Forums: Skydiving: Incidents:
Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012

 


Premier PhreeZone  (D License)
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Dec 30, 2012, 8:22 PM
Post #1 of 24 (5688 views)
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Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 Can't Post

I saw a blurb on Facebook and have had a few people ask me for details about a low turn that resulted in a broken femur today at the Sebastian Invasion boogie. I have no real details do if any has any please feel free to pass them along.


Premier PhreeZone  (D License)
Moderator
Jan 1, 2013, 3:13 PM
Post #2 of 24 (4853 views)
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Re: [PhreeZone] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

I had some one message me that the winds were strong enough that the DZ had a B license restriction in place and this jumper seemed to have stabbed a single toggle for no apparent reason not far off the ground. The DZ shortly after this raised the winds to a C and then a bit later to a D requirement and finally shut down for the day.




This is a situation that just because its a boogie it is not always a great idea to push the limits of what is safe.


danhack

Jan 2, 2013, 9:21 AM
Post #3 of 24 (4470 views)
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Re: [PhreeZone] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

was on the jump but didnt see the landing. think it turned into a B requirement when we were already on the plane but regardless everyone on the jump had B or higher. word was that he was on his base leg and didnt see another canopy that was on its final until they were really close and he dug a toggle to avoid the other person. again didnt see it and havent seen video so dont know if that rings true. regardless of the reason it was a low hook turn. dont think winds played a big factor as much as situational awareness/head-on-a-swivel, a smooth pattern and reacting properly to the situation did. last i heard that was broken: right pelvis, lower back and 2 ribs. had movement and feeling in feet though.

any info from someone who actually saw the landing would be appreciated


roostnureye  (D 32166)

Jan 2, 2013, 10:12 AM
Post #4 of 24 (4411 views)
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Re: [danhack] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

yesterday the boogie was on a hop n pop only weather hold, as i was at the bar, i saw a 4 way take it waay low, pulling about 1200-1400ish. two got opened fast and two sniveled. one snivler beat the aad, the other didnot. aad fire, two out, and a nice canopy transfer. uneventful landing


danhack

Jan 2, 2013, 10:18 AM
Post #5 of 24 (4393 views)
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Re: [roostnureye] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
yesterday the boogie was on a hop n pop only weather hold, as i was at the bar, i saw a 4 way take it waay low, pulling about 1200-1400ish. two got opened fast and two sniveled. one snivler beat the aad, the other didnot. aad fire, two out, and a nice canopy transfer. uneventful landing

this is a separate incident


kkeenan  (D 22164)

Jan 2, 2013, 10:19 AM
Post #6 of 24 (4388 views)
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Re: [roostnureye] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

Hey, when you get out low, you just have to get get that freefall time at the bottom of the dive. Those AADs have really messed up low pulls.


GoodGolly  (C 39320)

Jan 2, 2013, 10:44 AM
Post #7 of 24 (4346 views)
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Re: [danhack] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

He was not on a hop and pop load, that was a separate incident on a different day.

To add to what was mentioned above by danhack, the jumper involved has less that 100 jumps. The winds that day were pretty high but he was not on a wind hold (B license). Regardless, the winds were probably a bit much for his experience level and currency at the time. It was his first jump of the boogie and he was jumping a Spectre 190 and 1.18.

I can't comment on the actual incident because I didn't see it. All I know for sure is that it was a low turn and that it really messed him up. However, I wanted to post what I do know before people start speculating.

It's always a huge bummer to see something like this happen. I wish him a very quick recovery!


DougH  (D License)

Jan 3, 2013, 7:50 AM
Post #8 of 24 (3986 views)
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Re: [GoodGolly] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

Wings level! Gentle braked turns... only the minimum heading change needed.

If you plan ahead, and keep thinking ahead of the canopy you can avoid most bad situations on landing. Be ahead of the curve and you won't find yourself down wind, crossing the runway at 200 feet, and flying towards the mock up.

Even when you have a brain fart, or your head is up your ass and you didn't plan at all, you can avoid most injuries from a bad situation by keeping your wings level!

Down wind... into a ditch... onto the runway... into the the spectator area... it is amazing what you can survive, mostly in one piece, if you resist the urge to make a panic turn because you screwed up, and your flying somewhere shitty.

