errors because it takes a fair amount of odd manipulation to pack it that way if it was correct prior to stowing the lines. If you must pull the bridle and pilot chute through any lines, it's wrong. BTW, Are you sure he allowed just one riser group through after stowing the lines? Regardless, I still stand by my first post. That was my only question when I got back to the hangar, "did you pull the pilot chute through the lines?" Attached is what I ended up with. Left-rear riser got pulled around. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites popsjumper 2 #19 November 9, 2010 Man! That takes SKILL!My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Fast 0 #20 November 9, 2010 Just for fun I really want to beat this one to death. It was a packing error. The only way it would happen in air is if you did a flip after throwing out. Other than that it's not physically or theoretically possible. This is one of the reason's that I am _very_ particular about who packs for me. I'm not lazy either, I just don't have time to do it with everything else I'm trying to do in between jumps. ~D Where troubles melt like lemon drops Away above the chimney tops That's where you'll find me. Swooping is taking one last poke at the bear before escaping it's cave - davelepka Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites popsjumper 2 #21 November 9, 2010 QuoteJust for fun I really want to beat this one to death. It was a packing error. The only way it would happen in air is if you did a flip after throwing out. Other than that it's not physically or theoretically possible Not so fast, Fast. On a premature deployment anything could happen...such as the belatedly extracted PC coming out between the lines. Tried and proven on the ground and I can't imagine that it has not happened in the air over the years.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Halfpastniner 0 #22 November 9, 2010 QuoteQuoteI know how to make the errors which is why I tend to rule it out. I can duplicate either one anytime. It's actually challenging to make the errors because it takes a fair amount of odd manipulation to pack it that way if it was correct prior to stowing the lines. If you must pull the bridle and pilot chute through any lines, it's wrong. BTW, Are you sure he allowed just one riser group through after stowing the lines? Regardless, I still stand by my first post. That was my only question when I got back to the hangar, "did you pull the pilot chute through the lines?" Attached is what I ended up with. Left-rear riser got pulled around. Man those vengeance's open like shit!BASE 1384 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites pilotdave 0 #23 November 9, 2010 QuoteWhoever is allowing him to pack there needs to have a discussion with the packer. Had it happen to me. I had a conversation with my packer... well... kind of: http://www.skydivingstills.com/Skydiving/2009/Weekend-Pics-8-30-09/9467217_Z2jP4#635979657_qSsBT-A-LB. It was caused by flipping the bag when it was passed over the rig after the lines were stowed. At least I'm pretty sure. Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites theonlyski 3 #24 November 9, 2010 QuoteQuoteWhoever is allowing him to pack there needs to have a discussion with the packer. Had it happen to me. I had a conversation with my packer... well... kind of: http://www.skydivingstills.com/Skydiving/2009/Weekend-Pics-8-30-09/9467217_Z2jP4#635979657_qSsBT-A-LB. It was caused by flipping the bag when it was passed over the rig after the lines were stowed. At least I'm pretty sure. Dave That was you? Lol... I seen that a while back, was funny as hell."I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Hvance 0 #25 November 9, 2010 I wish Google Maps had an "Avoid Ghetto" routing option. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 Next Page 1 of 2 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. 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fcajump 153 #14 November 8, 2010 QuoteHonesly I doubt it. Rolling the bag through while packing takes a special kind of awareness. I'll try to roll it through a few times myself to see how awkward it is. Actually, it could be done with a specific unawareness.... IF as you put the d-bag in the container, you lay it down on the bridle, then pull the bridle up the the side, it could be under a riser or line group. If it goes unnoticed, and the container closed, it would flip the bag through during deployment. That's why after putting the d-bag in the container, you need to check the bridle routing FROM where it exits the D-bag to the velcro (or pin for those without velcro) and on its way from there. JWAlways remember that some clouds are harder than others... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hvance 0 #15 November 8, 2010 QuoteQuoteHonesly I doubt it. Rolling the bag through while packing takes a special kind of awareness. I'll try to roll it through a few times myself to see how awkward it is. Actually, it could be done with a specific unawareness.... IF as you put the d-bag in the container, you lay it down on the bridle, then pull the bridle up the the side, it could be under a riser or line group. If it goes unnoticed, and the container closed, it would flip the bag through during deployment. That's why after putting the d-bag in the container, you need to check the bridle routing FROM where it exits the D-bag to the velcro (or pin for those without velcro) and on its way from there. JW That makes sense. I could see that happening.I wish Google Maps had an "Avoid Ghetto" routing option. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
