Forums: Skydiving: Safety and Training:
2 questions from a 2-jump newbie



Sep 13, 2003, 12:27 AM
Post #1 of 7 (771 views)
2 questions from a 2-jump newbie Can't Post

I'm doing my AFF level 3 on Thursday, and can anyone give me any tips for exiting the plane stable? (we use a Cessna C208 caravan, with the door on the side, we're taught to put one hand inside the door, one outside, put our feet next to the edge and parralel to it, etc. and just to step out and arch, to put it in a nutshell)On my both my previous jumps I de-arched, flailed my legs a bit, and corrected it before I went over onto my back, and finished the dive fine. Anyways, I'd much rather not exit unstable again:) I THINK my problem is both times I looked down right as I left, and probably fixated on the ground, and now that I think about it, looking at the ground horizontally is fine, but arching while stepping out of the plane with your head down like that is nearly impossible! Does that sound right? And of course I'll address this issue with my JM on Thursday, but I'd like more input beforehand as well

2nd question- I know I need to get all these done within 30 days of each other to avoid reccurency training charges and whatnot(funds being a bit o' an issue for me)but do you guys still jump when it starts to get cold? Thanks!


Sep 13, 2003, 2:36 AM
Post #2 of 7 (754 views)
Re: [schattenjaeger] 2 questions from a 2-jump newbie [In reply to] Can't Post

Well, the basic idea for a stable exit is to move along the same direction as the plane does.
This is because at the door, the relative wind comes from the front of the plane because of its' speed. As your foward throw bleeds off and gravity pull builds up, your flight path describes a parabel bending from horizontal to vertical, yet the relative wind always seems to come from the same direction.
So you should get a stable exit by simply sepping out of the plane sideways, arching like the bracket (if the prop is left) --> (
You can do it either head up or head down, doesnt matter, but head up is more comfortable, and you can look at the plane...Cool
Ask your JM if he'll let you make a simple side<stepping exit instead of a dive exit.
I've been jumping at a DZ with a Caravan for a year, and they too told the students to dive, i still can't see a reason for that, as a simple sidestep, headup exit is MUCH easier imho.
Well, ask your DZ if they operate in winter... If they operate, get GLOVES and enough warm clothing...Wink

metalslug  (B 2528)

Sep 13, 2003, 5:49 AM
Post #3 of 7 (735 views)
Re: [schattenjaeger] 2 questions from a 2-jump newbie [In reply to] Can't Post

 I'm a little puzzled by this question. I guess AFF programs are a little different in other countries but I had 2 AFF jumpmasters holding on to me on exit at levels 1-3.
I did go slightly head-down on these 3 exits for a few seconds but my JM's leveled me out easily without me having to correct body position.
I was given the "leg's out" signal on my first COA but I was already 'stable' by then.. their excellent stability seemed to compensate well for my lack of stability on those early jumps.
With those two holding on to me, I dont think I could have ended up on my back no matter what I did.
Are your instructor(s) not holding on to you on exit at Levels 2 or 3 ?

As for cold weather.. I waited for spring before starting. Many instructors and jumpers may tell you that your adrenaline will help you ignore the cold air. I dont agree though, I felt like an icecube on at least one jump, my fingers hurt a bit too. At DZs in my country, students may not wear gloves. Check with your instructors about gloves and student gear restrictions before starting in the cold.

...and be safe, have fun! Wink

nightjumps  (D 23385)

Sep 13, 2003, 6:05 AM
Post #4 of 7 (730 views)
Re: [schattenjaeger] 2 questions from a 2-jump newbie [In reply to] Can't Post

Question 1 - "I'll address this issue with my JM on Thursday..." That's absolutely the best answer.

Question 2 - I do a lot of Hop-N-Pops in the winter to 1) keep current, 2) have a change of environment, 3) feel the cold. Personally, I find the blast of cold air invigorating. To me, a sunny, brisk day of getting slapped in the face with some cold air while jumping helps keep the winter duldroms away.

riggerrob  (D 14840)

Sep 13, 2003, 8:19 AM
Post #5 of 7 (707 views)
Re: [nightjumps] 2 questions from a 2-jump newbie [In reply to] Can't Post

1) The original poster already understands most of what he has to do for a stable exit. Just remember to keep your eyes on the propeller/airplane as you fall away.

2) Sure we jump in the cold. The key to inexpensive learning is compressing as many jumps into as short a time as possible to accelerate learning. This is one of the few cases where I would advise a student to go into debt to complete a block of training before the weather turns foul.
Mind you, the Texas definition of foul weather is radically different than the Canadian definition of foul weather.
Can you say "minus 40?"

As for the other poster who believes that his instructors can solve all the instability problems he can throw at them ... He has far more faith in his instructors than I have in myself, and I have been a freefall instructor for more than a decade.

Speer  (A 44443)

Sep 13, 2003, 9:22 AM
Post #6 of 7 (694 views)
Re: [schattenjaeger] 2 questions from a 2-jump newbie [In reply to] Can't Post


Yes, get your instruction from the JM, not us anonymous jumpers on the web.

You have already recognized that de-arching is not conducive to stability and control. Your reference to fixating on the ground indicates that you may be exiting the aircraft horizontal, rather that vertical. You can arch while looking down, but doing so will put your head into the prevailing wind (coming from the front of the aircraft) instead of your belly. This will likely result in a scenario similar to what you have experienced.

I had just this problem with my first four jumps. I asked the Instructor doing my level 4 to see what I was doing wrong... you should do the same. I was kicking my legs up and to the rear upon exit, thus putting me "head down" to the relative wind. Some students fear hitting their head on the top of the door, and so lay themselves out during exit.

If you have a mock up of the Caravan door at your DZ, do some extra practice exits on your own prior to your next jump. This will help you to build "muscle memory", increasing the odds that you will do it right on the actual exit. You can even practice this at home in any doorway... you just lose the top of the door reference.

If you step out in a crouch, then stand up into a good arch, you will be able to watch the aircraft recede... it's always been an awesome sight.

I jump in Sunny So Cal, so "winter" jumping is no where near the obstacle it is for our Northerly Brothers and Sisters. I have made a couple "cold" weather jumps (+7 & +5 F at exit altitude) without gloves or anything other than regular gear... your fingers won't like it, but it is certainly do-able. If you do use gloves, be sure you develop an intimate knowledge of what your rig and handles feel like with them on! As with other aspects of your learning, this is appropriate material to be asking your Instructors about.

And remember, HAVE FUN!


Sep 13, 2003, 8:21 PM
Post #7 of 7 (628 views)
Re: [Speer] 2 questions from a 2-jump newbie [In reply to] Can't Post

Well, I'm in north Texas, so I figure I've got until like late November before weather becomes an issue. And believe me, I'm doing this as fast as my paychecks roll in, and I've got college to worry about too.

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