landing

[popsjumper 2]

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Just a shot in the dark...could the student rigs lines have shrunk?

Not "Just a shot in the dark"!

As far as I can tell, student rigs are typically set up so student CAN'T stall them without doing something very specific like taking wraps.

I would argue against student rigs that could be unintentionally driven past the stall point.

Yes, it does happen that line shrinkage could change the line set parameters and this is something that should always be checked for on a regular basis, IMO.


TO THE OP:
Please take Dave's advice to heart (with local Instructor input) and practice slow flight and stalls way up high until you are familiar with what it looks like, what it feels like, and how the recovery works. I assure you, once you "get it", your comfort level will go way up.


True story:
As a young jumper flying squares, they told me to do stalls and explained how to do it. They DID explain about the smooth let-up for recovery.

First try: I stalled it, the damned thing folded up behind me and put me on my back dropping backward.....I screamed like a little school girl and slammed my hands back up in a panic.

Well, things got really interesting when I was all of a sudden looking down at my canopy in front of and below me with slack lines and the horizon waaaaaay above it. I had an instant vision of falling into it and getting wrapped up like a Christmas present.

My main mentor's comment after I landed:
"You dumbass. What did I tell you?"

My response:
"Hold that thought. I gotta go take a dump."

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[PiLFy 0]

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http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=pilfy

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Andy&page=3

"18. Andy 1 thumb up

A sneaky baby Kangaroo. Akin to a Joey's bad brother.
Oye! Look a' that Andy...
andie andey andee andhee andi
by PiLFy 12/31/2010."

Right back @ya, wiseguy. I didn't expect a cheap shot like this to come from you. I wasn't aware one could add definitions to Urban Dictionary until I looked @their homepage. I bet junior highschool kids have a lot of fun w/it...

[Andy9o8 0]

Huh? Confusing, in light of your your post #16. Maybe jokes don't transmit well on the internet. Or maybe I'm missing something. If I'm missing something, sorry.

[PiLFy 0]

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Huh? Confusing, in light of your your post #16. Maybe jokes don't transmit well on the internet. Or maybe I'm missing something. If I'm missing something, sorry.

I'd taken the definition you added for my handle @face value. I thought it was true. I wasn't aware anyone could simply submit whatever they please on a whim.

[Andy9o8 0]

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I'd taken the definition you added for my handle...

I didn't.

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I wasn't aware anyone could simply submit whatever they please on a whim.

Neither was I. Nor did I do so.

[PiLFy 0]

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I'd taken the definition you added for my handle...

I didn't.

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I wasn't aware anyone could simply submit whatever they please on a whim.

Neither was I. Nor did I do so.

I just looked into it further, & see I jumped the gun. W/the number of wise-Butt trolls who frequent this board. I hope you can see the reason for my assumption. I apologize, Andy. (Please don't sue me.)

[StarFlyer 0]

>"To the OP landings aren't easy and take practice and lots of time."

Sorry for the likely silly question (I'm new to the DZ.com forums after being away from the sport for many years), but what does "OP" stand for?

[sundevil777 93]

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>"To the OP landings aren't easy and take practice and lots of time."

Sorry for the likely silly question (I'm new to the DZ.com forums after being away from the sport for many years), but what does "OP" stand for?

Original poster

Welcome back...

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[erdnarob 1]

Here is some tricks you can try in order to evaluate when starting your flare.
1) do not look down, it's not where you are going, but look forward down at 45 degrees.
2) if your DZ is grassy, start flaring when you can see the grass leaves individually, at about 15-20 feet ahead of you.
3) start flaring at about 15-20 feet about the ground, relatively early but very slowly and :
a) if the ground comes slow to you, keep on pulling more toggles slowly
b) if the ground comes fast to you, pull down the toggles faster, according what you see.
4) your toggles should be at hip level only when you are at one foot above the ground.

Note: If you have started your flare too high, slowly put the toggles up to recover some speed then apply do your flare again. Be ready for a good PLF. Good luck and give us some feedback.

Learn from others mistakes, you will never live long enough to make them all.

[davelepka 4]

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If you have started your flare too high, slowly put the toggles up to recover some speed

I disagree this 100%. Raising the toggles allows the jumper to get behind the canopy and allow it to dive (recovering speed). In order to arrest that dive, the jumper needs to first stop that rearward swing, reverse direction and begin the forward swing (pitching the nose up), and swing forward to a point beyond the center of the canopy. Landing any time before the jumper is forward of the center of the canopy will result in an impact equal to, or greater than, full flight.

It is true that you can modulate the degree you raise the toggles and when you resume the falre, but doing that successfully is dependent on the jumper being very familiar with the flight characteristics of their canopy, not something you can say of a student, or any newer jumper.

The better advice is that the flare stroke is a one-way street. You can move the toggles down, and you can stop, but you cannot go back up again.

If you find yourself having begun the flare stroke too high, hold the toggle position where it is, prepare for a PLF, and make sure you complete the flare stroke fully before impacting the ground.

