Base and Parents

[cygnusbase 0]

Jaap,

I am glad you finally came out with your parents. I am not sure which video you decided to show them but I am certain it was a great choice...Not like that one you had to show when you told them of your "secret" lifestyle. When I first met you this past weekend I had my doubts but at the end of the day as Pam and I looked back at you in the backseat of the convertible with that ocean air tossing your curly hair all over the place while you sang to your favorite ABBA tunes I knew you were an OK messed up person to Jump with. Congratulations.

The great thing is that your parents should be prepared for the "next" conversation with respect to your after hour visits to the zoo. They probably do not need to see that video but I know Chachi and I will give it an overview...He likes Zebras.

cygnus

[JaapSuter 0]

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Man, imagine how they're going to react when you tell them you're a cock-gobbling homo with a floppy anus!

I was going to wait until we got married, and then we could present ourselves at the same time. I'll be wearing the leather thong and then you can wear the gag-ball and be the gimp.

Oops...

Congratulations again dude! Getting voicemails like that is almost as good as jumping yourself! I'm still stoked....

[nicknitro71 0]

It's funny.

At the beginning both my perents went "Hey if you can jump from 36000' you can jump from 360' what's the big deal!"

I did not get into the explanation and I was very happy about the wuffo comments.

Later my dad saw a show on TV about BASE jumping and the next time we talked we went "How high is that bridge you just jumped?" "that does not leave you much time to deal with problems, does it?"

But overall they're cool about it.

Memento Audere Semper

903

[JaapSuter 0]

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The great thing is that your parents should be prepared for the "next" conversation with respect to your after hour visits to the zoo. They probably do not need to see that video but I know Chachi and I will give it an overview...He likes Zebras.

"I'm from Holland, isn't that vierd?" I may be European and open-minded in the bedroom (and outside of it); that doesn't mean I would ever consider doing felatio on a Zebra. I'm a vegetarian, remember?

Now plants on the other hand...

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When I first met you this past weekend I had my doubts but at the end of the day as Pam and I looked back at you in the backseat of the convertible with that ocean air tossing your curly hair all over the place while you sang to your favorite ABBA tunes I knew you were an OK messed up person to Jump with. Congratulations.

I'm honoured! Sorry I tend to be a little quiet in the morning, but you make so much noise that there's little more I could do than shut up. Ha!

It was great to meet you, and I'm looking forward to visiting you in Alberta and do some skydives and basejumps. Say hi to Pam and your parents. Your dad can always call me if he needs somebody to crash his Challenger again.

[JaapSuter 0]

In a desperate attempt to get this thread back on topic after Abbie's and Cygnusbase's interventions, let me share that the cold-shower theory is holding up greatly!

I talked to my parents for another hour or so today, and it seems the initial shock is gone. They're no longer mad and upset. They're now back at being greatly worried, but interestingly enough mildly curious as well!

What a relief...

My mom actually asked if she could see some video next week. I'll have to browse my video collection for some good footage. Preferably some cliff-jumps (nature is always good), mellow music, nice landings, nothing too extreme. I think Continuum 2 has some good footage like that. Any other recommendations?

Too bad I don't have video of my last base jump. That would have worked great!

[lifewithoutanet 0]

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"Why don't you just stick to jumping from bridges and cliffs? You shouldnt be breaking into places. That's wrong."

But the wonderful thing is we're not breaking a thing. It's the old wilderness ethos, adpated to BASE...

"Take only video and leave only footprints...which start in the middle of nowhere and lead hastily away."
-C.

[hollyhjb 0]

I just had a long talk with my parents. After reading some of the posts I feel like the reaction I got was pretty normal.

They do not want me to do this or even skydive (I don't think they realize the difference in the danger of the two). Talking to them was really hard...i even cried (I'm such a girl).

My parents are worried that I will forget about everything else and just drift around for the rest of my life, but they did assure me that they would continue to support me (mainly financially) no matter what I do.

"I reject your reality and substitute my own" ~Adam Savage

[leroydb 0]

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assure me that they would continue to support me (mainly financially) no matter what I do.

will they adopt me? I need some support.

Leroy


..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio...

