dmcoco84 5 #1 June 27, 2007 If a class action lawsuit against the NPS for discrimination in issuance of special use permits were to be filed: Would you like to be apart of the lawsuit or not? Note: I would assume that any individual who wishes to be apart of the lawsuit would have to apply for a permit. Otherwise the NPS could state that the individual who has not applied has not been discriminated against. Coco Edit To Add: Skydivers who read the BASE forum with no intention to BASE or to apply for a permit for means of a lawsuit, Please Do Not Poll. If you wish to comment do so in the thread. Thanks Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
base428 1 #2 June 27, 2007 Permit Denial #1 Permit Denial #2 Fred Morelli talked about a lawsuit against the NPS more than five years ago. I'll give him a call/email and find out more. The bottom line is that our group is small, but we need to be loud. It would take a major commitment and lots of $ to pursue a lawsuit. Proper use of the media would be critical to be heard. Are jumpers ready to donate time and money to the cause? Maybe, maybe not.....(c)2010 Vertical Visions. No unauthorized duplication permitted. <==For the media only Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpecialKaye 0 #3 June 27, 2007 I told Fred several years back, I would be more than happy to donate Paralegal time/services...am still willing to do so. Drop me a line/PM if you need me to look anything up or how I can help out. Later Jason, Kaye Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Para_Frog 1 #4 June 27, 2007 Blinding them with legal proceedings works in many many cases. I say go for it - I'd sign on. I can't afford Lysefjord, I wanna jump El Cap in broad daylight, and should be able to. Sidebar: There is a pretty healthy Idaho contingent of BASE jumpers for the obvious reason, and Dirk Kempthorne (former ID governor for those who don't know - now Sec. of Interior) will be leaving with the current administration...between us and the TF community as a whole, perhaps a campaign to get his weight behind us? A last hurrah for the home folks perhaps? NPS answers to Interior. Just a thought.- Harvey, BASE 1232 TAN-I, IAD-I, S&TA BLiNC Magazine Team Member Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
460 0 #5 June 27, 2007 This could easily work given the crazy workload of Congress. This is definetely win-able given enough financial resources and a smart YOUNG attorney willing to put in the long hours to win such a case. Just set them up to snare themselves in undefensible legal logic. It'll be thrown out by one of the circuit courts or Supreme Court (if they have the political agenda to address any personal freedoms that are rapidly being eroded). We may need some sacrificial lamb jumpers to do this. Ever heard of carefully crafted civil disobedience? Unfortunately a majority of jumpers are not organized enough to pull it off. We'll have to lose some battles here, but do you want to win the battle or the WAR?Looks like a death sandwich without the bread - Steve Deadman Morrell, BASE 174 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gweeks 1 #6 June 27, 2007 This guy has had success getting snowmobilers and 4 wheelers access to National Parks. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jingleballs 0 #7 June 27, 2007 Quote Edit To Add: Skydivers ... Please Do Not Poll. If you wish to comment do so in the thread. Thanks As requested, I'm commenting without voting. The options you have presented in the poll are incomplete. You give people the option to indicate whether or not they think the case has merit, but only if they vote in a certain way. A person who votes yes (willing to be a party) does not necessarily want to imply that the case has merit -- it might just be a show of solidarity. Another person who votes yes might very well want to show a believe in the merits of the action. So those two cases should (in my view) be separated.The world is one giant drop zone now, Bonnie! - Seth Blake Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpecialKaye 0 #8 June 27, 2007 pretty impressive resume Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dmcoco84 5 #9 June 27, 2007 Thanks everyone for the inputs so far. Great info! This is something I feel very strongly about and would like to see an outcome in our favor. I have some legal contacts I will be consulting with for legal guidance. Anyone else with legal background or connections that can provide additional knowledge base would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance Kaye. We have a right to jump there and if we don’t step up its never gonna happen. Senate and Congressional members are very beneficial but slow in their aid...Judicial intervention may be what we need to attain our goals before we are "old timer". I’ll be out of the country for BASE during July and August but when I get back I will be putting a lot of time into this. It will take time, money and struggle but it can be done. “We stand on the Shoulders of Giants” Coco Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dmcoco84 5 #10 June 27, 2007 Thank you for your comment but that’s a little more in-depth of a poll than is really necessary in the developing stages of action. I have pretty simple primary goals. A) Make a game plan for approaching this issue. B) Try to find a rough estimate of the people who care about this topic and whether or not they would like to give me, at the least, a name and signature. The degree of merit this case has in someone’s eyes is not of importance to me. If someone votes no, I take that as a lack of interest and an opinion of either low or no merit. Simple as that. Coco Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflight 0 #11 June 27, 2007 shit, i'm in! we were talking about it during our two day vacation in jail for nrg jump. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diveout 0 #12 June 27, 2007 My application for a special use permit should be in to Zion by end of this week, I'll post the response as soon as I have it... And yes, count me in. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
