Forums: Skydiving: Safety and Training:
stupidest student ever?

 

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Fab  (C License)

Sep 21, 2003, 12:57 PM
Post #151 of 309 (4746 views)
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Re: [cesslon] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

"and like some1 said surely any1 without any experience would try and steer out of the way of powerlines"

appearantly not true...some students/people just react differently to fear by doing absolutely nothing and just freeze. He clearly panicked and wasn't thinking rational anymore.

I have a question.

Do AFF jm's ever pull the reserve for a student. For instance mr. Lutz. JM sees he pulls his cutaway. Should he pull his reserve too or is that always the responsibily of the student. I say its the responsibilty of the student and the JM should leave it alone.

What should the Jm have done if he saw the Lutz-guy pulling his cutaway. I don't think JM saw him do that but what if he did...Opening his main chute wouldn;t make sense anymore..

pro...student can deploy reserve in a head high position which is better then belly to earth.

con...student may not pull at all and can only be saved if his cypres works..


phonics1981  (A License)

Sep 21, 2003, 2:01 PM
Post #152 of 309 (4726 views)
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Re: [Fab] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
"
pro...student can deploy reserve in a head high position which is better then belly to earth

Maybe im misunderstanding but how would it be better to pull your reserve "head High" rather than belly to earth??


themitchyone  (A 45471)

Sep 21, 2003, 2:05 PM
Post #153 of 309 (4724 views)
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Re: [riggerrob] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Reminds me of the time Brenda Reid listed herself as "an african-american female" on some government paperwork.
Perfectly accurate and legal, but it does not match the stereotype, seeing as how Brenda is a white South African of British descent.
Not a black gene in her entire body!

It seems that is the very point, though. She was correct. African-American technically would imply that someone came from Africa, not necessarily that they are black. A black person might have come from another part of the world, so naming all black Americans AA wasn't right to begin with, neither is Native American for American Indians because anyone born in the US is a Native American.


phonics1981  (A License)

Sep 21, 2003, 2:07 PM
Post #154 of 309 (4720 views)
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Re: [themitchyone] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:

It seems that is the very point, though. She was correct. African-American technically would imply that someone came from Africa, not necessarily that they are black. A black person might have come from another part of the world, so naming all black Americans AA wasn't right to begin with, neither is Native American for American Indians because anyone born in the US is a Native American.

Some politically correct terms arent THAT correct are they?!


Fab  (C License)

Sep 21, 2003, 3:01 PM
Post #155 of 309 (4710 views)
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Re: [phonics1981] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

[reply

Maybe im misunderstanding but how would it be better to pull your reserve "head High" rather than belly to earth??
euh..do'nt take my word for it..I'm a newbie. It was my understanding that if you're in a belly to earth a pilot chute/spring could bounce back and stay in your burble. It seems to me when this happens with a reserve at a low altitude you will not be too happy...

I was taught as aff-student to put your feet up to your ass before you cut-away and pull reserve. Therefor you go from horizontal to a little vertical right? PIlotchute gets cleaner stream of air thus better deployment?

Correct me if I"m wrong please...


phonics1981  (A License)

Sep 21, 2003, 3:05 PM
Post #156 of 309 (4708 views)
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Re: [Fab] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
euh..do'nt take my word for it..I'm a newbie. It was my understanding that if you're in a belly to earth a pilot chute/spring could bounce back and stay in your burble. It seems to me when this happens with a reserve at a low altitude you will not be too happy...

I was taught as aff-student to put your feet up to your ass before you cut-away and pull reserve. Therefor you go from horizontal to a little vertical right? PIlotchute gets cleaner stream of air thus better deployment?

Correct me if I"m wrong please...

Yeah I see your point. I was picturing the skydiver going stand up while deploying. But me personally would hope to be flat on deployment of anything. I ALWAYS twist my body slightly on opening to get some air into the potential burble.


bch7773  (C License)

Sep 21, 2003, 7:08 PM
Post #157 of 309 (4672 views)
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Re: [Fab] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:

Do AFF jm's ever pull the reserve for a student. For instance mr. Lutz. JM sees he pulls his cutaway. Should he pull his reserve too or is that always the responsibily of the student. I say its the responsibilty of the student and the JM should leave it alone.

What should the Jm have done if he saw
the Lutz-guy pulling his cutaway. I don't think JM saw him do that but what if he did...Opening his main chute wouldn;t make sense anymore..


I was not trained on AFF, but I do know that there is a reserve side JM. Its his job to pull the reserve if something is wrong is the main. I believe that the reason he isn't chasing after this student is because his job is over once he sees the main start to deploy, which it did.