[Mikki_ZH 0]

My parents are not so happy that I started to BASE jump. Every time I speak with my mother she tells me not to do any jumps.
My brothers and friends think that I'm a psycho to do BASE Jumping and they also tell me I should not do it.

My wife witnessed a horrible accident the first time she saw BASE jumping in live. She also does not like it but she already knew she can not change me when she married me... so she lets me jump...

Michi (#1068)
hsbc/gba/sba
www.swissbaseassociation.ch
www.michibase.ch

[Tyrion 0]

When I first told my parents I was interested in doing BASE, I'm sure they thought it was just a phase I was going through and it would fade. Though over the months they've seen me get more and more excited about it, seen me saving up money for the courses and gear and everything I need to get on my way, go to BASE meets and incessantly watching videos and consuming anything to do with BASE i can get my hands on, they understand it's a little more serious!

My dad was a hang-glider for many years before he met my mother, then he settled into family life and sold it. When I get him to sit with me now and watch BASE DVD's and videos he mainly says, "I wish I could do that" but after injuries, and family and all that he wouldn't. They both ask me to be careful and make sure I do everything I possibly can to make it as safe as possible.

In short, they're not entirely pleased, but they love me in whatever I do, and they're always on the look-out for news about BASE (fatalities/accidents especially lol, trying to talk me out of it!) or anything that could make me safer!

[321Cya 0]

In an early stage of my skydiving career I took my parents out to the DZ and they saw it was no bunch of 'luni's', but actually quite organized and professional, so they took it all very well. At some point my dad even did a tandem in France on a summer holiday. Then, a few years into it, they were visiting me while I was staying in Florida for a while and then I had my first and only accident (swooping the terrace, ending up in a bench ) right in front of their eyes. This is something you don't want to happen! Anyway, eversince my mum is freaked out about it!

Later on I started BASE jumping and I never made a secret of it. Now my mum has sleepsless nights and doesn't want to hear about it, nor see it.

My dad says the same (but I know he likes it, he simply can't say that in front of my mum...). He proudly says to his friends what I do and even asks me to show his friends my videos.

Whatever the reaction might be, I think it's best to be honest no matter what. They might even be more hurt when they find out when it's too late.

They ARE your parents!

Joris.

www.vandrunen.ch

[TVPB 0]

My parents are awesome. I love them to death.

They have shown very conflicting reactions to all my activities, let alone jumping.

When I started skydiving, they were freaked out. I set up a skydiving club at university to help fund my initial training. I received a lot of phone calls at home r.e. AFF training. That is how they found out I was going to do it. "Why are all these people calling about jumping?. I don't know mum. Wrong number I guess!" I also got my older brother to do the first jump course with me. They finally figured out I was really going to jump, but they did not know when. So I brought the video home and showed them. They bruised the bottom of their jaws. For a long time since then I'd tell them that I am going jumping for the weekend and they would not talk to me for a few days. They were usully OK with it from Tues to Thurs. And then the stress cycle continued from Fri to Mon.

I organised a few 8 way demo jumps onto their property. That was the first (and I think only) time they saw me physically jump.

Then I started BASE jumping. They had no idea what it was until I showed them video's and explained what the fuss was all about. Suddenly, skydiving was OK. They had something bigger and better to worry about.
The contradictions have been interesting. My folks gave me the money for my first skydiving rig. It was at the start of a big slump in the real estate market and a formely wealthy entrepreneur had to sell his brand new rig to help pay his rent. I had no money because I was a lowly univ student and my parents footed the bill. They proposed this, not me. They did feel concerned that if anything happened to me, they would feel responsible for contributing to my death. But long conversations and explanations on why accidents happened, and the realities of the sport comforted them a little. They also hada habit of always asking me when I was going to quit. "That's a lovely jump you've made, great trip overseas son. . . . Don't you think its time to focus on something else now?" - a subtle form of begging.

One day my parents had a large group of friends over for dinner. I had been out jumping all day and had to drop by to pick up some gear whilst on the way to another site. I overheard mum talking to the visitors about her son (me) and the exciting adventurous life that he led, and how proud she was.

