I heard that they still have problems with the coloured sail material I met three gays on the Spanish open and they all wait now nearly one year but if you want an all white its about 2 month
I heard that they still have problems with the coloured sail material I met three gays on the Spanish open and they all wait now nearly one year but if you want an all white its about 2 month
Yeah.. Gays can be picky when it comes to choosing the right color
(This post was edited by BMFin on May 22, 2008, 2:53 PM)
I heard that they still have problems with the coloured sail material I met three gays on the Spanish open and they all wait now nearly one year but if you want an all white its about 2 month
Yeah.. Gays can be picky when it comes to choosing the right color
I heard that they still have problems with the coloured sail material I met three gays on the Spanish open and they all wait now nearly one year but if you want an all white its about 2 month
That sounds like discrimination of sexual minorities, Slaton makes gays wait longer for their canopies:)))))))))))))) might be a huge scandal in press:))))
I'm starting to wonder that... if they exist... i ordered my canopy in dec... i changed my colors to all white... and i'm still waiting... and after paying the deposit... I have not got any e-mails from Daedelas... I should have got a Velo...
They white is no good either. It will be taking so long because of all the people waiting in line to get a sail canopy when they is still don't have any material to make them with.
If you don't wanting to wait for them to find some sail material that lasts then buy a zp one. ZP is awsome, velocity's use zp and still win most comps ;)
Just out of curiosity, what exactly is the problem with the sail material? I remember hearing last year some people were having trouble with white. I hadn't heard there was a problem with the other colors.
I have an allred sail cloth JVX and I haven't noticed anything, but I admit I haven't really looked.
Reports are that the material begins to flake and crack after a couple hundred jumps. Apparently this has something to do with the material not really being designed to withstand opening shock, packing, crunching up in a bag, etc over and over again.
I too had heard it was a problem with specific colors, but I'm not sure since there's no official acknowledgement from Daedalus on the issue.
I think a Daedalus rep could best answer the question though.
Blues, Ian
(This post was edited by ianmdrennan on Jun 8, 2008, 7:44 PM)
I was the first one who saw that issue and raised some stink about it. That was last year, after about 150 jumps on my new JVX (well, practically new - less then ten jumps). Certain high friction areas, like the tail/label section and bridal attachment area, started to deteriorate to the point of being able to see the threads of the fabric and being able to suck air through it like it was a cotton t-shirt... Mark S. and Ian and other guys saw it at the Farm last year.
After I posted about it on Jim Slaton's site, he asked me to send the canopy for inspection to him. I did. After some time i saw his reply on the forum that he saw no issues with the canopy and that it was a user error, or something like that. Surprised, I had to call him to see what the hell was up. He obviously didnt even look at the canopy. During the conversation he gave me an excuse that the canopy was made inside out, with the sail coating being on the outside. That made no sense for several reasons. AFAIK, there is no "side" of coating - the sail and ZP fabric is created through heat roller treatment and there are no "coated sides". And even if there were - whats the difference where it's facing - inside or out? So it would peel on the inside?. Anyway. A bit later the reason for this defect became a bad batch of material. And the thread about it disappeared from the forum...
I also talked to other sponsored JVX pilots and actually looked at the Team X canopies a couple of months later at the Nats last year... they all said the same thing... after 400-500 jumps their sail canopies were becoming very porous. Not as bad as mine, but still ...
It was becoming clear to me that the promotion claims of sail canopies with thousands of jumps having less porosity then a brand new ZP wing were slightly exaggerated.
I requested that Icarus NZ made me a free replacement - a ZP JVX, which they did. Now I am very happy with a ZP JVX - it is definitely a great wing. But I would not recommend a sail JVX to anyone, even with all of its great flight characteristics.
In Reply To
I think a Daedalus rep could best answer the question though.
Somehow, I think The Rep is the LAST person you should listen to
Pleas note: what i said above was based on personal experience only. Your results may vary.
(This post was edited by frost on Jun 9, 2008, 7:01 AM)
Key areas to keep your eye on is the ones that have the most friction - inspect carefully the whole middle section from bridal attachment point to tail (top and bottom). First sign was the fabric started to feel odd, microfiber or silk like... not sure how to describe it best. The old suction test worked best.
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was your canopy exposed a lot of sand, dust and water?
nope, none.
I really think it's due to the nature of sail material itself - it just doesnt react too well to openings, folding, packing... But i could be wrong. I hope i am.
Well, you got me all freaked out. My JVX is right at 500 jumps. I just finished looking over the top and bottom skin and to the best of my ability I can't find anything wrong. Nothing that looks like a coating flaking off, and I tried blowing/sucking air through at least one spot on both the top and bottom skin on each cell, including several spots between the tail and bridle attachment points. Nothing (maybe I just don't suck hard enough).
As far as the appearance, I do notice that the threads that make the ripstop pattern are 'shiny'. Can't remember if it looked that way new or not.
I can say that the canopy still seems to open and fly correctly, but a) I'm not a good enough pilot to max the canopy out and b) this change probably occurs slowly enough you wouldn't notice anyway.
I'd sure like to get a look at some fabric in this deteriorated condition, so I know what to look for.
Just out of curiosity, is your ZP JVX the same size as that Hybrid (87?) How does it fly, comparitively speaking? I like this all sail model but if the ZP flies just as nice it would be tempting to go ZP for easier packing...
CJ, i am glad that your sail JVX is problem free! Lets hope it stays that way. Keep an eye on it.
I am reluctant to compare these two though, as i hadnt had a chance to really dial the 87 in... and I am just starting to get the feel for the 92. But if i had to say - i think if there was a difference in performance for ZP vs Sail it was negligible, at least for me. Flight characteristics seemed the same. I'd say sail holds a higher wing loading better, so you can get more speed with all resulting benefits - lift, distance, etc. On the 92 (ZP) I am @ 2.6. I was @ 2.8 on your 87 (sidenote for others reading this: it was a one of a kind hybrid - top and bottom sail) and it still flew great. But even if we disregard all the sail issues, I'd still choose ZP. I'd rather have a small rig and easier pack jobs then a marginally better performance on a sail JVX
(This post was edited by frost on Jun 9, 2008, 7:36 PM)
Does deadelus actually test any of their stuff? i mean wouldn't this issue of material deteriation come up in testing? or do they just say "hey it flies better so lets put it out there"? this is pretty concerning stuff to just have your parachute fall apart after 400-500 jumps.
I met three gays on the Spanish open and they all wait now nearly one year 
but if you want an all white its about 2 month 
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