Forums: Skydiving Disciplines: Swooping and Canopy Control:
Icarus Custumer (NO)Care

 

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DF7ZS  (D License)

Jun 23, 2003, 2:02 AM
Post #1 of 37 (4073 views)
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Icarus Custumer (NO)Care Can't Post

Hi folks !

I have some good news and some bad news .... .
I finally got my Icarus Crossfire/2 109 two weeks ago. It is a very fine canopy and I love to fly with it. Smile

The bad news is that it took 6 month (SIX MONTH) to deliver. I have been told that the colour I selected was not available Unimpressed and I should (A) wait or (B) select another colour. I went to plan B and selected other colours. Unfortunately that colour was also not available at time. Well, bad luck and waiting..... Finally the canopy got delivered after several phone calls, emails with Icarus e.t.c. !

I totally understand that they can not built a canopy without the right good quality fabric, BUT not any sign of customer care at all !

My rigger told me that he got the "old" price when the canopy was ordered 6 month ago, where the current price seems to be a bit lower. After that long waiting period you could give your customers some percent discount or send some free icarus shirts ... but nothing in that direction at all. Nothing. Be thankful that you are allowed to fly such a great canopy finally. :-(

By the way: Meanwhile waiting for my canopy I had about 170 Jumps on a friends crossfire/2. That is almost 50% of the lines lifetime. The lines are the most expensive in the market you can get.

I got to try a velocity some day ....

blue skies

Helmut


garyharbird  (D 25785)

Jun 23, 2003, 3:53 AM
Post #2 of 37 (4036 views)
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Re: [DF7ZS] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

Sorry to here that.
PD ALL THE WAY, i ordered 2 velocities and pd told me 12 weeks, 12 weeks to the day the ups man gave me a box full of goodies including 2 velocities, their service was awesome.
Back to icarus, before i was jumping a fx104, sent that to icarus and it took 4 months just to get the thing relined, I did get a letter explaining about how they were backed up, it was at the time they were having problems with the original crossfire. But still after that i vowed that i would always go with PD.
They have the best customer service.
Hope you enjoy you crossfire, and good luck with icarus.
Blueskies
Gary Harbird


johnny1488  (D 25453)

Jun 23, 2003, 5:04 AM
Post #3 of 37 (4009 views)
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Re: [DF7ZS] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

I would make sure you bring it to Simon's attention. They are a much smaller company than pd and I know they wil do everything they can to make you happy. And 170 is not even close to half the life of a set of vectran lines if you take care of them.


garyharbird  (D 25785)

Jun 23, 2003, 5:22 AM
Post #4 of 37 (3999 views)
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Re: [johnny1488] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

I would have to disagree with you on the live of the vectran lines, it all depends on the conditions of the dropzone, in florida my vectran lines last a little over 300 jumps and up north they last about another 100 jumps, i took vectran a little over 400 jumps and have a steering line break just below the cascade on opening, so after that i reline at about 300-400 jumps now.
Blue skies
Gary Harbird


freeflydrew  (D 23992)

Jun 23, 2003, 6:34 AM
Post #5 of 37 (3956 views)
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Re: [garyharbird] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

To start, I'm pro PD all the way, and this isn't directed at Gary, simply at the discussion.

As for the line discussion, this is a repeated post...

Right from the Icarus website...
Vectran:
Vectran has become a popular choice due to its superior dimensional integrity. In other words, they won't shrink or distort nearly as much as will Spectra. As a result your canopy will retain better openings and flight characteristics for the duration of the line sets life.

NOTE: Vectran does not have as much abrasion resistance as Spectra, and the lines will "fuzz out" sooner than Spectra

It is recommended that you check line wear regularly. In particular, check out the lower control lines; they wear out fastest.

Once again we recommend a line set replacement anywhere between 300 and 600 jumps but due to the variables involved, we recommend that you pay close attention to line wear and if in doubt at least replace your lower control lines regularly.

The life of your lines will depend on several factors like your weight, the cleanliness of your packing environment, the number of lines (7-Cell or 9-Cell), how well you look after them and the condition of your slider grommets. Linesets should be monitored for wear and trim and retrimmed or replaced as you would a set of tires on a car. The things to look out for are trims, wear spots, snags and worn stitching. Often wear spots can appear quite bad but still retain much of their strength (such as wear by Velcro) and sometimes a line can appear in quite good condition and be weakened considerably (often underneath a fingertrap). A simple test is to squeeze the line between your thumb and finger and slide it along, if the line or wear spot gets thinner it is more than likely weakened.

Everyone please be safe...