The crowd did not sound convinced. A friend (DW) waited in the dining area whilst I went to get my gear. One of the guests asked him why he did such a crazy sport? He replied that he didn't really want to do all the crazy jumps but that Tom (me) made him do it. I saw the crowd literally give a nod of understanding and felt their sympathy towards him. How ironic huh? When I walked back into the room I felt their stares of the crowd and I saw the cheeky smile of DW. He got me!

Then people that my parents had met started going in, I got married, and then had two kids. These factors have really stressed them over the last few years. They have even been trying to get my wife to convinve me to stop. But alas, to no avail. They are somewhat resigned to that fact.

I don't see myself stopping, even if I have slowed down a fair bit.

I think it is really important to have the conversations with your family and friends. Tone it down a little but do not hide the fact that both injury or death are possibilities. Explain the physics of what is going on. If they ask about accidents, explaing the root causes and what you are doing to make sure that you wont suffer that same consequence.

In your decision making regarding to jump or not, perhaps you should allow for how the people that love you would react if you went in. Don't do things that are far too risky. Balance your desire for progression and excitement with a little training and safety consciousness.

Stay Safe
Have Fun
Good Luck

Tom

Stay Safe - Have Fun - Good Luck

The above could be crap, thought provoking, useful, or . . But not personal. You decide.

[wwarped 0]

I played the BD04 DVD during my parents' last visit.

surprising reaction. my mother called it exciting. I also had to pause the DVD when I stepped onto the platform. they wanted to be called back into the room...

[hollyhjb 0]

I know I'm bringing up something a little older, but I just had the most unexpected response from my father.

When I called him today and told him about my first base jump, his reply was, "Why didn't you wait for me to get home this evening so I could watch?"

...and to think, I was scared to tell him about my first jump (which was a hand held three second delay...btw)

"I reject your reality and substitute my own" ~Adam Savage

[cesslon 0]

HI,

2 questions.
1. are your details correct, that you have had 40 odd skydives ?
2. what kinda object was your jump from ?

[hollyhjb 0]

Yes, 42 skydives.

My local, legal S.

edit to add: sorry Jaap, but your paper crane is now floating down the Snake River.

"I reject your reality and substitute my own" ~Adam Savage

[leroydb 0]

http://spaces.msn.com/members/hollyhjb/Blog/cns!1pwsCsVap1DX-OhApYj9E6Sg!205.entry

... at least it was a round into the water...

not reccomending this... even if you did eat your wheaty's for breakfast...

I do think there alot of first death courses going on out there (FDC) that might be prob should not be going on.

I feel they could possibly risk the bridge...

Leroy


..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio...

[Skinflicka 0]

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Yes, 42 skydives.

My local, legal S.

edit to add: sorry Jaap, but your paper crane is now floating down the Snake River.

Holly...I don't know you...I know something about you in regards to your BASE jumping potential. Let me describe...

You just posted to the BASE community that one of the country's most trusted and competant mentors was willing to put you off a legal object (risking it's status as such if something had gone wrong) with a number of skydives which is considerably less than the general feeling of the community accepts by quite a margin. I know that the argument for a minimum number of guydives is flawed but in general, if some is good...more is better. You made this post knowing that;

A) The ramifications for your mentor could mean a drastic loss of credibility. This would be a huge blow for the reputation of US BASE jumping.

B) Your mentor wouldn't care so why should you.

I doubt it's B).

So let me tell you what I think know about you...

You make poor and flippant judgement calls...and, in this instance, a very public one.

Poor judgement will kill you.

Be smart. Stay alive.

Disappointed,

$kin.

Prizes to anyone who gets to read my posts before Mr Aiello's son, Tom deletes them.

[RhondaLea 3]

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You just posted to the BASE community that one of the country's most trusted and competant mentors was willing to put you off a legal object (risking it's status as such if something had gone wrong) with a number of skydives which is considerably less than the general feeling of the community accepts by quite a margin.

It's an artificial, random number picked out of the air, and it has led to the entry into base of people who shouldn't be jumping at all and who would never have been allowed in but for having the requisite number of jumps and sufficient dollars in the bank account.

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I know that the argument for a minimum number of guydives is flawed but in general, if some is good...more is better.

Who was it who only recently made fun of me for generalizing? (And that's a really interesting typo you have there.)

