TVPB 0
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That sums it pretty well Jason. If you don't base jump, this really is not something you need to worry about, and those who do probably really don't care about your armchair quarterback opinion on the subject.
FWIIW, I had a feeling this was a hoax a couple days ago. It just didn't add up. Gut feelings are often right.
Cya.
FWIIW, I had a feeling this was a hoax a couple days ago. It just didn't add up. Gut feelings are often right.
Cya.
namgrunt 0
AFTER ACTION REPORT
#1 many good folks upon hearing tried to do what was helpfull
#2 wild speculation once again comes back to bite you on the ass
#3 jumpers that were not friends with the family or missing jumper steped up to the plate with no thought of reward
#4 this jumping BASE .skydiveing comunity is bashed enough ,mis quoted by the press
but reality shows that we still stick together
#5 offers of help,searching,prayers and hope were freely given
#6 possibly a jumper may want to rething a buddy that states he will run away if somethind bad occures.
#7 lets not beat each outher up over being fooled as we get fooled all the time anyway,just watch TV or listen to a politician
BAD THINGS HAPEN TO GOOD PEOPLE ALL THE TIME
lets give a break and move on
yes there was drama with this incident but what if NO ONE SAID OR DID ANYTHING which would be worse
this young man did something stupid and used poor judgement but who here is not guilty of that
he needs help the family needs help and we need to forgive each outher for our sometimes hastey words
..
#1 many good folks upon hearing tried to do what was helpfull
#2 wild speculation once again comes back to bite you on the ass
#3 jumpers that were not friends with the family or missing jumper steped up to the plate with no thought of reward
#4 this jumping BASE .skydiveing comunity is bashed enough ,mis quoted by the press
but reality shows that we still stick together
#5 offers of help,searching,prayers and hope were freely given
#6 possibly a jumper may want to rething a buddy that states he will run away if somethind bad occures.
#7 lets not beat each outher up over being fooled as we get fooled all the time anyway,just watch TV or listen to a politician
BAD THINGS HAPEN TO GOOD PEOPLE ALL THE TIME
lets give a break and move on
yes there was drama with this incident but what if NO ONE SAID OR DID ANYTHING which would be worse
this young man did something stupid and used poor judgement but who here is not guilty of that
he needs help the family needs help and we need to forgive each outher for our sometimes hastey words
..
59 YEARS,OVERWEIGHT,BALDIND,X-GRUNT
LAST MIL. JUMP VIET-NAM(QUAN-TRI)
www.dzmemories.com
LAST MIL. JUMP VIET-NAM(QUAN-TRI)
www.dzmemories.com
MickeN 0
QuoteFine I'm wrong.Can we talk about Scott getting the help he needs while he sits in jail.Because that is what needs to happen now.Or do you have a problem with that oppinion also?
.
What's the deal with americans and jail? Is jail the common solution to all bad that's going on?
"The guy is dead. Somebody needs to go to jail!"
"The guy is NOT dead. Somebody needs to go to jail!"
Please tell me this is not the general opinion in USA, please tell me it's only this CSpenceFLY dude..... and maybe a few rednecks.
/Micke N
Team Bautasten
tr027 0
Quote
What's the deal with americans and jail? Is jail the common solution to all bad that's going on?
"The guy is dead. Somebody needs to go to jail!"
"The guy is NOT dead. Somebody needs to go to jail!"
Please tell me this is not the general opinion in USA, please tell me it's only this CSpenceFLY dude..... and maybe a few rednecks.
/Micke N
Team Bautasten
Yes, somebody went to jail, so we're all happy again.
edit: Are we supposed to be happy over all the time and money that was wasted especially everybody that went out frantically searching sites that when we hear "oh, just kidding" we just say "good one, that was really funny" ???
"The evil of the world is made possible by nothing but the sanction you give it. " -John Galt from Atlas Shrugged, 1957
unfortunately, the US is a place where somebody always has to be punished. if something bad happens, even a complete accident, someone has to pay. we are not happy unless every bad event is vindicated by jail time or a huge lawsuit.
"Your scrotum is quite nice" - Skymama
www.kjandmegan.com
"Your scrotum is quite nice" - Skymama
www.kjandmegan.com
It's the truth. "BASE jumping is illegal" Until that very common misconception goes away, people will continue to call the police whenever they see a jump. If you land in the street, and a police officer sees you, he will assume that you need to be arrested.
Once in TF, I even had a hard time convincing a tourist that we were perfectly legally jumping off the bridge. I talked to him for a couple minutes.
Tourist: "This is illegal right?"
