Forums: Skydiving: Gear and Rigging:
170 Canopy in Icon I4 ??????

 


jonorato

Oct 18, 2013, 8:51 AM
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170 Canopy in Icon I4 ?????? Can't Post

Hey Everyone!

Does anyone have experience with trying to get a a 170 into a Icon I4?
Aerodyne says the pack tray holds is 150-135.
More specifically im looking to get a Saber2 in there.

Thanks for the Help!


mattjw916  (D License)

Oct 18, 2013, 10:14 AM
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Re: [jonorato] 170 Canopy in Icon I4 ?????? [In reply to] Can't Post

you already have your answer...

don't overstuff your rig bro


ChrisD  (No License)

Oct 18, 2013, 11:14 AM
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Re: [mattjw916] 170 Canopy in Icon I4 ?????? [In reply to] Can't Post

mattjw916 wrote:
you already have your answer...

don't overstuff your rig bro

Kudos to you Matt for being kind:



Why do you ask about something that the manufacturer says not to do???

I just don't understand doing that????


Do you want to find someone stupid enough to admit they are risking their lives and the reputation of skydivers as a group to say that doing something that the manufactures don't recommend is ok?

You freely admit you are aware of the manufacturers sizing chart, and all of the precautions and cautions associated with improper sizing and yet you persist in quite frankly: reclous behavior!

I strongly suspect your response would include some pithy remark about how your being treated as compared with just anserwing your stupid and immature question,...


But your question is irresponsible


But to answere your question about "help" ,

I suggest yo quit now before you become a statistic later...Angelic


(This post was edited by ChrisD on Oct 18, 2013, 11:16 AM)


ChuckMartin  (D License)

Oct 18, 2013, 6:47 PM
Post #4 of 11 (2999 views)
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Re: [jonorato] 170 Canopy in Icon I4 ?????? [In reply to] Can't Post

http://www.performancedesigns.com/packingchart.asp

That should help. When companies talk about what will fit most the time they will say how they measure. Like these lines, this kind of material. Some canopy companies have use low bulk nylon (Aerodyne ZPX, PD's Pulse, ect)

Aerodyne says that ZPX packs 17% smaller then ZP so a Pilot 168 in ZPX would pack like a 150 (really a 148.344)

Now getting pack to your question....

Here is the pack volume according to Parachute Labs (first one I found online) and PIA.
PL PIA
SABRE 170 390 397
SABRE 170 w/MICROLINE 364 --
And paragear lists it at 364.

Aerodyne lists the pack volume of the I4 as 368/393 (min/max).

So....
If you go by the sizes they list then, no.
Go by the math they list and use PL's numbers or paragears numbers then, yes.
If you go by PIA then, no.

Aerodyne does say "Range of acceptable Aerodyne main canopies" on the page they list Icon sizes and they list the Pilot 168 as a pack volume as 416 which is a lot bigger then PIA says the Sabre is.

You know you could always email Aerodyne and ask them, they are nice folks.


jonorato

Oct 24, 2013, 11:17 AM
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Re: [ChuckMartin] 170 Canopy in Icon I4 ?????? [In reply to] Can't Post

Hey ChuckMartin,
Thanks a ton for all the help. After a whole hell of a lot of trying, I got in contact with Aerodyne and they said a Pilot 168 zpx would fit it. Other 170 canopies would not. I was honeslty just looking for someone who had specific experience with attempting to put a 170 in an I4. They gave me the simple "Refer to the sizing chart" answer in the email so I didnt get to discuss it as I wanted to. A couple of people at my DZ had experience and they said that it was pain to get in, but they never had a problem with function. Again, really appreciate all the help.