Go to Bridge Day just one year and watch how many several-thousand-jump wonders have crap exits, crap openings and crap landings. In '98, I think it was, one of my friends--a guy with 3000 skydives and one each of all possible ratings--managed to embarrass himself to death (and very nearly kill himself) making his first bridge jump. He was neither unusual nor in a minority.

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You make poor and flippant judgement calls...and, in this instance, a very public one.

Poor judgement will kill you.

She was judged and found not wanting by someone who has known her a lot longer than you have and who has sufficient information to determine she was ready. Furthermore, as evidenced by her post, she's not dead.

Your turn.

rl

P.S. Apparently the assumption of who judged her ready is erroneous, but I don't think it makes a difference to either argument.

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[Skinflicka 0]

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I know that the argument for a minimum number of guydives is flawed but in general, if some is good...more is better.

Who was it who only recently made fun of me for generalizing?

Where training and preparation are an advantage to the execution of an activity then as a generalization my statement bares pretty close scrutiny.

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Go to Bridge Day just one year and watch how many several-thousand-jump wonders have crap exits, crap openings and crap landings. In '98, I think it was, one of my friends--a guy with 3000 skydives and one each of all possible ratings--managed to embarrass himself to death (and very nearly kill himself) making his first bridge jump. He was neither unusual nor in a minority.

I'm sure you realize that this is not a robust arguement for the defense, Counselor. You describe an error in spite of extensive experience not because of it. It just highlights that as far as jump numbers and good BASE preparation are concerned that sticking a feather in your a$$ does not make you a chicken.

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She was judged and found not wanting by someone who has known her a lot longer than you have and who has sufficient information to determine she was ready. Furthermore, as evidenced by her post, she's not dead.

Perhaps...but my assertion is not necessarily that the requisite ability was missing but that the requisite judgement has been found lacking as evidenced by the chest beating declarations such as "I only have a handful of skydives and I've still done a BASE jump...Nah nah na nar nar."

In a forum full of newbies eager to throw themselves to the dogs, the difference between acting as a role model and not can be the difference between an inexperienced jumper landing safely and that same jumper needing a closed casket.

I know I'm hypocritical...that's just me...so posting a bunch of my old quotes as evidence of me acting contrary to the statement made above will be judged as entirely boring. I know, I had (still have) very few skydives when I began. That doesn't make me a success story. That makes me an exception that proves the rule...as usual...a shining bad example.

$kin.

Prizes to anyone who gets to read my posts before Mr Aiello's son, Tom deletes them.

[cesslon 0]

Hi Holly
I wasn't meaning to kick the bee's nest by my questions, was just asking out of curiosity,

I don't BASE but like to learn as much as possible about it without being able to do it.

few more questions, you originally said you took a hand held 3 second delay, how high was the bridge ?

1 question for the other BASE jumpers here, having not seen any first time jumps in person but having seen..... a few on video I'm wondering why some first time jumps are static lines and some multiple second delays ?

is it that the beginner jumps I see on tape are from aussie land where objects are usually quite low (bridges below 200 feet), so low skilled jumpers shouldnt free fall them or is it different teaching techniques of different mentors ?

thanks

[base515 0]

When my mom found out about my BASEjumping....
She cut me off completetly from having sex with her.....

Good thing BASE704's sister was there to take up the slack(all 8.124 inches of it)(including the 6.124inch extension)

May we live long and die out

[op5e 0]

Cesslon, The height of the span has been posted a fair bit here. Since you have been here a while I would suggest you find that answer youself. You might learn a little while doing this. Different objects require different execution. FYI I do not BASE jump yet, but you should already know that by now.

[RhondaLea 3]

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Where training and preparation are an advantage to the execution of an activity then as a generalization my statement bares pretty close scrutiny.

You spelled "bears" wrong.

We can discuss why your generalizations are good and mine are not another time.

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Perhaps...but my assertion is not necessarily that the requisite ability was missing but that the requisite judgement has been found lacking as evidenced by the chest beating declarations such as "I only have a handful of skydives and I've still done a BASE jump...Nah nah na nar nar."

But that's not what she did. She was talking about her father's reaction. She made an on-topic post in the correct thread for her comment, and someone asked her about the number of jumps she has, thus taking us off on a different track altogether, which will probably force Tom to either delete all the comments or split off the thread.