Me: "Actually, this is one of the few places that we can jump, totally legally."
Tourist: "So you're going to go out there and jump right now?"
Me: "Yes, and this is actually the perfect place to watch from. If you want, you can walk out to the middle of the bridge and watch us from there."
Tourist: "Do the cops know you're doing this?"
Me: "Yes, we call them every morning and let them know that there will be BASE jumpers out here."
Tourist: "Well, I'm going to call and ask them for myself."
Me: "That's okay. I'm going to go jump now. Have a good day, Sir." (walking away thinking... "What the...?")
Once in TF, I even had a hard time convincing a tourist that we were perfectly legally jumping off the bridge. I talked to him for a couple minutes.
Tourist: "This is illegal right?"
Me: "Actually, this is one of the few places that we can jump, totally legally."
Tourist: "So you're going to go out there and jump right now?"
Me: "Yes, and this is actually the perfect place to watch from. If you want, you can walk out to the middle of the bridge and watch us from there."
Tourist: "Do the cops know you're doing this?"
Me: "Yes, we call them every morning and let them know that there will be BASE jumpers out here."
Tourist: "Well, I'm going to call and ask them for myself."
Me: "That's okay. I'm going to go jump now. Have a good day, Sir." (walking away thinking... "What the...?")
I was under the impression that BASE was not the illigal part, it was the tresspassing or illigal air delivery. Am I wrong on this?
This thread was about a BASE jumper who was not a BASE jumper, about a pact that did not exist amoung him and his friends. To be honest I learned only that it is easy to be fooled. I have talked with several BASE and all of them have told me that yes some agree to leave the body of someone who pounds in but there it is understood that the others will inform those who can retrieve the body and make arrangements. So to me thats perfectly resonable if the BASE groups make those pacts. Just as in skydiving if I pound in I prefer to be moved out of the way so people can continue jumping for the rest of the day.
I feel bad that so many in the area worked hard to locate this jumper. I know if I were in their positions I would have done the same. I think those who were closest to it are dealing with a lot of emotions that are conflicting.
Some have stated that this thread was used to speculate, and I disagree, often thats the case in the incidents thread. However the fake BASE jumpers family themselves came on here seeking help. There was no speculation. Everyone was pointed to news casts, and many even spoke with the family on the phone.
This thread was about a BASE jumper who was not a BASE jumper, about a pact that did not exist amoung him and his friends. To be honest I learned only that it is easy to be fooled. I have talked with several BASE and all of them have told me that yes some agree to leave the body of someone who pounds in but there it is understood that the others will inform those who can retrieve the body and make arrangements. So to me thats perfectly resonable if the BASE groups make those pacts. Just as in skydiving if I pound in I prefer to be moved out of the way so people can continue jumping for the rest of the day.
I feel bad that so many in the area worked hard to locate this jumper. I know if I were in their positions I would have done the same. I think those who were closest to it are dealing with a lot of emotions that are conflicting.
Some have stated that this thread was used to speculate, and I disagree, often thats the case in the incidents thread. However the fake BASE jumpers family themselves came on here seeking help. There was no speculation. Everyone was pointed to news casts, and many even spoke with the family on the phone.
Sudsy Fist: i don't think i'd ever say this
Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this
Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this
QuoteIt's the truth. "BASE jumping is illegal" Until that very common misconception goes away, people will continue to call the police whenever they see a jump. If you land in the street, and a police officer sees you, he will assume that you need to be arrested.
Hey, not all of us! I'll give ya a high five, and most of the guys I work with would too!
Everyone, please keep in mind that the real victims of that situation were the family, who genuinely believed their son was dead. They've got to be hurting right now, and a little consideration for that would be appreciated.
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Just venting a bit here. . . .
Okay considered. I feel bad for the family but certainly not for the piece of shit that spawned this whole thing (Yeah I know we're all thinking that). I know I'm not only one to think this but I'll post it anyway; the only positive I can see from this whole situation is that it showed how much the BASE community cares about their fellow jumper. It certainly makes me feel good to know that even though most you don't know me at all, you would still go to such great efforts to lend a helping hand should something bad happen to me.
But to Scott and/or his buddies who started this. . . . my suggestion is to move far away, change your name, whatever. Personally I hope the BASE community just shuns you completely and that I never have to hear your name again. But I heard a story last night about a very high profile BASE jumper (think MTV) known for dayblazing objects who got what was coming to him. So good luck and I wouldn't want to be you right now.
J.P.
----------------------------------------------------------
Just venting a bit here. . . .
