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laird

It's 3'o clock have you seen your ninja skills?

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I was bored, the wind is kickin these days so Im stuck on the net! I know that some of you don't care about jump numbers or keep track of them (yada yada I do it for me yada yada it’s all about having fun yada fuckin yada). So stop reading and move on. For those of you that do... read on. I log everything PG hours/flts, skydives, BASE, days skied this season, and I journal about all kinds of stuff. I have a need to keep track if for no other reason than to reflect on it at a later time. So now to the reason for the post:

It is obvious that the average jump numbers per jumper have increased since "the old days", mainly because of legal access to sites (among other things). Now that there are more than several people with a thousand jumps and even more people with 500+, I can't help but think that the majority of those jumps are legal. I could be wrong (that happens often), but what if you didn't count your legal jumps. Would that cut your BASE experience in half? I'd bet probably more. It sure does with mine, only a third of my jumps are illegal. I’m just curious about those teaching BASE if there experience is less than half maybe these busts lately are because of the lack of knowledge (ninja skills) being passed down (or the participants were just stupid). So the question is “Are we losing the skills needed to pull off such jumps?” I would be impressed if someone actually had more illegal jumps than legal, but still had high jump numbers(say around 3 to 4 hundred)
I also realize that one can participate in BASE and do nothing but legal jumps (as lame as that sounds to me), it is possible. That’s not what I'm talking about.
Before some one says it. Yes all jumps add to your experience I know, but legal jumps are just for practicing your BASE skills without the pressure of getting caught (right?). If legal BASE was that exciting we would all live in Norway, but I don't think that is why some of us do it.



"HIGAF" Honestly I Give A F*^%

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I beleive the only place BASE is still a crime is in the NPs every other building antenna span or earth I jumped must therefore just have been training for that one jump.

I guess I only ever made one 'REAL' BASE jump

Grow some balls, come play in the back country I'm sure we can give you jumps that will add more pressure than the cops ever could.

Jumps thast will leave you sat at the bottom giggling like a little school girl just because your alive

Your big wide smooth road landing areas will never be the same again.

Get a life my friend................

Greeny

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there are more people died from legal base site than Illegal site, legal or not legal base is base, what is big deal abut getting busted, stop just jumping for illegal bridges and do some real jump.
"A peaceful heart leads to a healthy body; jealousy is like cancer in the bones ..."

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I beleive the only place BASE is still a crime is in the NPs every other building antenna span or earth I jumped must therefore just have been training for that one jump.
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I guess that I failed to realize that someone would dodge the issue and take offense at something I've said. I took for granted that you might know what I meant by illegal. So that we are on the same page: legal meaning that you have permission to be there or that people don't care that your there. I didn't mean that illegal should be a law specificly banning BASE, but that you are breaking a law by being there.

***I guess I only ever made one 'REAL' BASE jump



Well then maybe you should sit this conversation out. Unless you can see the meaning of the post , then join in when you feel capable.

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Grow some balls, come play in the back country I'm sure we can give you jumps that will add more pressure than the cops ever could.




Your assuming I haven't.



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Get a life my friend................



Isn't that why we do these things? (BASE I mean)



"HIGAF" Honestly I Give A F*^%

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there are more people died from legal base site than Illegal site, legal or not legal base is base, what is big deal abut getting busted, stop just jumping for illegal bridges and do some real jump.



You are correct BASE is BASE theres a level of danger to it all, thanks for stating the obvious. Don't you think there are more fatalities at legal sites because more people do more jumps at legal sites these days? You live in Hunington beach what are jumping thats legal there pal?

I was simply wanting to get some input on whether or not people feel the corporate knowledge the old timers have is being pasted along, and if the new era of jumpers are learning those skills.



"HIGAF" Honestly I Give A F*^%

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It's 3'o clock have you seen your ninja skills?



have I?
the important question, has anyone else?

if no one else knows, I have done my job.
DON'T PANIC
The lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.
sloppy habits -> sloppy jumps -> injury or worse

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I never said all my jump are legal, but jumping off mushroom on eiger is legal and that is one heck of jump.
"A peaceful heart leads to a healthy body; jealousy is like cancer in the bones ..."

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It's 3'o clock have you seen your ninja skills?



have I?
the important question, has anyone else?

if no one else knows, I have done my job.



exactly!

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I can respect that. A jump that takes some work to get to, is more challenging in every respect has more to offer in terms of experience as far as I am concerned.



"HIGAF" Honestly I Give A F*^%

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Quote [Your assuming I haven't.]

I have no interest in who you are or what you have done, therefore I assume nothing

I’m biting at the fact you come across as the only jumps worth doing are the high profile / high bust in town jumps.

Quote [but legal jumps are just for practicing your BASE skills without the pressure of getting caught (right?) ]

Wrong! Most legal sites are jumped because the jumps are outstanding in there own way and nothing to do with training specifically (except that every jump is training for the next) and if like you say you have you had been out and done some you would know that!

If that is not what you were saying I suggest you rewrite your post.

Greeny

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Even the "easy" Moab jumps are hardcore, all of em. And they're legal. I've seen the Euro bigwall Meisters all handheld and shittin kittens. Very sweeeeeet!
"It takes a big man to cry, it takes an even bigger man to make that big man cry"

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yeah came back from euro tirp jumping big wall, when back to moab it seemed really lower than before
"A peaceful heart leads to a healthy body; jealousy is like cancer in the bones ..."