Also, the main side JM did the correct thing by pulling the handle, even if he saw the student pull the cutaway, so that the students RSL should have pulled the reserve. I think perhaps the students rig didn't have an RSL, or it didn't work.


Fab  (C License)

Sep 21, 2003, 10:20 PM
Post #158 of 309 (4653 views)
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Re: [bch7773] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

I think the reason that reserve jm not chased the student that it's dangerous for both JM to track to the student..Not that the task of the reserve(?)/second JM is over.

SO whats your saying if main didn't deploy after being pulled and stays in rig...second jm pulls the reserve? I Don't think so...What about the cutaway pillow then..???


darkwing  (D 4164)

Sep 22, 2003, 7:05 AM
Post #159 of 309 (4602 views)
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Re: [tattoojeff] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

It would be good to sanitize some of these stories and share them with students. Each of the stories is in some sense an example of a training error, and should be a heads up to instructors.


phonics1981  (A License)

Sep 22, 2003, 8:05 AM
Post #160 of 309 (4577 views)
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Re: [darkwing] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
It would be good to sanitize some of these stories and share them with students. Each of the stories is in some sense an example of a training error, and should be a heads up to instructors.

I doubt very much that that nugget Lutz was trained (in error) to pull his cutaway rather than his main and to wrestle to JM who was trying to guide his hand to the ripcord. Thats pure stupidity.


schattenjaeger

Sep 22, 2003, 1:35 PM
Post #161 of 309 (4506 views)
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Re: [Fab] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

I wonder if the reserve JM even knew what the devil was going on. For all he knows Lutz pulled his parachute, and all of a sudden he gets yanked outta his arms and the main side JM seems quite perturbed for some reason. And like someone else said, if they both went after him, they risked a collision(2 people going reallllly fast aiming for the same target, remember?)and the main JM, knowing what was happening, had the head start.


JDBoston  (D 26450)

Sep 22, 2003, 7:43 PM
Post #162 of 309 (4453 views)
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Re: [phonics1981] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

IMHO, it's usually a better idea to get the pilot chute OUT of your burble than it is to do something that's almost guaranteed to give you line twists on a non-student wing-loading.

I would try not to make a habit of that twisting thing (without knowing the exact movement you're describing, of course) - you generally want to be as symmetrical as possible right after you deploy.

Thoughts from others?

Joe


phonics1981  (A License)

Sep 22, 2003, 11:06 PM
Post #163 of 309 (4434 views)
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Re: [JDBoston] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
IMHO, it's usually a better idea to get the pilot chute OUT of your burble than it is to do something that's almost guaranteed to give you line twists on a non-student wing-loading.

I would try not to make a habit of that twisting thing (without knowing the exact movement you're describing, of course) - you generally want to be as symmetrical as possible right after you deploy.

Thoughts from others?

Joe

Sorry, I worded it wrong (i'm doing that alot lately!). When I say 'Twist' I mean looking over my shoulder, which i woude say twists my body a bit?


McG  (D 714)

Sep 23, 2003, 2:07 AM
Post #164 of 309 (4418 views)
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Re: [tattoojeff] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

In early 90s i had a student that had some really weird ideas...

We just had got rid of the old Para-Commanders and other round canopies, so we were really proud of our new square Mantas and Raiders. -Then that dumb student suggested that the sharp corners of the canopies could be more round... He claimed they might be easier to handle then!

Later on when he tried the stall and got freaked out, he came with another even more stupid idea: There should be some covers on the tunnels, like air-locks which prevent the air running out of the canopy, so it wouldnt stall that easy!

The best is yet to come: The same jackass suggested that landing could be more fun if jumpers had inline skates and they landed on the runway!

Oh my, oh my... You can guess we experienced jumpers laughed our asses off...SlySlySly

****


cesslon  (Student)

Sep 23, 2003, 4:06 AM
Post #165 of 309 (4395 views)
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Re: [McG] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

im very new to this skydiving
long time fan bout to become a jumper im booked in for october 11th to start my aff course , anyway

Quote:
suggested that landing could be more fun if jumpers had inline skates and they landed on the runway!

whats wrong with his idea ?
apart from you would probably have to be very experienced and could run into a plane lol ?


TrickyDicky  (C 103196)

Sep 23, 2003, 4:42 AM
Post #166 of 309 (4382 views)
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Re: [McG] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

I dont think its that silly. A few weeks abo we were discussing wingsuits and one guy reconed within 5 years someone will land a wingsuit. We discussed (not really seriously) about building a creeper into the front of the suit. Though how you'd break is another matter.