Okay considered. I feel bad for the family but certainly not for the piece of shit that spawned this whole thing (Yeah I know we're all thinking that). I know I'm not only one to think this but I'll post it anyway; the only positive I can see from this whole situation is that it showed how much the BASE community cares about their fellow jumper. It certainly makes me feel good to know that even though most you don't know me at all, you would still go to such great efforts to lend a helping hand should something bad happen to me.
But to Scott and/or his buddies who started this. . . . my suggestion is to move far away, change your name, whatever. Personally I hope the BASE community just shuns you completely and that I never have to hear your name again. But I heard a story last night about a very high profile BASE jumper (think MTV) known for dayblazing objects who got what was coming to him. So good luck and I wouldn't want to be you right now.
J.P.
wwarped 0
QuoteAFTER ACTION REPORT
well said.
I'm very proud to be a BASE jumper, but not strictly for the jumping. I have seen jumpers risk arrest to aid an injured jumper. A JUMPER THEY DID NOT KNOW.
I admire the rescue stories from MOAB.
those who stuck with Tom M deserve immense respect.
true, some have reasons to leave. I understand.
but I as I watched this incident unfold, there was NO shortage of assistance, of caring. to all who did what they could to assist, you're the reason I'm proud to be a part of this group called BASE jumpers.
DON'T PANIC
The lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.
sloppy habits -> sloppy jumps -> injury or worse
The lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss.
sloppy habits -> sloppy jumps -> injury or worse
The fact that its a bicker-fest more times than not perhaps?
-- (N.DG) "If all else fails – at least try and look under control." --
-- (N.DG) "If all else fails – at least try and look under control." --
Unless you are 110% certain that the person is deceased, you have no business leaving the scene or trying your hardest to get assistance.
Family MUST be informed (with an exception I'll mention below), and details given to allow recovery and psychological closure. This task should be performed asap and by a person who has psychological strength and empathy to complete the task in a humane way. Don't leave this task to the weak!!! It may not be completed.
Regarding the authorities and penalties, this is a choice made by individuals in agreement with each other. Jumping buddies may have opposing views but as long as each are willing to act out the wishes of their buddy, then it is OK. If your jump buddy will not do what you want, find another.
A pact is an agreement made between individuals and/or groups. Just because you do not like a pact, it does not necessarily make it right to act against it. There are situations/reasons where people do not want any involvment with their family (due to things like major conflict, abandonment, abuse, etc). Does another person have the right to challenge that???? It is a tough question.
But for 99% of people, I believe the family should be informed.
The punishment in many cases DOES NOT FIT THE CRIME. In fact, crime (r.e. BASE jumping) is a perception created by a minority of powerhungry folk who should be spending their time chasing terrorists, rapists, and murderers. Not people unfortunate enough to be at the scene of an accident that they, in general, had no affect over.
I know of a scenario where a fatality occured, rescuers would not commence a rescue until the jumpers admitted to the police to being accomplices (hence accessories to manslaughter according to local law), and the jumpers then initiated their own S&R and were criticised for it.
I know of an example where a jumper was bashed with a rifle butt because he would not tell the local authorities where his colleague was or who he is. The same group was also maltreated in a jail cell.
I know of jumpers who have been charged nearly $10000 for two heli rescues. These operations were run so inefficiently that it makes me cringe. The jumper was overcharged for incompetance. Yet at the same time, other people were rescued for greater acts of stupidiyt but were not charged at all - discrimination against BASE jumpers!!!!!
What do these scenario's mean? How do they affect the psychology of a jumper? They get scared. They are obviously being victimised and discriminated against, whether you want to recognise this or not - careers/finances/relationships/freedom are threatened. You can't travel to a lot of countries with any sort of criminal charge. You can't work in certain jobs. You could end up losing your own family and loved ones...
This is a window into the psychology and thinking that may lie behind "The Pact".
The penalty is greater for abandonment than for staying in this scenario. If it is proven that you were involved in grossly negligent acts, then there would be a harsher penalty. The problem for BASE jumpers in many areas is that BASE itself is considered a careless/negligent activity. Unless you are blatantly breaking laws, being with someone who is riding a bike is not.
- - - - - - -
If I go in and die. Take my rig, kick some dirt on me, learn from my stuff up, tell my family and/or authorities where I am, party on with the $$$ left in my wallet, and go and enjoy the remainder of your life. My soul/etc has gone to the "other world". I have no need for a corpse!!!!! I expect you to do this and will come back to haunt you (in jail) if you hang around for nothing.
p.s. make sure that I have died before acting out my wishes.
The above could be crap, thought provoking, useful, or . . But not personal. You decide.
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