(This post was edited by freeflydrew on Jun 23, 2003, 6:37 AM)


Yoshi  (D 26770)

Jun 23, 2003, 10:57 AM
Post #6 of 37 (3878 views)
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Re: [DF7ZS] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

I am sorry to hear what you have experienced. I am a firm believer in icarus. My experienced with simon and everyone over there have been nothing but the best. In fact when my cf1 was recalled they let me demo a canopy until it was fixed and when I ordered my new crossfire 2 it took literally 4 weeks to the day from the time I ordered it to the time it was on my doorstep. If you havent yet I would get ahold of simon and let him know whats up... he will at the minimum give you an explanation for what happened.

jsut my 2 cents
-yoshi


andy2

Jun 23, 2003, 1:36 PM
Post #7 of 37 (3828 views)
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Re: [Yoshi] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

yoshi, did you order custom colors, or was it stock? Just curious.


Yoshi  (D 26770)

Jun 23, 2003, 2:18 PM
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Re: [andy2] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

I ordered custom colors and size (111 sq ft) and I ordered it at the end of november (2002) and got it in december.
-yoshi


jkbasejumper  (D 26602)

Jun 23, 2003, 2:27 PM
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Re: [DF7ZS] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

man i know all to well what you are talking about.it took me almost 7 months to get my new crossfire2 109 then to ad to heart ache i had to cut it away on its 8th jump and never found it.just imagine...2min. phone call to spend $1800,seven months of waiting and only 8 little memories... life is really sucking about now..


JJohnson  (D 22675)

Jun 23, 2003, 3:13 PM
Post #10 of 37 (3778 views)
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Re: [DF7ZS] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

My experience with Icarus was none better than yours...even worse. Icarus would have to have the greatest shit on the planet by a wide margin for me to consider going back to them.


johnny1488  (D 25453)

Jun 23, 2003, 4:28 PM
Post #11 of 37 (3752 views)
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Re: [garyharbird] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

Once again like drew said. Vectran will last if you can take care of it. I got 350 jumps out of the vectran on my safire209 before I redid the lower control lines. Plenty of life left on the rest of the lines when I sold it. I ordered my custom safire2 169 and had it in a little over a month. I would definetly talk with Simon about your situation. There is no way he would be satisfied with anyone having to wait that long for a canopy. Please dont be silent. Let him know you are unhappy so they can fix whatever problem caused you grief.


DF7ZS  (D License)

Jun 24, 2003, 10:51 PM
Post #12 of 37 (3591 views)
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Re: [johnny1488] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes, Simon knows the case. I had email contact with him after i did not get any answer out of spain.

blues

Helmut


ManBird  (D 28001)

Jun 24, 2003, 11:32 PM
Post #13 of 37 (3584 views)
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Re: [jkbasejumper] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
man i know all to well what you are talking about.it took me almost 7 months to get my new crossfire2 109 then to ad to heart ache i had to cut it away on its 8th jump and never found it.just imagine...2min. phone call to spend $1800,seven months of waiting and only 8 little memories... life is really sucking about now..
OUCH! Man, I'm definitely feeling for you. Pain, man... pain.


sneaky

Jul 4, 2003, 10:07 AM
Post #14 of 37 (3411 views)
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Re: [DF7ZS] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi
the Designer and origional owner Paul Martyn ( Gyro ) for NZ Aeropsports ,which then became Icarus is a mate of mine....And hes a cool dude...
What I can say is,and I dealt with him in 1998 when he was in NZ,I ordered my FX99 and had it a week later ( they weren't that popular then ).. his service and proffessiolism and after service care was fantastic.
I have not dealt with Icarus as yet,but if it helps ,please remember that you have got a really good canopy,that has been through some intense design and testing.And from now on,the pleasure is yours!!..
Its no excuse for poor communications though...

170 jumps is nothing on the line life..,you should be able to get near 1000 before you need to reline.I put about 900 on mine with Microline before relining with Vectran lines...

Blue Skies


sneaky

Jul 4, 2003, 10:12 AM
Post #15 of 37 (3408 views)
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Re: [DF7ZS] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

I saw Simon in Spain,and he said they were sorting some stuff out at Icarus.... you probaly wouldn't have heard anything because its very hard to Internet access in Ampuria ....thats probaly why?


dragon2  (D 101989)

Jul 4, 2003, 11:14 AM
Post #16 of 37 (3399 views)
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Re: [sneaky] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I saw Simon in Spain,and he said they were sorting some stuff out at Icarus.... you probaly wouldn't have heard anything because its very hard to Internet access in Ampuria ....thats probaly why?

