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Cameras

 

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lex5150  (Student)

May 1, 2013, 7:36 AM
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Cameras Can't Post

I know you are not supposed to jump with a cam until you have 200 jumps. I have heard that some people still jump a cam with less than 200 jumps. What are the penalties if caught/


wildcard451  (D License)

May 1, 2013, 7:42 AM
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Re: [lex5150] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

they carve a "C" into you forehead.


lex5150  (Student)

May 1, 2013, 7:46 AM
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Re: [wildcard451] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

That would be painful but would not deter some peeps. I understand that it's a distraction but I also think that maybe it should be less than 200 jumps or maybe include training on using cams within the AFF course.
I mean you can jump during AFF with a radio strapped to the top of your helmet but you can't jump a cam? Doesn't make much sense to me.


(This post was edited by lex5150 on May 1, 2013, 7:53 AM)


excaza  (C License)

May 1, 2013, 7:56 AM
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Re: [lex5150] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
What are the penalties if caught/
Depends on the DZ. You could get kicked out, or nothing can happen.

In reply to:
I mean you can jump during AFF with a radio strapped to the top of your helmet but you can't jump a cam? Doesn't make much sense to me.
Unimpressed


chuckakers  (D 10855)

May 1, 2013, 7:57 AM
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Re: [lex5150] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I mean you can jump during AFF with a radio strapped to the top of your helmet but you can't jump a cam? Doesn't make much sense to me.

A radio is for instruction. A camera is for distraction.


wmw999  (D 6296)

May 1, 2013, 7:59 AM
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Re: [lex5150] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
I mean you can jump during AFF with a radio strapped to the top of your helmet but you can't jump a cam? Doesn't make much sense to me.
People don't tend to try to get a good shot for the radio.

Here is a link to incidents and near-misses by people flying small-format cameras. These are only the ones that the poster heard of.

No one is too good to make one of those mistakes; it's best to have some experience to be able to deal with the unexpected when it happens. And experience is best developed with fewer, rather than more, variables.

It really happened, even if it's not on video.

Wendy P.


davelepka  (D 21448)

May 1, 2013, 7:59 AM
Post #7 of 35 (3458 views)
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Re: [lex5150] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
you can jump during AFF with a radio strapped to the top of your helmet but you can't jump a cam? Doesn't make much sense to me.

You're not 'working' the radio. You have nothing to do with the radio at any point during the jump. You may hear it under canopy, you may not.

The size/shape/snag-hazzard of the camera is only one small part of the problem. The other part is the attention that it commands in the plane, in freefall, and under canopy.

When your concern in the plane shifts towards working your camera (or sorting out a camera problem) it is not on gear checks (both yours and others) and general awareness.

When you realize that where you look will influence the what the video records, your attention in freefall will shift from other jumpers, altitude and general awareness to 'getting the shot'. Ditto for under canopy.

These are not 'maybe' situations, these are things that have happened over and over to the point that it became an issue enough for the USPA to take action, whcih is tough to do.

The solution is simple - make the jumps and get to 200. If you're dedicated, it will go quick and you'll be jumping a camera in no time. If you're not dedicated, consider that your experience and currency might not lend itself to camera jumping anyway, and just pay attention to making safe jumps.


Premier Remster  (C License)

May 1, 2013, 8:00 AM
Post #8 of 35 (3456 views)
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Re: [wildcard451] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
they carve a "C" into you forehead.

I thought that's what happened when you Chowed...


lex5150  (Student)

May 1, 2013, 8:10 AM
Post #9 of 35 (3441 views)
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Re: [Remster] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks for the replies. I knew there had to be some reason the USPA took action. I would not argue the rules, but at the same time, I still think 200 jumps is a lot. It also depends on the person. Recently I was fun jumping with a coach and he had some trouble with his GoPro. He could not get it to turn on so he asked me to look at it to make sure it was on. I tried twice to get it working before we both decided it wasn't worth the time or distraction. We simply jumped without video. No biggy.


