RyanofOZ 0 #1 March 22, 2004 This is a take off from my thread concerning my reserve and the fact that I am in the market for a new one. What are your opinions on these two canopys? I know the PD is proven and loved by many, but what about Aerodyne's new one? Any opinions? What would you buy and why? I am told that they are the two best going right now so I need some good experiences to go on. Thanks!Oz Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
USPA 0 #2 March 22, 2004 off topic, but in Europe we have really good experience with the Techno from Parachute de France too. (they're mains sucks though... ) (disregard last comment)The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RyanofOZ 0 #3 March 22, 2004 I have heard about the Techno a little bit. I just dont know anyone that owns one. I will look into that one too, thanksOz Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cloggy 1 #4 March 22, 2004 This is what I was told when looking for reserve: PD packs bigger than others in same size (too big for my rig), Smart or Techno would be good choices. Techno (and I guess Smart too) only comes in white, if that would be an issue to you. I got the Techno, haven't tried it yet Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vt1977 0 #5 March 22, 2004 The only thing to be aware of with the Techno is that Parachutes de France will not sell their products in the USA. Vicki Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Supergeil 0 #6 March 22, 2004 The Techno packs a little smaler because of the direct line attachment. You can't load it so high as the PD so if you are a heavy jumper the Pd is a better choice. And if you live in USA the techno is going to be much more expencive than the PD. I think the reason why the Techno is so popular in Eroupe is that the $ have bin high for some time but now whit the cheap $ I think people will go for what they like and not the cheapest. I live in Eroupe and my reserve is a PD why buy a reserve from a company which main parachute you never would buy ..go for the best it's you last chance when you go for metal. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RyanofOZ 0 #7 March 22, 2004 That could be a problem! Looks like its Smart or PD. I am leaning twords Smart since I can buy a new one for the price of a good used PD.Oz Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aubsmell 0 #8 March 22, 2004 I lifted this description/marketing copy from the Aerodyne website. I get a lot of questions in the field about the Smart, so I figured this would be a good place to post some of the info. I won't go down the vs. PD or vs. Raven of vs. Techno, that is for you guys to decide. However since Aerodyne Intl bought PISA I get the question alot "isn't it just a beefed up Tempo" To which the answer is no. It was designed and tested from scratch. Read below and if you want more tech infor vistit our website. [/url]http://www.aerodyne-int.com/sport/flash/sport.asp[url] I hope this helps. Aubrey ________________________________________________ Our team knows reserves. We have been involved with the design and production of more sport reserves than any other group in our industry. When we set about designing a new reserve from concept, we used this experience to the fullest. Reserves are about a few important things: safety, reliability, and performance. Our new reserve is tested far beyond the minimum requirements of the latest US TSO (c23d) as well as the European standards (JTSO). We manufacture the Smart under the strictest international quality management program (ISO 9001). Few, if any, other manufacturers currently hold this difficult certification. The Smart is constructed chordwise with additional spanwise reinforcement. After studying various failure modes of existing reserve designs, Aerodyne is the first manufacturer to incorporate radial reinforcement into the tail of the Smart reserve as well. All of this adds up to what we believe is the world’s strongest reserve. Again after studying existing reserve designs, we found the aerodynamics in use to be quite out of step with current technology. This was no surprise, as there has not been a new sport reserve design in some time. Since the Smart reserve was developed from initial concept, we were not constrained. We applied the most modern aerodynamic solutions to the problems of reserve canopy deployment, flight and landing. Of course pack volume was a concern as well. All of this technology is of little value, if the canopy will not fit into your reserve container. What does it all mean? Simple, the Smart is the state of the art in reserve canopies. Strength, reliability, and performance manufactured to the world’s highest standards. All of this technology and quality is available with a small pack volume, and is compatible with all modern harness/container systems. Is it time for a new reserve? If it is, we are confident you will make the Smart choice. The Smart reserve from Aerodyne. -One of the few reserves approved under the latest TSO-C23d as well as the European JTSO -Tested far beyond the requirements for deployment weight and speed - The Smart is manufactured under the strict ISO 9001 quality management system -The only reserve with additional radial reinforcement in the tail section -High lift wing and advanced aerodynamics provide maximum low-speed lift for comfortable landings - Peace of mind packed into the smallest possible container -Available in a large range of sizes -Small pack volume."Those who say it cannot be done, should not interrupt those who are doing it" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Supergeil 0 #9 March 22, 2004 One question pops up in my mind...why are Aerodyne cheaper than most of the others parachute companies in USA? