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Butane and Propane

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Some thing I'd never really thought about, I use Butane in the summer and Propane
in the winter.

I offer a free drop off and collection service for the local community and normally have some spare
cylinders for sale for the people who get caught short.

Today a lady phoned to ask if I had a Butane cylinder I could sell her, I only had Propane left
when the lady asked what is the difference between the gases I told her Butane for summer Propane for winter,
which is basically all I knew about the subject.

So not wanting to be any more ignorant than I already am I did a Google search for the difference
between the two.

Seems that the American sites predict death and destruction followed by multi trillion dollar law suits
for the ensuing explosion or from the loss of life from the asfixiation caused by co2.

The English sites just say, as long as the regulator fits no problem.

The Spanish sites typicaly don't say squat.


I now know the difference and had a little chuckle at the same time.

Gone fishing

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Having worked with propane for 15-yrs., I might be able to help... a little.

Butane has a maximum working pressure of 150-lbs. Propane has a maximum working pressure of 250-lbs. Butane tends to freeze in very cold weather, where propane will still produce enough pressure to operate your cook stove or heater, just fine. Butane can be put in a propane tank but not adviseable putting propane in a butane tank.
Here in Texas, butane is not allowed for common use but only in industrial uses. Propane, is a very good product as long as you 'respect' it and maintain your tank, lines and appliances. Oh, and use your head about it! I've been asked to fill propane tanks where a garden hose was used as the main line from the tank to the house and hose-clamps were used at the regulator and at the house end! I refused to fill the tank and did, install copper tubing in place of the garden hose, pressure tested the system and then, filled the tank.
I hope, this helps.


Chuck

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Why is Butane not allowed for domestic use?, seem's to me that having a lower working pressure
it's safer than Propane, (weather conditions permiting)


Living in an area where there is no piped gas we have no choice but to use gas cylinders,
also in the winter months we change from Butane to Propane and have never changed the
jets, obviously the pressure regulator must be for the lower pressure gas.

Here both gases come in the same cylinders the only difference being is that a Propane
cylinder has a black band painted on it, and the pressure regulator clamps on to either.

Really it's something I've never given any thought to,

Gone fishing

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Does the "working pressure" you're referring to relate (with a given safety margin) to the pressures beyond which the gasses will explode under pressure?

I.E. what got me thinking down this line was the fact that under relatively low pressures (29 psi, had to look it up) acetylene will explode, which is why acetylene cylinders are full of a liquid (acetone, had to look it up too) into which the acetylene is dissolved: dissolved in the liquid, the acetylene is stable, but the regulators are designed to release the acetylene at very low pressures so the gas doesn't explode under its own pressure in the delivery line.

SO, if the 250 psi working pressure for propane and 150 psi working pressure for butane means the butane may combust at a lower pressure without an ignition source, I'd take that as a suggestion that the butane was LESS safe to work with.

I did find an MSDS sheet from Airgas on Butane, but it didn't list any "safe limit pressure" or anything, so I may very well be barking up ENTIRELY the wrong tree.

Elvisio "used to be an engineer, now a nurse: 'gas under pressure' now has a TOTALLY different meaning" Rodriguez

EDIT: Many times for grammar and clarity, a couple times to add facts, one time to edit the grammar in my "edit" statement (!), and once to add a completely worthless picture, added only because such a thread would be empty without it...

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Butane, would freeze-up in tanks and people would build a fire under the (above ground) tanks and well, you can guess the rest!
At one time, there were 'underground' tanks but those tanks literally rusted-out.
Here, propane jets have smaller holes than butane jets.

Chuck

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:D:D

You'll love this one! One winter, the temperatures in West Texas dropped to juat barely above zero. This ol' boy who had worked the oilfields for ages, built a heater for his and his wife's trailer house. It was a typical oilfield heater... a piece of pipe with a piece 3/8" copper tubing, pinched-off on one end for a 'jet', inserted into a long length of rubber hose, the other end attached to the regulator on the propane tank. Pretty simple idea that put-out a lot of heat. It worked in the oilfield! The big moment and much awaited heat was about to happen.
The ol' boy told his wife to go out and turn the gas on at the tank and he'd light the heater! Mrs. did as she was told and turned the gas on while he looked high and low for a match. He came across an old Bic lighter... when he flicked his Bic, the explosion literally blew him out the front door. Surprisingly, he wasn't injured all that bad but he and the Mrs. had to move-in with their daughter, till they could buy a new trailer house. :D
No, I can't make this stuff up!