Premier Remster  (C License)

May 1, 2013, 9:00 AM
Post #10 of 35 (3402 views)
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Re: [lex5150] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
I still think 200 jumps is a lot

200 is a lot when you have 10. In the grand scheme of things, it's nothing. 1000 is just a little bit more than nothing in the same grand scheme of things.

Quote:
It also depends on the person

You're right. Some people need a lot more experience than 200 jumps.


(This post was edited by Remster on May 1, 2013, 9:37 AM)


davelepka  (D 21448)

May 1, 2013, 9:24 AM
Post #11 of 35 (3381 views)
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Re: [lex5150] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
I still think 200 jumps is a lot

As mentioned, that depends on your point of view. From under 200, it seems like a mountain. From anything north of 1000, it's a blip on the radar.

Quote:
It also depends on the person

That might be true, but how do you know who is/is not ready under 200 jumps before you send them up with a camera? Let's say you're wrong, you find out because there is an incident and now it's too late.

How many times have there been an incident where people who knew the jumper involved said things like 'I never expected that to happen to Mike, he was a heads up and experienced guy'? You never know how anyone is going to react to a given situation until it's over.


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
Moderator
May 1, 2013, 10:18 AM
Post #12 of 35 (3341 views)
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Re: [lex5150] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

> What are the penalties if caught/

Death, serious injury, low pulls, Cypres firings, collisions, forgetting to put your chest strap on, entanglements, no-flare landings and broken teeth.


lex5150  (Student)

May 1, 2013, 10:22 AM
Post #13 of 35 (3335 views)
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Re: [billvon] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

Points well taken. I appreciate the responses and look forward to becoming a safe skydiver. I am new to the sport but the one thing I have heard over and over is how quickly things can go to heck during freefall. I wanna live to jump a long long time.


(This post was edited by lex5150 on May 1, 2013, 10:26 AM)


wmw999  (D 6296)

May 1, 2013, 10:37 AM
Post #14 of 35 (3313 views)
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Re: [lex5150] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks for asking the questions, and thanks for listening to the answers. That's the only way anyone progresses.

Wendy P.


diablopilot  (D License)

May 1, 2013, 11:23 AM
Post #15 of 35 (3278 views)
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Re: [lex5150] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Thanks for the replies. I knew there had to be some reason the USPA took action. I would not argue the rules, but at the same time, I still think 200 jumps is a lot. It also depends on the person. Recently I was fun jumping with a coach and he had some trouble with his GoPro. He could not get it to turn on so he asked me to look at it to make sure it was on. I tried twice to get it working before we both decided it wasn't worth the time or distraction. We simply jumped without video. No biggy.

Remember your perspective is one sided. You may think it's a lot, but you have next to no experience in the sport and have had nearly no time to see what can go wrong.

Go learn to jump, get good at it.


Premier billvon  (D 16479)
Moderator
May 1, 2013, 11:26 AM
Post #16 of 35 (3273 views)
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Re: [lex5150] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

> It also depends on the person. Recently I was fun jumping with a coach and he had
>some trouble with his GoPro. He could not get it to turn on so he asked me to look at it
>to make sure it was on. I tried twice to get it working before we both decided it wasn't
>worth the time or distraction. We simply jumped without video. No biggy.

Something very similar happened on a load a few years ago:

=======================
April 21, 2010 Southeast Region
Skydiver with 242 jumps got a small format camera for Easter and was anxious to jump it. He pulled the camera from the USB charger and was rushing to the aircraft. He could not get the camera to turn on/stay on/go into record mode, and as a result of his rush, forgot to connect his chest strap.
He was experienced enough to grab his MLW and hold on during deployment.
His PM said I think I need to work on my mental skills more because the camera kept me from doing my regular routine. No injury.
======================


skyjumpenfool  (Student)

May 1, 2013, 5:54 PM
Post #17 of 35 (3132 views)
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Re: [lex5150] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Points well taken. I appreciate the responses and look forward to becoming a safe skydiver. I am new to the sport but the one thing I have heard over and over is how quickly things can go to heck during freefall. I wanna live to jump a long long time.