(This post was edited by TrickyDicky on Sep 23, 2003, 4:42 AM)


bshl  (B 28944)

Sep 30, 2003, 10:25 PM
Post #167 of 309 (4290 views)
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Re: [bodypilot90] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

This is, most assuredly, a set of golf clubs. What a hoot!


bodypilot90  (D 24249)

Oct 1, 2003, 12:07 PM
Post #168 of 309 (4213 views)
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Re: [bshl] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

his story got better with each show he was on. He also came back wanted to try again the next day. What would you do if it was your dz?


WrongWay  (D 27371)

Oct 1, 2003, 12:47 PM
Post #169 of 309 (4195 views)
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Re: [McG] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

I could probably qualify for this award, that is, if I liked golf.

Few years ago, back in my student days, I went through my ground school after doing my 4 tandems. During this time, we did practice stuff on the ground with throwout pc's, naturally. When I did my tandems, I had a ripcord. Big difference between the two. Well, we got in the air, the dive couldn't have gone better (really it was great, i have video) until pull time. I grab my pilot chute, and for some stupid reason, think "ripcord". That's right kids, I held onto my pilot chute. No shit, there I was, thought I was gonna die, with nothing above my head, thinking I had a total mal. I let go of the "ripcord" to go for my cutaway and POOF, canopy. Cool Needless to say, I was the ass of more than a few jokes on the ground, and I always tell new students now "Trust me, you could have done dumber things." I still watch the video sometimes just to have a good laugh. It's in slow-mo at that point, hahaha!!!!


phonics1981  (A License)

Oct 1, 2003, 2:18 PM
Post #170 of 309 (4154 views)
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Re: [WrongWay] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I could probably qualify for this award, that is, if I liked golf.

Few years ago, back in my student days, I went through my ground school after doing my 4 tandems. During this time, we did practice stuff on the ground with throwout pc's, naturally. When I did my tandems, I had a ripcord. Big difference between the two. Well, we got in the air, the dive couldn't have gone better (really it was great, i have video) until pull time. I grab my pilot chute, and for some stupid reason, think "ripcord". That's right kids, I held onto my pilot chute. No shit, there I was, thought I was gonna die, with nothing above my head, thinking I had a total mal. I let go of the "ripcord" to go for my cutaway and POOF, canopy. Cool Needless to say, I was the ass of more than a few jokes on the ground, and I always tell new students now "Trust me, you could have done dumber things." I still watch the video sometimes just to have a good laugh. It's in slow-mo at that point, hahaha!!!!

Post it!!!


WrongWay  (D 27371)

Oct 2, 2003, 4:37 AM
Post #171 of 309 (4071 views)
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Re: [phonics1981] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm at work now, but I'll post the video here within a few days. It's funny as hell, worth watching!!! Cool


Bolas  (D License)

Oct 2, 2003, 12:23 PM
Post #172 of 309 (3987 views)
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Re: [WrongWay] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

I did that too!!! Tongue My first jump was ripcord (which of course I let go of) and all others were PC. On jump 5? I deployed my Pilot chute and didn't let go. When I had nothing above me I did the look over the shoulder thing. Was getting ready to pull the silver when I realized I had something in my right hand. I let go and had a normal opening.
On the ground my AFF instructor made me put out my hand and she smacked it and said "Don't ever do that again, you scared the shit out of me."

If it's true what they say that the worst students make the best instructors, I'll be the God of instructors once I get my ratings.


jlmiracle  (D License)

Oct 2, 2003, 12:54 PM
Post #173 of 309 (3972 views)
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Re: [tattoojeff] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

Earlier this year we had an AFF Class of about 3 students. Jumped one, even though his average fall rate was 128 he did well in freefall and under canopy.

The next 2 go, one lands fine the other never unstows his brakes until about 1000 ft even though he can hear the radio and is now waaaaaay downwind at this point and holding. He lands off the dropzone in a tree ONLY because he said he COULDN'T make it to the power lines. WTF. I didn't teach the class so I talked to the other 2 students to make sure that obstacles were covered and they knew not to land in the power lines or trees so the other guy must have been asleep.

Judy


lawrocket  (Student)

Oct 11, 2003, 12:19 PM
Post #174 of 309 (3854 views)
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Re: [phonics1981] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

I just saw the lutz video for the first time. Oh, sweet Jesus!!!


dmitch31  (Student)

Dec 19, 2003, 4:48 PM
Post #175 of 309 (3630 views)
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Re: [The111] stupidest student ever? [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
Maybe a super-Lutz could even screw that situation up though, like maybe disconnect the leg and chest straps and fall out of the harness, because he thought they were deployment handles.

Oh my gosh, you are slayin' me man! Definitely ROFL!!! What I wanna know is, How did this guy get through law school. I mean REALLY???!?


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