A full flare from full flight is big movement made from a 'fast moving' platform. As such, timing it properly can be tricky, and takes time to develop that skill. However, if you being the falre early, and stop part way through, you are now both moving slower and needing to complete a smaller movement, so the timing of the remaingin falre is easier to judge, and your chances of doing it right are higher. In any case, if you find yourself needing to stop the flare, that is your recognition that you have made a mistake and that you need to plan 100% for a PLF.

Remember that a doing a PLF when you don't need to is not going to hurt you, but not doing a PLF when you do is probably going to hurt (maybe a lot).

[Anvilbrother 0]

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The better advice is that the flare stroke is a one-way street.

So by that advise if someone were to flare to a complete stall at 30 feet they are to continue to hold that stall, and not raise the toggles 1 inch?

Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along,

[davelepka 4]

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So by that advise if someone were to flare to a complete stall at 30 feet they are to continue to hold that stall, and not raise the toggles 1 inch?

I hope not.

To clarify, proper stall recovery should be the first priority if you should find yourself in a stall anywhere near the ground or under your hard deck. Prolonging a stalled condition will increase the risk of line twists due to asymetrical input or recovery, and minimizing that under your hard deck goes a long way toward preventing you from being too low to cutaway with the possibility of a canopy you cannot safely land.

I would hope that student canopies are tuned such that stalling them is not a concern, and by the time a jumper has advanced to their own gear, they would be familiar with stalls and stall recovery, and would have properly set and become accustomed to the stall point of their personal canopy at a safe altitude.

[MikeJD 0]

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The best suggestion I ever got was to take a ladder out into the field, stand on top and look around.

But make sure it's a folding ladder that stands up by itself. Unless you also want to practise your PLFs.

[Joellercoaster 6]

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So by that advise if someone were to flare to a complete stall at 30 feet they are to continue to hold that stall, and not raise the toggles 1 inch?

Actually, I think the advice is "don't stall your canopy at 30 feet, because you're going to hurt yourself".

(Hopefully though, people who might manage a full flare at that low an altitude, are jumping canopies that won't stall when they do hold it.)

--
"I'll tell you how all skydivers are judged, . They are judged by the laws of physics." - kkeenan

"You jump out, pull the string and either live or die. What's there to be good at?

[popsjumper 2]

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(Hopefully though, people who might manage a full flare at that low an altitude, are jumping canopies that won't stall when they do hold it.)

Ain't THAT the truth!

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[JerseyShawn 0]

To the OP, learning to PLF will save your ass. Im a student too, so no advice on landings from me. All four of my landings I landed on my feet though. I used to fly planes so I know how to partial flare and take advantage of the full flare at the right time for a soft landing.

When I was learning to pilot I've landed hard, then I learned to flare from trial and error. You'll get it soon enough! Just learn to PLF. Knowing how to fall will leave you with bruises rather than broken bones, hopefully.

I have snowboarded, skateboarded, bmx/mountain biked for the past 18 years, done a lot of stupid and fun shit along the way with only bruises to temporarily show. I know how to fall which leaves me with many more years to enjoy what I love doing.

Practice with proper instruction and you'll get it. And if you don't right away, PLF! Falling and knowing how to fall is just as
fun as trying! It will make you feel more confident too.

Have fun, be safe.

[ufk22 32]

Best advice I can give;
Land 50-100 feet downwind of a windsock or wind blade, or something else that is about 10' high.
focus on this and start your flare when your feet are just above at at the height of the top of the blade.
Not only does this give you a reference, it helps keep your eyes up rather than looking down.

This is the paradox of skydiving. We do something very dangerous, expose ourselves to a totally unnecesary risk, and then spend our time trying to make it safer.

[Heatmiser 0]

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The better advice is that the flare stroke is a one-way street.

So by that advise if someone were to flare to a complete stall at 30 feet they are to continue to hold that stall, and not raise the toggles 1 inch?

I watched this exact scenario happen at Dallas last summer, a recurring AFF student. Compound tib/fib.
Sucked ass.

What you say is reflective of your knowledge...HOW ya say it is reflective of your experience. Airtwardo

Someone's going to be spanked! Hopefully, it will be me. Skymama

[JohnMitchell 14]

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Take it from a guy who has two herniated discs in his lower spine "keep your feet underneath you for landing."

Leg muscles are great at absorbing landing shock.

Absolutely right, and when things really turn to $hit, it's better to break your leg than it is to break your back.

A good PLF with a busted line left me with a cracked leg bone. Same situation for a friend who didn't PLF . . . broken back. I kid you not.

[JohnMitchell 14]

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The better advice is that the flare stroke is a one-way street.

So by that advise if someone were to flare to a complete stall at 30 feet they are to continue to hold that stall, and not raise the toggles 1 inch?

I watched this exact scenario happen at Dallas last summer, a recurring AFF student. Compound tib/fib.
Sucked ass.

The right answer: You can ease up on the toggles some to gain flying speed and energy, but make sure you flare completely again before you land. It's a very sub-optimal situation at best.

[kuai43 7]

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Now i jump with sunglasses/googles with perscription lenses.

Damn thigns just dont hlep with typng, now do they?

Every fight is a food fight if you're a cannibal

Goodness is something to be chosen. When a man cannot choose, he ceases to be a man. - Anthony Burgess