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GravityGirl 0 #10 March 22, 2004 QuoteOne question pops up in my mind...why are Aerodyne cheaper than most of the others parachute companies in USA? As I understand it, they have bigger manufacturing facilities which allow them to bring the cost down a bit. Not all American Parachute companies manufacture their reserves in the US....FYI. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Peace and Blue Skies! Bonnie ==>Gravity Gear! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RyanofOZ 0 #11 March 22, 2004 Interesting point. I would like to know myself what makes theirs that much less money. Anyone?Oz Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aubsmell 0 #12 March 22, 2004 That's a good question, I can't give you a completely strait answer. I would have to go with a few facts. 1. We manufacturer all of out sport parachuting products in our state of the art ISO 9001 certified factory in South Africa. The primary cost involved in the production of parachutes and parachute containers, I assume, is the labor cost. There are other skydivig product manufacturers that are also American companies that manufacture in either Honduras or Korea that enjoy hire profit margins in those products. We save a few bucks in production which we pass on to you. In addition, this factory which is part of the Aerodyne group of companies primarily builds military parachutes, so it stays busy with high volume which, as you know when you build anything in high volume production becomes more efficent and therefore cheaper. Second our product line is fairly new, and we have to take multipal avenues of approach to entice customers to give our products a try. And it is no secret that this is an expensive sport, so if we can lure you in with lower prices and good customer service, we stand a good possibility of makeing you a customer for life. As for the components for canopies and containers, the vast majority of the stuff comes from the same suppliers, as there are only a few producers of parachute fabric (at least the kind that we use in sport parachuting) most companies buy line from the same place as well as tape, even thread, the same with the rigs. Just pick up two different containers and you'll see that most of the components are from the same manufacturers, so my best guess again would be that primarily, it comes down to the labor. Secondarily it comes down the marketing decision to take slightly lower profit margins in order to make the products more attractive, in order to garner a niche in a small market. Take it easy. Aubrey"Those who say it cannot be done, should not interrupt those who are doing it" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RyanofOZ 0 #13 March 22, 2004 Well said. Thanks!Oz Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
boogie 0 #14 March 22, 2004 Quoteoff topic, but in Europe we have really good experience with the Techno from Parachute de France too. (they're mains sucks though... ) (disregard last comment) Their mains don't suck at all! I love my Electra! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
USPA 0 #15 March 22, 2004 I said disregard.. The trouble with skydiving; If you stink at it and continue to jump, you'll die. If you're good at it and continue to jump, you'll see a lot of friends die... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Supergeil 0 #16 March 22, 2004 Thank you very much for the fine answer! Keep up the good work and the prices on a acceptable level.Competition isn't bad. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dragon2 0 #17 March 22, 2004 I load my Transfair (pre-Techno 128) 1.2:1 and have landed it 3 times so far. The Techno is a good reserve! I personally don't like the french MAINS because of the shorter toggle range and snappier openings, but that's personal. I know a lot of happy people with Merit's, Electra's, Springo's. I wouldn't buy anything but a PD, Techno or maybe Smart, myself, for my main rig. My CReW rig has a big african reserve in it which I only keep because it is BIG (well for me anyway). Anything I'm going to be loading above 1:1 has to be something I trust, ie definately the 2 reserves I mentioned and very probably the Smart too. The Techno is NOT second choice, it's a tie for first, at least for me. ciel bleu, Saskia Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Supergeil 0 #18 March 23, 2004 When it comes to reserves I think it's a matter of taste and trust and maybe a little what the other got on your dropzone. I am sure that those companies that make good mains are better of to make a good reserve they can use the skills and experiences from the mains into the reserves...fast and predictable/reliable openings. There are not much new development on the reserves today they are all reliable so the choice of what reserve you buy must be a mix of what you trust in and influence/trust from friends and influence/trust to the company you are going to bye the reserve from. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