indyz 1 #16 November 8, 2010 QuoteHonesly I doubt it. Rolling the bag through while packing takes a special kind of awareness. I'll try to roll it through a few times myself to see how awkward it is. It is certainly possible. My first reserve ride was caused by a packer flipping the bag between the front and rear risers on one side (or more likely, by allowing the riser or line group to flop over the bag). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 0 #17 November 9, 2010 Both you and fcajump proved my point. A special kind of awareness. I know how to make the errors which is why I tend to rule it out. I can duplicate either one anytime. It's actually challenging to make the errors because it takes a fair amount of odd manipulation to pack it that way if it was correct prior to stowing the lines. If you must pull the bridle and pilot chute through any lines, it's wrong. BTW, Are you sure he allowed just one riser group through after stowing the lines? Regardless, I still stand by my first post. My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
indyz 1 #18 November 9, 2010 QuoteI know how to make the errors which is why I tend to rule it out. I can duplicate either one anytime. It's actually challenging to make the errors because it takes a fair amount of odd manipulation to pack it that way if it was correct prior to stowing the lines. If you must pull the bridle and pilot chute through any lines, it's wrong. BTW, Are you sure he allowed just one riser group through after stowing the lines? Regardless, I still stand by my first post. That was my only question when I got back to the hangar, "did you pull the pilot chute through the lines?" Attached is what I ended up with. Left-rear riser got pulled around. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #19 November 9, 2010 Man! That takes SKILL!My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fast 0 #20 November 9, 2010 Just for fun I really want to beat this one to death. It was a packing error. The only way it would happen in air is if you did a flip after throwing out. Other than that it's not physically or theoretically possible. This is one of the reason's that I am _very_ particular about who packs for me. I'm not lazy either, I just don't have time to do it with everything else I'm trying to do in between jumps. ~D Where troubles melt like lemon drops Away above the chimney tops That's where you'll find me. Swooping is taking one last poke at the bear before escaping it's cave - davelepka Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
popsjumper 2 #21 November 9, 2010 QuoteJust for fun I really want to beat this one to death. It was a packing error. The only way it would happen in air is if you did a flip after throwing out. Other than that it's not physically or theoretically possible Not so fast, Fast. On a premature deployment anything could happen...such as the belatedly extracted PC coming out between the lines. Tried and proven on the ground and I can't imagine that it has not happened in the air over the years.My reality and yours are quite different. I think we're all Bozos on this bus. Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Halfpastniner 0 #22 November 9, 2010 QuoteQuoteI know how to make the errors which is why I tend to rule it out. I can duplicate either one anytime. It's actually challenging to make the errors because it takes a fair amount of odd manipulation to pack it that way if it was correct prior to stowing the lines. If you must pull the bridle and pilot chute through any lines, it's wrong. BTW, Are you sure he allowed just one riser group through after stowing the lines? Regardless, I still stand by my first post. That was my only question when I got back to the hangar, "did you pull the pilot chute through the lines?" Attached is what I ended up with. Left-rear riser got pulled around. Man those vengeance's open like shit!BASE 1384 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pilotdave 0 #23 November 9, 2010 QuoteWhoever is allowing him to pack there needs to have a discussion with the packer. Had it happen to me. I had a conversation with my packer... well... kind of: http://www.skydivingstills.com/Skydiving/2009/Weekend-Pics-8-30-09/9467217_Z2jP4#635979657_qSsBT-A-LB. It was caused by flipping the bag when it was passed over the rig after the lines were stowed. At least I'm pretty sure. Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 3 #24 November 9, 2010 QuoteQuoteWhoever is allowing him to pack there needs to have a discussion with the packer. Had it happen to me. I had a conversation with my packer... well... kind of: http://www.skydivingstills.com/Skydiving/2009/Weekend-Pics-8-30-09/9467217_Z2jP4#635979657_qSsBT-A-LB. It was caused by flipping the bag when it was passed over the rig after the lines were stowed. At least I'm pretty sure. Dave That was you? Lol... I seen that a while back, was funny as hell."I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hvance 0 #25 November 9, 2010 I wish Google Maps had an "Avoid Ghetto" routing option. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
