Forums: Skydiving Disciplines: Wing Suit Flying:
Hands/elbows with gripperless suits

 


SoberJason  (C License)

Sep 6, 2013, 1:36 PM
Post #1 of 10 (2430 views)
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Hands/elbows with gripperless suits Can't Post

I am new to WS flying. Flying a shadow. The thought in my head was always that I had to have my palms facing earth. This put my elbows bent in what felt like a natural position (bent toward my feet)...the wrong direction for efficient WS flight. I met a really cool dude and after our first jump he told me to bend my elbows forward and showed me good body position. On the next jump I did what he said and literally felt my wings inflate for what felt like the first time. It felt good. But my palms were still toward earth. Palms to earth and elbows bent forward just feels weird to me as a human being. Not natural. So my question is: Does it matter what i do with my hands? I just have not really seen people fly these suits palms to sky.... what am I missing?


birdynamnam  (D 179)

Sep 6, 2013, 1:59 PM
Post #2 of 10 (2374 views)
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Re: [SoberJason] Hands/elbows with gripperless suits [In reply to] Can't Post

Just look at videos of experienced people flying Shadows and other hands-free designs. Tons of videos out there, here is one : http://www.wingsuitcompetition.com/...ovie_vimeo.php?id=88


SoberJason  (C License)

Sep 6, 2013, 2:13 PM
Post #3 of 10 (2353 views)
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Re: [birdynamnam] Hands/elbows with gripperless suits [In reply to] Can't Post

What I gather from that is that it doesnt really matter. Small suits doing what they are designed for..Hand placement is dependent on what you are trying to do. / I need to flock more..
I summon the eagle!!!!! CAAHHCAHHHHH CAHHHHCAAAAAAHHHH.
The eagle has been summoned! You shall not defeat the eagle!


SoberJason  (C License)

Sep 6, 2013, 2:23 PM
Post #4 of 10 (2344 views)
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Re: [SoberJason] Hands/elbows with gripperless suits [In reply to] Can't Post

I see alot of backward facing hands. Im crazy. thanks Birdynamnam :)


The111  (D 29246)

Sep 6, 2013, 2:53 PM
Post #5 of 10 (2302 views)
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Re: [SoberJason] Hands/elbows with gripperless suits [In reply to] Can't Post

It has much more to do with the cut of the wing than the presence or absence of grippers. Stand in front of a mirror without a wingsuit and observe your arm profile as you do palms-down and palms-up positions. With palms up, your arms present a much straighter line, in some cases even concave (when viewed from the outside). In other words, the bend at your elbow causes your forearm/hand to move slightly further away from the line your upper arm creates. With palms down, your arms have a more pronounced bend and it is convex when viewed from the outside. In other words, the bend of your elbow causes your forearm/hand to come closer to your body than the line of your upper arm.

Now, try on a suit like an Acro (if you can find one) or an SFly. On the ground, spread out your wings. If you try to do palms down, you'll feel much more tension on the elbow than anywhere else. If you do palms up, you'll get more even tension along your entire arm inside the sleeve, because of the shape the wing is cut.

Now, in a suit like a Phantom or Vampire or a TonySuit (the few I've flown at least) or any Bird-Man suit, do the same thing. You'll notice the opposite. The wing is cut such that it conforms to your arm better when palms-up.

When you position your arm such that the sleeve best conforms to it, you get a smoother wing, AND you get usage of the full surface area of the wing. If you have your arm positioned wrong and one part of the sleeve restricts your motion early (before the whole sleeve gets tensioned by your arm), then you are unable to use the whole surface area because you can't move your arm out all the way to where it should be.

I drew the curvature on the images below (shamelessly using a pic of myself for one).




Attachments: concave.jpg (215 KB)
  convex.jpg (79.5 KB)


SoberJason  (C License)

Sep 6, 2013, 4:07 PM
Post #6 of 10 (2268 views)
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Re: [The111] Hands/elbows with gripperless suits [In reply to] Can't Post

Don't be ashamed. you look like a sexy beast. A sexy flying machine. What you say makes sense. I guess it depends on what you are flying. The suit dictates the position makes sense...I would still like to hear the eagles opinion. I CALL THE EAGLE CAAAAHHCAAAHHH CAAAHHCAAAAAAHH>! I summon the eagle !


The111  (D 29246)

Sep 6, 2013, 4:43 PM
Post #7 of 10 (2247 views)
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Re: [SoberJason] Hands/elbows with gripperless suits [In reply to] Can't Post

Grammar (definition) nazi time!

SoberJason wrote:
The111 wrote:
(shamelessly using a pic of myself for one).
Don't be ashamed.

Shamelessly means without shame. Unimpressed


dthames  (B 37674)

Sep 6, 2013, 8:30 PM
Post #8 of 10 (2157 views)
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Re: [SoberJason] Hands/elbows with gripperless suits [In reply to] Can't Post

Even tracking I learned to roll my shoulders and put my palms to the sky. One main reason is that my arms are a bit weird, in that my elbows will not allow my arms to be all the way straight. With elbows locked, my arm looks a bit dog-legged, with a bend of 10 degrees or a bit more. Tracking with my palms to Earth, I can't get my forearms right against my sides. But palms to the sky, I can get my arms behind me.

Wingsuiting, I am very much compelled to be palms to the sky just to not distort the leading edge with a concave crook. The different is huge for me.


sky12345

Sep 6, 2013, 9:18 PM
Post #9 of 10 (2129 views)
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Re: [SoberJason] Hands/elbows with gripperless suits [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Don't be ashamed. you look like a sexy beast. A sexy flying machine.

orange guy? yes.. i assume this is the111?

but that blue guy? he's kinda weird.. see-through ws.. ass twice as wide as shouldres..transparent lower legs.. and right foot size what 20?! and and michelin hand in the cloud wtf!!!!

Laugh


SoberJason  (C License)

Sep 7, 2013, 4:12 AM
Post #10 of 10 (2046 views)
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Re: [sky12345] Hands/elbows with gripperless suits [In reply to] Can't Post

lmfao



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