ChrisD  (No License)

Oct 25, 2013, 10:14 AM
Post #6 of 11 (2517 views)
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Re: [jonorato] 170 Canopy in Icon I4 ?????? [In reply to] Can't Post

jonorato wrote:
Hey ChuckMartin,
Thanks a ton for all the help. After a whole hell of a lot of trying, I got in contact with Aerodyne and they said a Pilot 168 zpx would fit it. Other 170 canopies would not. I was honeslty just looking for someone who had specific experience with attempting to put a 170 in an I4. They gave me the simple "Refer to the sizing chart" answer in the email so I didnt get to discuss it as I wanted to. A couple of people at my DZ had experience and they said that it was pain to get in, but they never had a problem with function. Again, really appreciate all the help.

You didn't ask about a Pilot, you asked about a Sabre 2. And you asked if you could stick an oversized canopy in an undersized container. How many times do people need to hear that that is a stupid and irresponsible thing to do???


Where is Goonies zKid when you need him????


Obviously you have fallen into the ask around enough and some idiot will tell you what you want to hear.

I would be interested in speaking with whomever you have spoken with in DeLand because you have implied something in your post's that isn't true. You have also stated that you didn't like what you heard in an email but you heard something as part of your discussion???

Well I'm not implying anything here. You are a statistic waiting to happen. You are way off base implying you got the ansewere you wanted to hear on the phone.

Don't fucking put words into the mouth of the manufacturers by implying that "your all set" after having a phone call to AeroDyne.

Anyone who ignores the published charts is on their own,...PERIOD.

This is your quote:

Quote:
I was honeslty just looking for someone who had specific experience with attempting to put a 170 in an I4.

You are looking for another idiot....

C


(This post was edited by ChrisD on Oct 25, 2013, 10:15 AM)


gowlerk  (C 3196)

Oct 25, 2013, 1:09 PM
Post #7 of 11 (2465 views)
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Re: [ChrisD] 170 Canopy in Icon I4 ?????? [In reply to] Can't Post

Chris, you are at your very best today!


jonorato

Oct 26, 2013, 10:03 AM
Post #8 of 11 (2369 views)
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Re: [ChrisD] 170 Canopy in Icon I4 ?????? [In reply to] Can't Post

Look Chris,
I might be asking stupid questions, but I have to ask none the less. New to the sport means I've got lots of questions and few people to go to. But you offered me ZERO helpful advice on this one. Chuck Martin definitely helped out. You can be a Super Douche all you want, to whoever you want, I can deal with that no problem. But I mean at least offer some relevant data or information man or your just another dick on the internet. So you can go fuck yourself if you gunna continue to haggle me over a question I wanted some further information on. Oh and save me the response. I just don't have the time to sift through your bullshit again.


likestojump  (D License)

Oct 26, 2013, 10:39 AM
Post #9 of 11 (2363 views)
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Re: [jonorato] 170 Canopy in Icon I4 ?????? [In reply to] Can't Post

jonorato wrote:
Look Chris,
I might be asking stupid questions, but I have to ask none the less. New to the sport means I've got lots of questions and few people to go to. But you offered me ZERO helpful advice on this one. Chuck Martin definitely helped out. You can be a Super Douche all you want, to whoever you want, I can deal with that no problem. But I mean at least offer some relevant data or information man or your just another dick on the internet. So you can go fuck yourself if you gunna continue to haggle me over a question I wanted some further information on. Oh and save me the response. I just don't have the time to sift through your bullshit again.

Advice :

a) grow thicker skin
b) do not overstuff your container
c) think about the size of reserve you will have if you a 170 is a super duper tight fit into you rig.

countless times I have encountered situations where people got new rigs, overstuffed them and then spent their next season or two bitching about how tight their rig is, how hard it is against their back and how they really hate packing it. DUH !

while you are overstuffing your rig, please do the research on the countless reserve freebag extraction force topics (while main container locked) that have been discussed over the last few years.

Bottom line - don't overstuff your container. You will have a much better time skydiving if you put in the proper sized canopies into proper sized containers. Trust me, I deal with this on near daily basis.


ChrisD  (No License)

Oct 26, 2013, 12:24 PM
Post #10 of 11 (2310 views)
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Re: [likestojump] 170 Canopy in Icon I4 ?????? [In reply to] Can't Post

SmileSmileSmile



Pilot is actually larger????

