quade 4 #26 July 13, 2015 grueIn my opinion, the moment you say you're leaving they know you're looking to go one way or another, so even if they offer something to retain you to keep things flowing in the short term, they're probably going to start looking for your cheaper replacement anyway. Agree. NEVER give them any more of a clue about your looking for another gig than they'd give you about being fired. "Two weeks notice" is a quaint relic of the past.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #27 July 13, 2015 JohnMitchell *** Local governments like the one I work for give a retirement at 30 years, if you last that long. I'm at 2.61 years and seriously debating jumping ship... I was air traffic control with the FAA. It was 20 years and age 50 or 25 years, any age. Our son hired on at age 20, and can retire at age 45 with full benefits. Of course, the longer you work, the higher the monthly pension goes. I worked almost 30 and loved it. They forced me out with mandatory retirement. I recently had a lengthy case where my opposing counsel & I had many cordial conversations between sessions jousting on behalf of our clients. Turns out that her first career, before going back to law school, was a number of years as an ATC. She told me she left because the stress of that job was so high (for her), and that she now has less stress in a high-paced litigation practice than she did as an ATC. Just one person's story. FWIW. I recently had a lengthy case where my opposing counsel & I had many cordial conversations between sessions jousting on behalf of our clients. Turns out that her first career, before going back to law school, was a number of years as an ATC. She told me she left because the stress of that job was so high (for her), and that she now has less stress in a high-paced litigation practice than she did as an ATC. Just one person's story. FWIW. Sorry you're hating your job. I recently had a lengthy case where my opposing counsel & I had many cordial conversations between sessions jousting on behalf of our clients in depositions and court. Turns out that her first career, before going back to law school, was a number of years as an ATC. She told me she left because the stress of that job was so high (for her), and that she now has less stress in a high-paced litigation practice than she did as an ATC. Just one person's story. FWIW. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,240 #28 July 13, 2015 Hi RMK, QuoteWhether you wish to believe or not, I doubt anyone joining on now will see a DB plan ^^^^ This. John Mitchell was on a different federal plan than I was. I am/was on what is called CSRS. Reagan got a new plan in place in 1984, which is called FERS, and it is a Defined Contribution (DC) plan. For the most part, CSRS was 30 yrs & 55 yrs old = The Promised Land. To all you taxpayers: Thank You so much. Times, they are a'changin' Jerry Baumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWFlyer 2 #29 July 13, 2015 RMK Defined Benefit plans are a "gravy train" and this is probably the last generation to see them. Whether you wish to believe or not, I doubt anyone joining on now will see a DB plan; in brief the math doesn't stack up. All will eventually be some form of Defined Contribution (DC) plan. I'm probably one of the few people in GenX (born in 1970) who has both a defined benefit & defined contribution plan from a private employer. I'm still aggressively contributing to my own retirement just in case it all goes tits up, but since I'm vested and the pension is well-funded, I'm optimistic that it'll be around when I retire."There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Owl78 0 #30 July 13, 2015 "less stress in a high-paced litigation practice" = most remarkable statement I've heard in a while. To the OP: good luck! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #31 July 13, 2015 Owl78"less stress in a high-paced litigation practice" = most remarkable statement I've heard in a while. Yeah, it kind of surprised me, too. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnMitchell 16 #32 July 14, 2015 JerryBaumchen John Mitchell was on a different federal plan than I was. I am/was on what is called CSRS. Reagan got a new plan in place in 1984, which is called FERS, and it is a Defined Contribution (DC) plan. Yep, the FERS ain't as good, but the ATC version of it isn't bad. Part pension, part SS, part TSP with partial matching funds. I joke with my former coworkers that it's been tough. I've been doing tandems in Hawaii and Washington just to make ends meet. If you're smart and pay off your $hit before you retire, and enjoy the simple things in life, it's quite easy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnMitchell 16 #33 July 14, 2015 Andy9o8 She told me she left because the stress of that job was so high (for her), and that she now has less stress in a high-paced litigation practice than she did as an ATC. I was never smart enough to get too stressed out. No, the job had its moments (plenty of 'em, in fact) but hey, look at what we all do on weekends to relax: jump out of planes. I think we may just be wired a touch differently. Like I said, I loved it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jclalor 12 #34 July 14, 2015 I'm fairly certain, if I can continue contributing to my 401K at my current level, pick up a few extra shifts a week, i can retire when I reach the age of 83. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #35 July 14, 2015 Quote The majors reorganized under Chapter 11, slashed all the pay, stole all the pension money, and are doing quite well now. The pilots? Not like they used too. http://dilbert.com/strip/2015-07-13 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rick 67 #36 July 14, 2015 grueIn my opinion, the moment you say you're leaving they know you're looking to go one way or another, so even if they offer something to retain you to keep things flowing in the short term, they're probably going to start looking for your cheaper replacement anyway. It works both ways. I have had people say they "have an offer" so we give them a good bump up in pay to keep them. A couple months later same thing again. Some employees use this tactic to try to get more from the company. So anymore it is "Good luck with your new opportunity". As far as the 2 weeks notice. I have had 3 employees that gave me 2 weeks notice and then bailed out a week later.You can't be drunk all day if you don't start early! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyhi 24 #37 July 14, 2015 At a large multinational aviation-oriented corporation, the technique was to call the individual on Sunday night and tell them not to come in the next day . . . or ever. "You can pick up your stuff at the front gate." All class.Shit happens. And it usually happens because of physics. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 718 #38 July 14, 2015 Back at Schwab, one of the managers would fire people by asking for their badge on Friday: "We have some contractors working over the weekend and we need a few badges to make it easier, can we borrow yours?" I never understood people falling for that and I thought it was spineless and mean. Man up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rick 67 #39 July 14, 2015 letting people go is never fun (well almost) but you should at least be straight up and treat them with respect You can't be drunk all day if you don't start early! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bob.dino 0 #40 July 14, 2015 Lizard14-1/2 years I've been with this company and they are closing our maintenance base. (Airline). ... If they leave, they lose that generous 4 weeks of pay. Fucking hell. Even the UK, which is not the most generous place in the world, would do you way better than that. Assuming you're between 22 and 41, you'd get 14.5 weeks pay of your normal pay, capped at USD 740/week. That's up to ~10,000 USD give or take. https://www.gov.uk/redundant-your-rights/redundancy-pay Not that that helps you. Best of luck to you and your colleagues. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grue 1 #41 July 14, 2015 normiss Back at Schwab, one of the managers would fire people by asking for their badge on Friday: "We have some contractors working over the weekend and we need a few badges to make it easier, can we borrow yours?" I never understood people falling for that and I thought it was spineless and mean. Man up. Man, that is fucked up. I've only had to truly fire someone once, and honestly it was pretty funny for both of us. I was a lifeguard at the time and one of my guards CREAMED this "kid" (he was about 13 or 14) with his foam rescue tube to get him to stop shouting profanity across the pool. "Hey, I need to see you in my office" "Yeah I know I'm getting fired for that but honestly it was worth it" "Fair enough. Reapply next summer and you can come back". There was only a week left in the season, he didn't miss much cavete terrae. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grue 1 #42 July 14, 2015 Rick***In my opinion, the moment you say you're leaving they know you're looking to go one way or another, so even if they offer something to retain you to keep things flowing in the short term, they're probably going to start looking for your cheaper replacement anyway. It works both ways. I have had people say they "have an offer" so we give them a good bump up in pay to keep them. A couple months later same thing again. Some employees use this tactic to try to get more from the company. So anymore it is "Good luck with your new opportunity". As far as the 2 weeks notice. I have had 3 employees that gave me 2 weeks notice and then bailed out a week later. To me it makes more sense to just ask for a raise, and if they don't give it, go elsewhere. As for the 2 week notice thing… ugh. I've always given a minimum of 2 weeks, and in my line of work (systems administrator) I try and give more because I know how much of a pain in the ass we are to replace. Even at my last job, which I hated, I gave 3.5 weeks notice out of courtesy. Funnily enough, when I was laid off due to a downsizing 2 jobs ago, they gave me 8 weeks notice it was happening, and incentivized my staying all the way through. Not entirely because they definitely needed me for that long, but because it was just that sort of company. They felt bad enough that they were letting people go, and they weren't the sort to just throw people to the wolves (unless someone was being fired for cause, of course).cavete terrae. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Elisha 1 #43 July 14, 2015 RMK ****** Local governments like the one I work for give a retirement at 30 years, if you last that long. I'm at 2.61 years and seriously debating jumping ship... I was air traffic control with the FAA. It was 20 years and age 50 or 25 years, any age. Our son hired on at age 20, and can retire at age 45 with full benefits. Of course, the longer you work, the higher the monthly pension goes. I worked almost 30 and loved it. They forced me out with mandatory retirement. Sorry you're hating your job. Defined Benefit plans are a "gravy train" and this is probably the last generation to see them. Whether you wish to believe or not, I doubt anyone joining on now will see a DB plan; in brief the math doesn't stack up. All will eventually be some form of Defined Contribution (DC) plan. This. I worked in the actuarial department of an insurance company for a few years. While it was a Prop & Casualty company, you still have to learn about some life & pension. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Elisha 1 #44 July 14, 2015 NWFlyer*** Defined Benefit plans are a "gravy train" and this is probably the last generation to see them. Whether you wish to believe or not, I doubt anyone joining on now will see a DB plan; in brief the math doesn't stack up. All will eventually be some form of Defined Contribution (DC) plan. I'm probably one of the few people in GenX (born in 1970) who has both a defined benefit & defined contribution plan from a private employer. I'm still aggressively contributing to my own retirement just in case it all goes tits up, but since I'm vested and the pension is well-funded, I'm optimistic that it'll be around when I retire. I still have money I haven't moved over from my old Ins company. It a hybrid of both a DC & DB. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWFlyer 2 #45 July 14, 2015 normiss Back at Schwab, one of the managers would fire people by asking for their badge on Friday: "We have some contractors working over the weekend and we need a few badges to make it easier, can we borrow yours?" I never understood people falling for that and I thought it was spineless and mean. Man up. I worked for a technology consulting firm that did a mass layoff not long after I started. The way they handled that was actually a pretty solid example of best practices; they were straight up with everyone, had a company-wide conference call discussing the decision, etc. I breathed a sigh of relief that (especially as the new person) I'd made it through that round. About a month later, one of the people that was in my training class was gone. A week later, another. A week after that, another. No communications whatsoever about these layoffs more broadly, but as you might imagine, the rumor mill was on fire. Around Tuesday or Wednesday one week I got a call from the admin assistant to the VP that I reported up to. She scheduled a phone call for me with him for Friday morning. (Employees were mostly virtual and scattered around the country). Thursday night I was out with a bunch of friends and I said "Yeah, I'm getting laid off tomorrow." "How do you know?" Well, let's see, people have been disappearing one by one and a VP who I never interact with at all has scheduled time with me tomorrow. Yep, that one was a biiiiig surprise. "There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
