Forums: Skydiving: Gear and Rigging:
Rules For Non Skydiving Packers?

 


Mej  (C License)

Jan 8, 2013, 5:05 AM
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Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? Can't Post

Can a non skydiver become a packer, not for a DZ, but for a team.

In the UK you need to be a member of the BPA.

What about packing abroad? Spain, USA etc? Do you need to be a member of the USPA.

Cheers


Southern_Man  (C License)

Jan 8, 2013, 5:37 AM
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Re: [Mej] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

For the USA the only rule is that to pack for somebody else you have to be a rigger or under the direct supervision of a rigger. You do not have to be a skydiver or a member of USPA. Individual drop zones may have additional requirements.


huge

Jan 8, 2013, 5:58 AM
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Re: [Southern_Man] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
For the USA the only rule is that to pack for somebody else you have to be a rigger or under the direct supervision of a rigger.
I don't want to hijack the thread but I feel that there should be a Jr. Rigger rating to allow people to work as packers. Rating should allow them to do the basics like pack and hook up mains. Basically allow them do the same as the individual jumping the rig, just on their behalf.


piisfish

Jan 8, 2013, 6:18 AM
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Re: [huge] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

there are already Senior and Master Riggers in the US, and some argue that it is already too much. Either you do the full job or you don't.

I also think that jumpers should pack more. Not necessarily always, but just paying for a packer because a/you are lazy or b/because you can afford it or a mix of both is just CrazyUnsureUnimpressed


pchapman  (D 1014)

Jan 8, 2013, 7:55 AM
Post #5 of 17 (1737 views)
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Re: [Mej] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

You [edit: The original poster] won't be concerned about Canada in particular, but just as an example:

If one is on a CSPA dropzone anyone packing would just need a packing endorsement -- some informal instruction, 10 supervised pack jobs, tangle test, equipment identification test, that sort of thing. Technically one would probably need to be a CSPA member for the endorsement to be official, but I don't know if DZ's would bother with that if a DZ were hiring, say, 16 year old kids off the street to pack for the DZ.

(One of the best packers we had at one DZ, now a good swooper 15 years later, was just a local kid who started packing at 14.)

There's no "be a rigger or have direct rigger supervision" silliness like in the USA, a throwback to the 1950's military or something.

In Canada, someone foreign travelling with a team would be accepted, no questions asked.

There are also USPA DZ's in Canada, and I bet they just ignore the FAA rated rigger supervision stuff.


(This post was edited by pchapman on Jan 8, 2013, 7:57 AM)


piisfish

Jan 8, 2013, 8:15 AM
Post #6 of 17 (1711 views)
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Re: [pchapman] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

in Switz there is a rule which is jumper/rigger/supervised packing, but the application is : take your chances. Have it packed by anyone, or if you don't like it do it yourself. The jumper takes responsability.


timgaines  (C 107228)

Jan 8, 2013, 9:04 AM
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Re: [piisfish] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
there are already Senior and Master Riggers in the US, and some argue that it is already too much. Either you do the full job or you don't.

I also think that jumpers should pack more. Not necessarily always, but just paying for a packer because a/you are lazy or b/because you can afford it or a mix of both is just CrazyUnsureUnimpressed

Why does being able to build a pilot chute, or repair a canopy/harness etc stop me from packing a main parachute for someone else?

When I pack my main, there is no sowing/tools involved. When I pack for someone else why would I suddenly become incapable of packing?

In the UK if you want to pack for someone else, you have to demonstrate to a rigger or instructor that you can assemble the main parts of a rig (re-connect the 3 rings etc) untangle it and pack it. Once this has been demonstrated and signed off your good to go. So why the need to have a rigger constantly do this.

I'm a big believer in people packing their own kit, but this isn't always possible such as a team doing back to back lifts, camera guys jumping and speaking to customers or some people who simply do not want to or are unable to pack.

If you don't have a rigger on your dropzone well tough shit go somewhere else so someone can go pack your parachute for you despite the fact people who are fully capable of doing it are around...


Southern_Man  (C License)

Jan 8, 2013, 9:07 AM
Post #8 of 17 (1681 views)
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Re: [timgaines] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:

Why does being able to build a pilot chute, or repair a canopy/harness etc stop me from packing a main parachute for someone else?

Why doesn't somebody start a new thread (or revive one of the dozens already on here) about these sorts of questions and just use this one for helping the O.P. answer his question.


nigel99  (D 1)

Jan 8, 2013, 9:14 PM
Post #9 of 17 (1488 views)
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Re: [Mej] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

Australia - you have to be a member of the APF.

Packer B - allows you to pack student and tandem MAIN parachutes (as well as licensed jumpers - but at $45 a jump, people pack for themselves!)

Packer A - Allows you to pack RESERVE parachutes in addition to the privileges of packer B, but not to do repairs.

Rigger - As per the rest of the world.

PS. For a team you could probably get away without being a member. It would probably be difficult if there was a major problem like a fatality.


chedlin  (A 65914)

Jan 9, 2013, 7:30 AM
Post #10 of 17 (1392 views)
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Re: [piisfish] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

I tend to use packers so I can get on more loads. As I get more practice (yes, I'm working against myself) and can pack in 15 minutes I won't have to use them.


hillson  (D 33134)

Jan 9, 2013, 7:32 AM
Post #11 of 17 (1386 views)
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Re: [nigel99] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Packer B - allows you to pack student and tandem MAIN parachutes (as well as licensed jumpers - but at $45 a jump, people pack for themselves!)

Am I reading this correctly...even for sport jumpers it is $45 a pack job? If so...wowzers!


IanHarrop  (C 1152)

Jan 9, 2013, 7:35 AM
Post #12 of 17 (1382 views)
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Re: [hillson] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

I think its being suggested that jumps are already expensive ($45) so people tend to save $$$ on packing and do it themselves


hillson  (D 33134)

Jan 9, 2013, 7:39 AM
Post #13 of 17 (1374 views)
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Re: [IanHarrop] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

ahhh...got it. not enough coffee this morning.


nigel99  (D 1)

Jan 9, 2013, 5:21 PM
Post #14 of 17 (1285 views)
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Re: [IanHarrop] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I think its being suggested that jumps are already expensive ($45) so people tend to save $$$ on packing and do it themselves

Precisely - if it was $45 a pack job, i'd be doing more packingTongue


wasatchrider

Jan 9, 2013, 6:15 PM
Post #15 of 17 (1264 views)
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Re: [chedlin] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I tend to use packers so I can get on more loads. As I get more practice (yes, I'm working against myself) and can pack in 15 minutes I won't have to use them.

if you start packing for yourself you will be able to pack in less than 15 min after a few pack jobs

I never used a packer after my aff where it was mandatory and my pack jobs never took more than 15 maybe 20 min the fist couple


BlindBrick  (C 35382)

Jan 11, 2013, 8:15 PM
Post #16 of 17 (1110 views)
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Re: [huge] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I don't want to hijack the thread but I feel that there should be a Jr. Rigger rating to allow people to work as packers. Rating should allow them to do the basics like pack

The "Rigger" rating used to exist for that purpose but was done away with by the FAA which is why now the entry-level rigging rating is Sr. Rigger.

-BB


mark  (D 6108)

Jan 12, 2013, 12:51 AM
Post #17 of 17 (1046 views)
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Re: [BlindBrick] Rules For Non Skydiving Packers? [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
The "Rigger" rating used to exist for that purpose but was done away with by the FAA which is why now the entry-level rigging rating is Sr. Rigger.

-BB

Source?

Mark



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