Can this be true????

C

Have a nice day! SmileSmileSmile

So AereoDyne said that it was ok to "stuff" an even larger canopy into the bag????


What's your wing loading by the way?

I can understand having a friend giving you a container and then making a poor decision. But generally we like to see people decide on what type and design of canopy based upon their experience FIRST. And then wrap a properly sized container around the whole thing. A container that is based upon what could be called the Normal size for what's inside of it. Kind of like Goldielocks!!! SmileWink Just the right size, nether too tight or too loose, this is actually important!! Not for you though! Cause your not going to be jumping long! The soup Nazi has stated: "NO SOUP FOR YOU."

Makes it a bitch if you have a hardon for a particular container though....sometimes it's best to walk away??? Hard as that may be. Safety has a price, I'm sporry that so many don't seem to grasp this concept.

Peerhaps someone should write articals about gear selection if your going to get things piecemeal...O'h wait a min they have


Again and again.....

did the fine folks at AeroDyne give you some bad advice???


I don't know, I'm not speaking to them at the moment. Wait a min I'll walk down the street and see what they have to say...........


They say take the canopy on a demo (Whatever brand, make or model your interested in.) and actually try stuffing it in the container (Whatever brand make or model your interested in.) to see what happens. but please do pay attention to the ORANGE placard sewn onto the container that says don't do what your proposing to do which was what you were told as the first response that you didn't want to hear....

But be sure to get it on your GoPro, I mean being new and all, you sure don't want to miss a second of this from your perspective don't we????



Now I understand the thing about ZPX, are you interested in purchasing a Pilot 168 in ZPX?

What size/type reserve?

And are the folks at Aerodyne going to guanotee that what your contemplating is going to fit? Which is I suspect where this whole thing is going anyways....

What with the guantee that it will be 17 percent smaller than the same whatever???

How do ya tell what is too tight anyways???


Just answereing your original question:

"More specifically im looking to get a Saber2 in there."

Now were talking about Pilots.....


If this is how it works in your world,...


Then were back to picking your canopy first, since you can't seem to make up your mind which canopy you want to obtain,...do you have a favorite canopy? Or is that up in the air as well?

I suggest a conservative WL for a student as that is what you have indicated you are, so that puts you in the .8 to .9 range? A navigator is a fine canopy, as is a larger Triathelon, or sabre 2, the pilot is loved by many as well. So a Pilot 230 in zpx would be a great place to start , and then ditch the i4 and purchase an i7 size container. and the added benifite you can downsize to a pilot 210 and use the same container.


Now it may appear that I'm being a little harsh, I'm not really:SmileSmileSmile

But the lack of due dillagance faced by many selecting gear is and has a lot of pitfalls....

there is an order to this process. And it starts with what is going to be the most important factor first and then considering the other variables second. Too tight a fit is a real concern. It is not to be trifiled with, ever...

And wingloading can frequently bit you in the ass when you lease expect it....

So when someone starts off by making a statement that is against the published recomondations this gets my attention. I mean what is next????

I raise the question of attitude first and foremost!

Because someone is holding up a sign that says:

I'm new, but I'm willing to bend the rules!

What's next Mad Skillzzz. SmileSmileSmile

Or how bout this:

Have them make you a pilot 168 in ZPX and now it's too small for a I4 size container???


(This post was edited by ChrisD on Oct 26, 2013, 2:28 PM)
Attachments: untitled65.bmp (148 KB)


Alexg3265  (C 42218)

Nov 30, 2013, 8:02 PM
Post #11 of 11 (1908 views)
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Re: [jonorato] 170 Canopy in Icon I4 ?????? [In reply to] Can't Post

I put a sabre 1 170 in an i5 and it was very snug.... My wife has an i4, which was a bitch stuffing a hornet 150 into, so in my not so professional opinion, no fucking way.



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