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rickjump1

Base Reserve

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I hadn't thought about (1) clean airflow for better tracking, but I do tend to disagree with 2-4.

What's to disagree with? With respect to (4), I certianly haven't trained a bellymount into my procedures, and I suspect the same is true of most other jumpers. With respect to (2), most of the jumps I do around here are a 3-second delay with impact at ~5 seconds, and I suspect 1-2 seconds is too little to deploy a bellymount. With respect to (3), my recollection of Nick's list is that object strike does, in fact, dominate, and that other situations in which a reserve would not have helped (low pull / no pull, for instance) make up the bulk of the remainder.

Of course, a partial mal would be slower and would give more time. Most partials are already treated by, for instance, the line release mod and WLO toggles.

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Everyone on this site has more recent BASE jumping experience than I have. I certainly wouldn't presume to be an expert. All I intended to convey was that it has been my experience that it only takes a second to get a chest pack reserve out when it is needed.

Even if a high percentage of fatalities are due to object strikes, that still leaves a percentage that aren't, however small.

I saw a lot of malfunctions in Johnny Utah's Bridge Day safety video. It just seems to me that there are occasions when a reserve might come in handy.
In theory, there is no difference bretween theory and practice. In practice, however, there is. -

"RIP Forever Brian Schubert. Always remembered, Never forgotten" - Leroy DB
http://www.johnny

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Just my own rambling thoughts on old round belly-warts.

On most BASE jumps where a reserve would be used, your still going fairly slowly. A round reserve actually takes LONGER to inflate than a square, at least a square (sans slider) will get bottom skin inflation quicker because of (a) shorter lines, (b) smaller surface area.

Because of that, a tersh type deployment where the canopy is manually thrown out to the end of the lines would be much more effective than pulling the r/c on a chest mount and hoping the spring mounted pc will take the canopy out.

Also, a small square canopy would be much less bulky than an old round....

That said, with square reserves you always have the possibility of a downplane situation, so maybe a specially constructed, low surface area round with shorter lines might be an idea to develop. Maybe it should have a ballistic type launch system?

Seems like it would take a lot of work. I'd probably go with a second square and just cut the main away after reserve deployment....

As to Utah's, (or Will Forshay's) film, there have only been a handful of unlandable mals in the 20+ years at Bridge day, most are just premature brake releases. I've seen one cutaway in response to a mal (maybe two) the rest were usually line-overs that spiralled into the water. At least one pc hesitation caused a death (87?), but that was an undersized pc.

Big thing is, if you're in freefall with limited time, do you spend it trying to get the main to come out (not knowing what stage it's at) or do you put out the back-up and risk entanglement, running out of time....

Six of one, half dozen of the other....
If some old guy can do it then obviously it can't be very extreme. Otherwise he'd already be dead.
Bruce McConkey 'I thought we were gonna die, and I couldn't think of anyone

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Because of that, a tersh type deployment where the canopy is manually thrown out to the end of the lines would be much more effective than pulling the r/c on a chest mount and hoping the spring mounted pc will take the canopy out.
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Actually the old 24' chest packs had no pilot chute or sleeve. They were nothing more than a canopy packed neatly in a small container. They opened as soon as they hit the air, in what seemed to be hundreds of times faster than the old round main parachutes. You basically continued freefalling for the length of the lines.
In theory, there is no difference bretween theory and practice. In practice, however, there is. -

"RIP Forever Brian Schubert. Always remembered, Never forgotten" - Leroy DB
http://www.johnny

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A round reserve actually takes LONGER to inflate than a square, at least a square (sans slider) will get bottom skin inflation quicker because of (a) shorter lines, (b) smaller surface area.



our chest ones need about 100 - 120 ft for deployment (from a zerospeed)
we show this on every instuctional video, to convince the newbies that this technique will work (if needed and operated, whatever this means...)
I also have seen square reserves, mounted as chest reserves.
in my opinion, the reserve is meant as a speed brake, not a real flying canopy.

we here in germany HAD to wear two parachutes, because it is the law.
one main, one reserve.
therefore, the detachable D-rings were mounted on the reinforced MLW to carry the chest reserve.
(the german-built susi containersystem had the D-rings installed directly to the MLW.)
since this year, we have special permission by the DFV (german skydiving ass.), to stay away from the use of a reserve, if a jumper wants this.
but only if we can guarantee that an endangerment of spectators can be excluded.
example:
on our bridge day weekend:
only jumpers,
no one under the bridge:
we could jump without wearing a reserve.

on a jump in front of spectators,
perhaps with some of them directly under the exit point, there will be the use of a reserve-canopy obligatory.

in germany, till today, the harness/container, the main, the reserve-container and the reserve is to be tested and approved.
we have paperwork for every unit.
--------------------------------------------------

With sufficient thrust,
pigs just fly well

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Since the Perigre/ZAK and Troll have German TSO approval - and the European JTSO/JAAR TSO is pretty much a photo-copy of FAA TSO standards - you should be able to legally jump them from FAA-registered airplanes ... as long as you are wearing an FAA-approved chest type reserve.