littlestranger 0 #13 June 27, 2007 so i have a couple of questions... outside of bridge day, has anyone ever had a permit approved? is there documentation of how many permits have been requested? denied/approved? would the aclu be interested in representing our cause, (kind of doubt it but thought i'd throw it out there) tom tancredo's name has been associated with discrimination against BASE jumpers, now that he's running for president, would he continue to support us? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GreenMachine 0 #14 June 28, 2007 would the ACLU be interested in representing our cause Maybe we could get some support from the "Hemlock Society"Rigger, Skydiver, BASE Jumper, Retired TM Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sinister 0 #15 June 28, 2007 http://randazza.wordpress.com/2007/06/22/base-jumping-and-the-law/#more-172Shane Murphy www.adrenalinegeeks.com Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MB38 0 #16 June 28, 2007 Not a bad guy to contact...I really don't know what I'm talking about. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomDancs 0 #17 June 29, 2007 Hello, I would also be willing to contribute monies to the cause. You might call Rick Harrison for input/advice on this subject. Tom Dancs Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
d_goldsmith 1 #18 June 29, 2007 I know some people find him pretty abrasive, but Robin Heid could probably contribute some helpful insights to this as well. Anyone seen him post lately? If I don't see him reply I'll email him about this.I've got this really hardcore group of gaurdian angels that need a free paid vacation. ~Dan Osman Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RickHarrison 0 #19 June 29, 2007 legal permits in Yosemity in 80, legal freefall permits in Canynon de Chelley in 83 -84 and some others. Much better ways to get permits than litigation.' Rick HRick Harrison Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marcorandazza 1 #20 June 29, 2007 Regarding me being "not a bad guy to contact...." feel free to do so. However, contrary to the incorrect stereotypes about lawyers, I have very strong ethics... therefore, I can't say that I'd take such a case. Not because I don't think it has merit. It might. I just don't think I am the best man for the job. This is the kind of case that, if you put it together, should be handled by the absolute best man for the task. I have seen many important cases that turned to a big double-malfunction because the attorney who took the case was motivated by lucre and/or ego. In situations like that, when the case is lost, the lawyer gets to go on with his career -- but the cause suffers a horrible setback. That all being said, I can think of nobody better to lead the team on something like this than Fred Morelli. When it comes to this area of law, he's the Jolly Green Giant, and I'm a Keebler Elf. On a case like this, I'd consider it an honor to just carry Morelli's briefcase for him. That being said, feel free to take any materials you find on my blog, and if there is some small way that I can help out -- don't hesitate to ask. One thing that I think I could do is this: I teach Sports Law, and I have a lot of talented students. If you wind up hiring a good lawyer for this case, no matter what, I'm sure that you will be hard pressed to fully fund the suit. This case could easily run to six figures. I'd be more than willing to talk to the attorney who takes the case, and put him in contact with some of my students. Perhaps some of them would be willing (under your lawyer's supervision) to do research and memos to cut down on costs for you, and gain practical experience for themselves. I'm not promising anything, but even though I don't jump anymore, I still consider myself to be "part of the community." I'm certain that if I put out a call for help for something on DZ.com, I'd get more than I needed. (Actually, that has already happened -- back in January) So, in that spirit of "be excellent to each other," I'll certainly do whatever I can that will be both ethical and likely to help, rather than hinder, the cause. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
azdiver 0 #21 June 29, 2007 long time no hear, did the girl you were talking about giving the rest of the money to get it? still aint jumping thought us eloy peeps had u back in itlight travels faster than sound, that's why some people appear to be bright until you hear them speak Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
460 0 #22 June 29, 2007 try emailing Rick Harrison or PM'ing him instead of calling him.Looks like a death sandwich without the bread - Steve Deadman Morrell, BASE 174 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1969912 0 #23 June 29, 2007 See attachment for suggestion. It is not directed at anyone in particular, and should not be taken personally. Some will understand, some not. Any questions or comments? Please PM me. PM's that don't look like they are from regular forum participants will be ignored, as will PM's intended as flames. If you feel compellled to flame my ass, do it in public, I rather enjoy it. Thank You! "Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ." -NickDG Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nicrussell 0 #24 June 30, 2007 You asked for it, so I REFUSE to call you a dipshit. I also WILL NOT call you an annoying ass who has nothing to contribute to a somewhat thought provoking subject. And to call you an ASSinine cock sucker would serve no purpose but to please your own diluted sense of self numbering, SO I WONT. =nic (cya in 2 weeks) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
base283 0 #25 June 30, 2007 IMHO, One must assess the morality of the poster's posts before playing god and judging the individual. Take care, space Share this post Link to post Share on other sites