Shocked Wow! That was refreshing! Cool


shorehambeach  (C License)

May 3, 2013, 3:18 AM
Post #18 of 35 (2847 views)
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Re: [wmw999] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

+ 1

What a great post Wendy Smile


(This post was edited by shorehambeach on May 3, 2013, 3:18 AM)


lewmonst  (D 24575)

May 5, 2013, 11:57 AM
Post #19 of 35 (2636 views)
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Re: [billvon] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
> What are the penalties if caught/

Death, serious injury, low pulls, Cypres firings, collisions, forgetting to put your chest strap on, entanglements, no-flare landings and broken teeth.

& femur, don't forget that one


uberchris  (A License)

May 5, 2013, 12:15 PM
Post #20 of 35 (2629 views)
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Re: [lex5150] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Thanks for the replies. I knew there had to be some reason the USPA took action. I would not argue the rules, but at the same time, I still think 200 jumps is a lot. It also depends on the person. Recently I was fun jumping with a coach and he had some trouble with his GoPro. He could not get it to turn on so he asked me to look at it to make sure it was on. I tried twice to get it working before we both decided it wasn't worth the time or distraction. We simply jumped without video. No biggy.

dont even come at me asking about your stupid red light or whether or not your camera is working. if theres one thing that bugs the shit out of me, its when people start barking at me. before EVERY single skydive, i close my eyes, visualize, focus and breathe and go over the exit in my head. when i have someone tap my shoulder during my zen time, it pisses me off and i just ignore them.

when i am wearing a camera, i have faith that when i push the power button, it comes on, and when i push the record button, it records. if not, fuck it, oh well, but im sure as hell not gonna bug anyone about it.


skyjumpenfool  (Student)

May 5, 2013, 1:44 PM
Post #21 of 35 (2587 views)
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Re: [uberchris] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:

................................. before EVERY single skydive, i close my eyes, visualize, focus and breathe and go over the exit in my head. when i have someone tap my shoulder during my zen time, it pisses me off and i just ignore them.

Ummm? Wow! Unsure If you are that uncomfortable/unsure/nervous that a simple question ruins your "zen time" affecting your skydive, I'd be questioning your ability to handle any type of emergency situation? This should be a huge red flag for you? Or, maybe I've misread what you're trying to say? Shocked


labrys  (D 29848)

May 5, 2013, 2:30 PM
Post #22 of 35 (2566 views)
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Re: [skyjumpenfool] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
If you are that uncomfortable/unsure/nervous that a simple question ruins your "zen time" affecting your skydive

He said it pissed him off and he ignored them. Not the most relaxed attitude to have, but how do you get that he gets nervous, unsure, or that it affects his skydive out of what he said?


lex5150  (Student)

May 6, 2013, 6:18 AM
Post #23 of 35 (2469 views)
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Re: [labrys] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks to all of you that posted replies and a special thanks to those of you that were polite and didn't bring an ego to the discussion.
Blue skies to all of you.


3mpire  (C 39657)

May 7, 2013, 8:56 AM
Post #24 of 35 (2317 views)
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Re: [uberchris] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

Quote:
when i have someone tap my shoulder during my zen time, it pisses me off and i just ignore them.

TapTap: Hey dude you're pilot chute is hanging out

Duder: LALALALA I'm not listening!!! Tongue


skyjumpenfool  (Student)

May 7, 2013, 10:17 AM
Post #25 of 35 (2267 views)
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Re: [labrys] Cameras [In reply to] Can't Post

labrys wrote:
Quote:
If you are that uncomfortable/unsure/nervous that a simple question ruins your "zen time" affecting your skydive

He said it pissed him off and he ignored them. Not the most relaxed attitude to have, but how do you get that he gets nervous, unsure, or that it affects his skydive out of what he said?

Pissed off is a form of anger. Anger is a manifestation of fear. It's a logical jump and I tried to leave the door open for his clarification. This just raised a red flag and I simply pointed that out? Cool


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