I had six fewer jumps than she does, and the decision about my readiness was made by someone older, wiser and more experienced than most of those who post in this forum. The "minimum number of skydives" threshold is a relatively new invention, based more, I think, on the recent influx of...I don't know what to call them...into what was once a microscopic fringe group of total loonies who, as babies, apparently never got tossed into the air quite enough by mum and dad.

The evolution of base parallels that of skydiving in all its aspects. Ask someone like Skratch or Bob Sinclair if they haven't seen all of this before. Example: lo those many years ago, you couldn't jump a square unless you had at least 200 jumps. Ask C-550 or D-346 how things went when they couldn't let go of that idea. It is a force of nature that "youth is truth" and the new blood will always improve on the ideas of the fogeys who preceded them--even if the attrition rate during transition is high.

You're trying to hold back the tide, but that too is the nature of the aged, who think themselves wiser because they have seen it all.

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I'm sure you realize that this is not a robust arguement for the defense, Counselor. You describe an error in spite of extensive experience not because of it. It just highlights that as far as jump numbers and good BASE preparation are concerned that sticking a feather in your a$$ does not make you a chicken.

I'm pretty sure I realize that skydivers with a lot of experience have much to unlearn before they can base jump without making fools of themselves (at best). On the other hand, canopy skills are a valuable survival tool, so a static line course and a bunch of low altitude jumps as preparation would get my vote as worthwhile.

Do I really look like a fish to you?

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I know I'm hypocritical...that's just me...so posting a bunch of my old quotes as evidence of me acting contrary to the statement made above will be judged as entirely boring.

Contradictory, but not hypocritical, as evidenced by your post in reply to mine in the poll about splitting this forum. This is not where the wise come to learn the "right way" to base jump, eh?

But I would never make the mistake of confusing what you write with what you really think.

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I know, I had (still have) very few skydives when I began. That doesn't make me a success story.

Continuing to breathe is the ultimate gauge of success, whether one attributes it to luck or skill.

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as usual...a shining bad example.

No argument there.

rl

P.S. Congratulations, Holly.

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[vandev 0]

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which was a hand held three second delay...btw)

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Yes, 42 skydives...

Holly, congradulations for your first jump....and on another level...very bad judgment on the route you choose... I am not there nor do i know the details but from your experiance...42 skydives and your first jump a handheld...i would agree you took a FDC. Sorry but that was not a wise choice. It was a bad one....

Fact is you have zero base canopy experience..

I hope that you are a incredible swimmer as if you got tangled in your lines you could of drowned..

You ...of all people new Tom A. ..which i know told you there is no hurry and did it anyway.....Thats age that can kill you... "Listen to wisdom"

for 42 skydives you still cant understand whats going on or what can happen...Its callled begginners overdrive that tunnels you in to a false sense of security. "its called not listening"

I have seen a guy with over seven thousand skydives almost die on his first skysurf jump.......

You have never had to deal with a cutaway , which is stress situation no matter how calm you are...

i would think that opening time on a base jump is a stress situation. So you flunked there...

You really broke the rules...." That being ..."do not rush in to something that cannot be rushed"...

You have not seen what happens when all goes terroribly wrong...i mean right in front of you.....

I have ..and it's nothing pretty.... when you have pieces of someone all over in front of you and you where just sitting with them 20 minutes before...

Sorry for being hard on you but i only hope to scare you into thinking about what you did..

I hope you stop to rethink and change the path you are taking..

You are 18 years old with a whole life ahead of you....dont rush in and cut it short. You are playing with something that is not a toy and completly unforgiving...

"you are playing with fire and you are covered in gasoline"

I want to jump Norway as much as anybody but the more i listen to experienced base jumpers the more i slow down my thinking . When a guy with 700 base jumps tells you that a Jump off exit 6 in a wingsuit scared the living shit out of him...i think thats something you need to take to heart.

I hope Tom A. comes over to see you and give you the chewing out you need... I am a bit surprised you choose this path being surrounded by the people you are...

I hope you take this as constructive advise form someone who has seen and experienced little more than than you have...

Stay safe and rethink what you are doing.....

All the best , Chris

In the end...the universe has a way of working itself out.... "Harold and Kumar go to White Castle"