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whats with you guys? All your little egos hurt? The man asked a question, he didn't call you all pussies. :P
to respond specifically. I think that there are jumpers that enjoy the illegal jumps that require those skills. That doesn't make them high profile city jumps, it just requires some stealth to pull them off. And there are lots of legal jumps that are just as hardcore, in different ways.."We" as a community are diverse in our choice and options for jumps, they all have different skill sets.

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It has nothing to do with egos Laird said and I quote

[ but legal jumps are just for practicing your BASE skills without the pressure of getting caught (right?).]

May be I read that wrong but I'm sure it means everything legal is just training for the illegal!

I'm just saying Laird is talking out of his arse.......
and obvoiusly hasn't got a clue. I assume seeing as you (MFNREN) are sticking up for him you are jumping buddies & therefore guilty by assotiation

Greeny

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it's ninga d00d:P
----------------------------------------------
You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

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You brits and your attitude:P I've never met him.
Telling someone to get a life because one quote that you took so seriously..
Whats it to you if he doesn't have as much experience as you? You have to say he doesn't have a clue to make yourself feel like a big bad base jumper? You don't have any thing posted about your experience so who's saying your not some tosser spouting off with no experience?

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I'm sorry I obviously hurt your feeling, but seriously are you going to quit bitching like a little girl and maybe somewhere in you post answer the questions I presented. If not your really no use to this discussion.



"HIGAF" Honestly I Give A F*^%

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I can't help but think that the majority of those jumps are legal. I could be wrong..[].. but what if you didn't count your legal jumps. Would that cut your BASE experience in half?

...maybe these busts lately are because of the lack of knowledge (ninja skills) being passed down (or the participants were just stupid). So the question is “Are we losing the skills needed to pull off such jumps?”




Ok. Without trawling though my logbooks, i'd say 75% of my jumps are non legal - that is, required trespassing. The rest are pretty much big walls in europe or the few small cliffs we have over here which although not condoned are not illegal.

So now to the main issue. Firstly, the implied connection between lack of ninja skills and recent busts. Well firstly, I'd have to question whether there is ANY increase in busts lately. Probably not.

As to whether some of the recent busts are down to stupid jumpers and lack of ninja skills... well you'd have to be specific as throwing together jumps as diverse as the recent aussie one, my recent bust at Wembley and the guy who PCA'd a mate off a building in the states and climbed down to a welcoming party....each case on it's own merits.

Getting busted on a remote antenna because you elected to jump it; in the middle of the day, when a farmer was in the fields near-by or when engineers were on site, well you could notch that up to bad practice, lack of common sense and lack of ethics.

Getting busted jumping an occupied building because Police happened to be driving by just as you land.....well that's an issue which could be hotly debated here. Some will argue that you shouldn't have jumped the building at all if there was any chance of getting busted, others would argue that jumping is about calculated risks, and busts like injury, are all a part of the equation.

Similarly, many of us will have run out onto motorway (highway/interstate) bridges to jump from the centre or have been dropped off by getaway drivers at the middle. It's all down to good or bad luck as to whether a police car happens to drive past at that exact moment. Day or night?

The one thing i would say is that people really seem to be buying in to this 'ninja' stealth idea that being cunning is going to ensure you don't get caught. That's naive rubbish. Canopies do not understand the concept of stealth. When they open, they let the world know. When they do, there's a certain amount of luck involved in who happened to be in earshot at that exact moment.

Can you really account for every security guard, every police officer, every have-a-go hero?

Yes certain measures can be employed, basic common sense applied but just like physically surviving a BASE jump, a big chunk of it boils down to raw luck.

Some jumpers take the absolute piss and get away with it for years. Some take all the cautious measures they can and still pay the price.

Me. I live and work in the Capital which I believe pre-disposes me to greater bust risks than if i lived in a more rural area. I don't have to do the jumps I do, but I choose to, and when I do them I go in with eyes wide open.

I'll take the necessary precautions to avoid getting busted but some jumps, and specifically the one I was busted on recently which I guess you may have alluded to as it was mentioned in a thread here, well, some jumps you either do them or you don't...and doing them nearly assures you of getting busted. I was willing to do that and I have no regrets whatsoever...well a few minor ones if i'm honest.

What I can say is that I would have regretted not seizing the moment and going for that jump forever. The window of opportunity would have passed and I might have spent years thinking 'if only'.

That is not why I started jumping. I BASE jump to turn 'what ifs' and 'if onlys' into real incredible experiences. As corny as that sounds....I'd say that pretty much sums it up for me, so the odd bust, providing I've done all i can to minimise that risk and the impact of my actions on others (beyond not jumping) is something I can live with, and at the end of the day, I have to live with myself and not with the few who would piously use any opportunity to slap me down.

ian

ps. and i'm not suggesting you were being pious.

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sorry for the long post. I try to be succinct but it never seems to work.

ian

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Out of 149 jumps only two that i can remember were "Legal". Hey Laird, I've been raging up here. Give a call!

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almost all of my ~500 jumps have not been on "easy" legal sites.
Looks like a death sandwich without the bread - Steve Deadman Morrell, BASE 174

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