webracer 0 #19 March 23, 2004 Ryan, PD makes the best, tested and trusted. You can load them up, they still perform (many actually feel the more you load them, the better). The smart, raven, techno, tempo, airforce, etc.. are all good reserves if they meet the standard (although some don't fly straight), but they are not the best. PD also is the only reserve that has any sort of resale value (something to think about if you plan to downsize in the future). As for ISO 9001, achieving that certification is just a matter of money. It is an international standard that test a quality system against known parameters (basically ISO does not set out what your quality program has to be, just that you are following what you have documented). I used to audit for ISO/QS qualifications, and it is just a matter of money. Just because one manufacturer has ISO cert. and another doesn't means nothing. If you have an ISO rating, you may get more corporate business. PD packs bigger, and flys better. PD has the best resale (among reserves, but all reserves have pisspoor resale values due to superstition and ignorance). Good luck!Troy I am now free to exercise my downward mobility. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymedic 0 #20 March 23, 2004 QuoteThe only thing to be aware of with the Techno is that Parachutes de France will not sell their products in the USA. There are many ways around this. they wont sell directly but it can be done. Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 259 #21 March 23, 2004 QuoteThe smart, raven, techno, tempo, airforce, etc.. are all good reserves if they meet the standard (although some don't fly straight), but they are not the best. Have you flown and landed a Smart, Raven, Techno, Tempo and an Airforce reserve? If not, how do you know that any or all of them don't fly straight? What "standard" are you referring to? "The best" is a relative term. What's "best" for you may or may not be "best" for someone else. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 7 #22 March 23, 2004 QuoteWhat are your opinions on these two canopys? I know the PD is proven and loved by many, but what about Aerodyne's new one? Any opinions? What would you buy and why? I am told that they are the two best going right now so I need some good experiences to go on. I have had several people I trust tell me that the Smart is a good reserve. Having said that I have no personal experience with it other than taking a good look at one in the loft. Seems to be a good canopy. I will say this much I have 6 rides on PD products...I have done everything from hooking them to half breaked approaches...And I have been happy every time. I also don't run out and buy new products...Yes that means I may pay more, and not have the shinniest new toys. But I also know what I am getting. If I were to buy a new reserve right now...It would be PD. But Smart is gaining ground with every day that they don't have a problem. Think about it...It is your LAST chance."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RyanofOZ 0 #23 March 23, 2004 Very good point. I am fond of the "proven" theory but also like to take full advantage to new and improved designs. I know PD is proven, but Aerodyne may have something just as good or better. The only way to know is fly one as Lisa said above, and hear about personal experience from people. In the end they are all "good" canopys. Some are just better in certain areas. I am going to buy Aerodyne. I have heard a lot of good things from a lot or people, including my rigger. I know it is not as proven as PD, but they make a great product and I will be happy to put that as my last ditch effort. One other reason I am fairly confident is I have yet to hear any of the same things I heard about the Raven it is replacing. Not one "it stalls easy, had a built in turn, no flair, blew out a cell, got me home but dislocated my shoulder etc.." That may be because they are not as many out there yet, but I doubt it. I guess I will see what happens the first time I go for silver. Thanks for all the views and input from all of you. This place is great.Oz Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
KevinMcGuire 0 #24 March 23, 2004 Many years ago while visiting Byron skydiving, I was watched as a guy who was trying to go as fast as he could head down, blew right through his cypres activation altitude doing about 250mph. The Cypres fired and BANG, he was open under his PD reserve. Neither he or his reserve suffered any damage. I have been a true believer in PD reserves ever since. I have no experience with the smart reserve either packing one or jumping one. There for I can offer no advice or oinion about it. I know that there are many folks working at aerodyne who used to work for PD. I guess time will tell if they are able to maintain the same high lever of professionalism and quality present at PD. Good luck guys. I hope you do well. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Supergeil 0 #25 March 23, 2004 That right but who would pay more for a Techno than a PD......no one I know. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