Chuck

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One night back in my youth, my dearly incompetent father who fancied himself the greatest handyman in the world was trying to start a fire in the family room fireplace. Problem was there wasn't any more lighter fluid to start said fire. My dad rummaged through the garage and found a container of Coleman Camping Fuel for campstoves and proceeded to douse his diligently stacked arrangement of kindling and logs as if he were a mad arsonist trying to burn down a building, which as we were about to find out wasn't far from the truth.

All I remember was me and my mom jumping backwards over a sofa, that was about 8 feet from the fireplace, to escape the resulting fireball and while laying on my back behind the sofa watching a flash of light rolling along the ceiling.

As for my dad, well, let's just say his eyebrows did grow back!
It's all been said before, no sense repeating it here.

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Just a couple of things and I will try to keep from geek speak;
-Propane is a "hotter fuel". It takes a smaller amount to put out the same heat as butane. That is why the propane orifice is smaller.
-Propane IMHO is more efficient and burns cleaner. More efficient in that the same liquid volume as butane will last longer because it will generate the same heat with less gas used.
-The working pressure stated above relates to the pressure rating of the vessel (cylinder) used to hold the gas/liquid as well as the valves, regulators and piping required to safely deliver the gas to your end device. The higher pressure propane cylinders are needed to keep the propane gas in liquid form until needed as a gas. In liquid form these gasses take up much less space.
-Propane works much better in cold temps because it will still want to reach equilibrium in the cylinder which means the liquid will still want to go to the gas phase at lower temperatures. Temperatures at which Butane will want to remain a liquid.
Hope that helps.

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:D:D

You'll love this one! One winter, the temperatures in West Texas dropped to juat barely above zero. This ol' boy who had worked the oilfields for ages, built a heater for his and his wife's trailer house. It was a typical oilfield heater... a piece of pipe with a piece 3/8" copper tubing, pinched-off on one end for a 'jet', inserted into a long length of rubber hose, the other end attached to the regulator on the propane tank. Pretty simple idea that put-out a lot of heat. It worked in the oilfield! The big moment and much awaited heat was about to happen.
The ol' boy told his wife to go out and turn the gas on at the tank and he'd light the heater! Mrs. did as she was told and turned the gas on while he looked high and low for a match. He came across an old Bic lighter... when he flicked his Bic, the explosion literally blew him out the front door. Surprisingly, he wasn't injured all that bad but he and the Mrs. had to move-in with their daughter, till they could buy a new trailer house. :D
No, I can't make this stuff up!


Chuck


----------------------------------------------------------

That is how we used to keep the doghouses on the drilling rigs warm for years. Wouldn't want to do it in a house tho......YIKES! We use real burners now, usually catalytic safety heaters.

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Quote

:D:D

You'll love this one! One winter, the temperatures in West Texas dropped to juat barely above zero. This ol' boy who had worked the oilfields for ages, built a heater for his and his wife's trailer house. It was a typical oilfield heater... a piece of pipe with a piece 3/8" copper tubing, pinched-off on one end for a 'jet', inserted into a long length of rubber hose, the other end attached to the regulator on the propane tank. Pretty simple idea that put-out a lot of heat. It worked in the oilfield! The big moment and much awaited heat was about to happen.
The ol' boy told his wife to go out and turn the gas on at the tank and he'd light the heater! Mrs. did as she was told and turned the gas on while he looked high and low for a match. He came across an old Bic lighter... when he flicked his Bic, the explosion literally blew him out the front door. Surprisingly, he wasn't injured all that bad but he and the Mrs. had to move-in with their daughter, till they could buy a new trailer house. :D
No, I can't make this stuff up!


Chuck


----------------------------------------------------------

That is how we used to keep the doghouses on the drilling rigs warm for years. Wouldn't want to do it in a house tho......YIKES! We use real burners now, usually catalytic safety heaters.


Every rig I was ever on, had a heater like that. It amazed me that there were very few 'accidents' due to them. I never worked on a drilling rig but made countless deliveries of oil and propane to them.


Chuck

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Actually the difference between the two is one carbon.

Propane is a 3 carbon alkane and and butane is a 4 carbon alkane.

Propane C-C-C or C3H8

Butane C-C-C-C or C4H10

Propane has a lower melting point and boiling point than butane. Alkanes react with oxygen in a combustion reaction. The higher number of carbons, the less complete the reaction. LPG contains both propane and butane.

Know you know the real difference but while we're going all oil patch redneck, your average Joe Fart would be an alkane too! CH4 or methane.
It's called the Hillbilly Hop N Pop dude.
If you're gonna be stupid, you better be tough.
That's fucked up. Watermelons do not grow on trees! ~Skymama

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