This is the same logic that allows American citizens to legally jump Australian (Parachutes Australia), Canadian (Flying High), South African (PISA), French (Parachutes de France), German (Para-Tec) etc. skydiving gear manufactured under TSOs administered by their respective national airworthiness authorities.

The planet is getting smaller as more an more countries adopt FAA standards.

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Since the Perigre/ZAK and Troll have German TSO approval - and the European JTSO/JAAR TSO is pretty much a photo-copy of FAA TSO standards - you should be able to legally jump them from FAA-registered airplanes ... as long as you are wearing an FAA-approved chest type reserve.



Does that mean I can use a Troll as a reserve canopy? Or do main canopies require TSO approval in Germany?
-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

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Main canopies require TSO approval in Germany ... different standards than reserves.

Unless a canopy passes all the TSO drop tests for reserves, it cannot legally be used as a reserve.

I was mainly referring to BASE harnesses that passed German TSO testing. They still need TSOed chest-mounted reserves - to be legally jumped from FAA-registered airplanes.

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Since the Perigre/ZAK and Troll have German TSO approval - and the European JTSO/JAAR TSO is pretty much a photo-copy of FAA TSO standards - you should be able to legally jump them from FAA-registered airplanes ... as long as you are wearing an FAA-approved chest type reserve.


Rob,
The Rig(one approved harness, one approved container, and one approved Canopy along with the unappoved Canopy and container) must have an FAA TSO to jump from an airplane in the USA.

Regardless of what other countries the rig has been certified; if it was built in the USA and is being jumped in the USA from an airplane, the rig must carry a USA TSO.

Even if a German or other non-national was jumping it here!


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This is the same logic that allows American citizens to legally jump Australian (Parachutes Australia), Canadian (Flying High), South African (PISA), French (Parachutes de France), German (Para-Tec) etc. skydiving gear manufactured under TSOs administered by their respective national airworthiness authorities.




All of those rigs carry an offical USA TSO, not just the ones from their respective countries.

To make a legal jump, the Harness would need to be FAA aproved along with thw Chest mount parachute and container.

Hope that clears it up for everyone,
MEL
Skyworks Parachute Service
Skyworks Parachute Service, LLC
www.Skyworksparachuteservice.com

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Since the Perigre/ZAK and Troll have German TSO approval - and the European JTSO/JAAR TSO is pretty much a photo-copy of FAA TSO standards - you should be able to legally jump them from FAA-registered airplanes ... as long as you are wearing an FAA-approved chest type reserve.


...if it was built in the USA and is being jumped in the USA from an airplane, the rig must carry a USA TSO.



Since the Zak and Troll are both manufactured outside the US, does that mean that you could legally jump a Zak/Troll combo out of a plane, with a chest mounted reserve?
-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

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ask your chief instructor..if he says no then go do something else with your time..and ours



That was helpful. Thanks. Chances are a chief instructor would not know the answer to that question. They teach students to skydive are supposed to know the BSR's and pertinent FAA regs when it comes to repack cycles pull altitudes, and cloud clearance.

There's no reason he would need to know all TSO regs. Especially if they pertain to the foreign equivalent.
My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

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Since the Zak and Troll are both manufactured outside the US, does that mean that you could legally jump a Zak/Troll combo out of a plane, with a chest mounted reserve?



Tom,
You could if the Harness carried a FAA approval along with the chest mount and it's Canopy.

What someone should do is put the chest rings on a existing manufactured base rig's harness. Then use a already FAA approved chest mount system and TSO the system.

It is quite possible that the "new" Harness could be considered a major repair OR a remanufactured componet, thus a major short cut in the long TSO process.I would have to look into it to be sure.

Short jumps,
MEL
Skyworks Parachute Service, LLC
www.Skyworksparachuteservice.com

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