Why is it hard? There's 2 public pc's with internet (okay they cost money) right at the DZ....


sneaky

Jul 4, 2003, 11:27 AM
Post #17 of 37 (3394 views)
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Re: [dragon2] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

its hard when you have been in the surf inn all nite and Passorella til the suns come up .. believe me I have done it...!!!

Cool


(This post was edited by sneaky on Jul 4, 2003, 11:35 AM)


masterrigger1  (D 14167)

Jul 21, 2003, 10:56 AM
Post #18 of 37 (3219 views)
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Re: [garyharbird] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Sorry to here that.
PD ALL THE WAY, i ordered 2 velocities and pd told me 12 weeks, 12 weeks to the day the ups man gave me a box full of goodies including 2 velocities, their service was awesome.
Back to icarus, before i was jumping a fx104, sent that to icarus and it took 4 months just to get the thing relined, I did get a letter explaining about how they were backed up, it was at the time they were having problems with the original crossfire. But still after that i vowed that i would always go with PD.
They have the best customer service.
Hope you enjoy you crossfire, and good luck with icarus.
Blueskies
Gary Harbird

Gary,
Here is what our records show:

* PO#291 FX -104 that was actually a FX-111 when it arrived at the Service Center. We built line Sets for both sizes.

* Purchase Order originated on 11-13-01

*Shipped 12-21-01 to Sebastian while you where there via UPS. I can post a tracking # if you like!

Somehow that is not quite 4 months in my book!

MEL


rhino  (D 22500)

Jul 21, 2003, 11:25 AM
Post #19 of 37 (3205 views)
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Re: [masterrigger1] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

OUCH!! lol

I had GREAT service when I ordered my XF2


TALONSKY  (D License)

Jul 21, 2003, 12:37 PM
Post #20 of 37 (3174 views)
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Re: [DF7ZS] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

 I have never bought a new canopy from Icarus but I have owned a Safire and currently own a Crossfire 129 & Crossfire 2 130. I have called up Icarus countless times over the last three years and have always received the help I asked for even when it is inquiring on info to buy a used canopy. About a year ago I e-mailed Simon and asked for some information I could post on dropzone.com about the sizing issue the original Safires and Omegas had, with in a week I got a letter from Simon apologizing for the delay stating he was of vacation along with the information I had requested. I also sent my Safire in for a reline just before selling it I believe it was a total of two weeks from the time I shipped it out to the time I received it back. Oh just a side note when I first called Icarus and was inquiring about buying a Safire (2 some years ago) the very first thing they informed me about was the sizing issue. I personally think Icarus is a great company.
Kirk


rhino  (D 22500)

Jul 21, 2003, 1:59 PM
Post #21 of 37 (3139 views)
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Re: [DF7ZS] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

One of three posts you have made.. Coming on here and blasting Icarus like that..

What a low class thing to do..

I would have made you wait 12 months for your canopy..

Rhino


Premier PhreeZone  (D License)
Moderator
Jul 21, 2003, 3:30 PM
Post #22 of 37 (3110 views)
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Re: [rhino] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

Just since someone does'nt post much here does not mean they can't say bad things about a company.

Personally I had tried to call Icarus last summer about a question and it took 5 days of calling to get ahold of them. I got my answer but every time I call PD its 2 rings and some ones there.


rhino  (D 22500)

Jul 21, 2003, 5:28 PM
Post #23 of 37 (3081 views)
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Re: [PhreeZone] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

My guess is you called them while they were moving offices?

I allways got ahold of someone..

And I can tell when someone is simply trying to take a cheap shot because they are frustrated.

Rhino


andy2

Jul 21, 2003, 6:18 PM
Post #24 of 37 (3071 views)
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Re: [rhino] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

Other people can tell as well, rhino, so there really is no problem. It's best just to let people say whatever they want to say and then decide for yourself which manufacturer you want to go with. An angry customer represents something, maybe not that Icarus doesn't care, but it sure represents something. Alternately, no manufacturer is perfect. Glowing reviews of perfection have to be taken with the same grain of salt that hateful responses do. We're human.


johnny1488  (D 25453)

Jul 21, 2003, 9:49 PM
Post #25 of 37 (3024 views)
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Re: [andy2] Icarus Custumer (NO)Care [In reply to] Can't Post

I enjoy Icarus' products (damn is that an understatement) and I would like to see them be able to grow and do well. Simon often asks me what I hear about them so he knows were to focus his energy. He's a busy guy but has always cared about the customer over all other things. And I can tell you Mel just took care of some work for my girlfriend in excellent fashion also. They're trying to do their best. It's stupid to think a company would invest so much just to let it go to crap. Things are only looking up. One more step ahead, coming soon!


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