I hope the jumper makes a full recovery. Unsure


(This post was edited by DougH on Jan 3, 2013, 7:52 AM)


hillson  (D 33134)

Jan 4, 2013, 7:43 AM
Post #9 of 24 (3677 views)
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Re: [PhreeZone] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

Came across it while reading something else. Jumper was Stephen Spradling, FSU baseball player. Injuries: broken pelvis, broken hips, broken ribs and a broken bone in his back.

I'm guessing this is the guy as it is the same date, same general circumstances (it seems) and he was taken to the hospital in Melbourne - right up the road.

http://www.tallahassee.com/...-sky-diving-accident

http://www.wctv.tv/...5622921.html?ref=921


wwelbon  (D 30622)

Jan 4, 2013, 7:49 AM
Post #10 of 24 (3672 views)
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Re: [hillson] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

Yeah this is the same guy.


Scrumpot  (D License)

Jan 4, 2013, 10:22 AM
Post #11 of 24 (3573 views)
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Re: [GoodGolly] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

Resisting the "I must jump - because I just got to this really cool boogie" (or any applicable "excuse" - pick whatever incents you) - and having the discipline to stand-down on higher-wind, or even "borderline" wind days is key here. It's tough to do. Trust me - I *KNOW*.

Especially for lower-experienced jumpers, the 1st time you maybe "push" this just a little - and you are on that downwind leg, and the ground is seemingly SCREAMING past you - the urge to bury that toggle (because too, at this point, that is all you know) to "get back into the wind", can be indeed very tough to resist.

No need to ask me what I did to myself back in the day, on my 96th jump to tell you how (again) I happen *KNOW* this. Angelic Tongue

<<<Vibes>>> to the injured jumper for a hopefully speedy, and full recovery.


DougH  (D License)

Jan 4, 2013, 12:38 PM
Post #12 of 24 (3448 views)
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Re: [Scrumpot] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

From Pops:

Quote:
Printed in the Tampa Bay Times this morning. I didn't find teh story in the on-line version.

FSU reserve outfielder hurt while skydiving.....Stephen Spradling

Pelvis, hips, ribs, and back. Taken to Melbourne, FL hospital. Drs say he'll be able to walk again.

Hard-stabbing turn to avoid a head-on canopy collision at 100 ft. Other jumper landed no problem.

Does any one have any additional information about the possible near collision?


Scrumpot  (D License)

Jan 4, 2013, 2:53 PM
Post #13 of 24 (3334 views)
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Re: [DougH] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

Just from what I have heard - the jumper did have "other canopies coming at him", because they were already (correctly) on final, and the injured subject jumper had gotten "deep" in his pattern and trying to still make / land in the main landing area, but low (and fast now as a result) in his downwind leg. Based on what has at least been communicated to me (3rd hand - so apologies in advance if it is not 100% accurate) - as he recognized this (mid-field) he "panic-turned" himself directly into the ground, in "converging traffic".


skinnay

Jan 4, 2013, 9:52 PM
Post #14 of 24 (3169 views)
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Re: [PhreeZone] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

The jumper was not coming straight in on final. It looked like it was crosswind or close to crosswind. he made a hard left turn at about 50 feet to face the wind and impacted in a steep dive. several canopies were landing at the same time so it was a bit congested. he may not have realized he was coming in at an angle. the jumper bounced, front flipped, and lay motionless. He's lucky to be alive.

Winds were strong and gusty, I was surprised how many people were jumping. While the wind did not directly cause this, it was the perfect environment to get injured. Almost the entire day before had also been on a weather hold and everyone was anxious to jump. Never be afraid to sit out a boogie, even if its the entire week.


Cutaway68  (D 29478)

Jan 5, 2013, 5:25 PM
Post #15 of 24 (2864 views)
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Re: [PhreeZone] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

http://sports.yahoo.com/...ident-224836747.html


popsjumper  (D 999999999)

Jan 5, 2013, 6:27 PM
Post #16 of 24 (2805 views)
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Re: [Cutaway68] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post


"Spradling was apparently about 100 feet from the ground preparing to land when he spotted another skydiver coming straight at him. A collision likely would have killed both of them, so Spradling pulled hard on his chute but hit the ground extremely hard. "



Hmmmmm...


AlRedler  (D 6021)

Jan 6, 2013, 9:30 PM
Post #17 of 24 (2525 views)
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Re: [popsjumper] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

Interesting question raised here, that I had to make a couple of years ago. If you are low on final turn such that a crosswind or part crosswind landing is looking necessary, and then you notice another canopy on correct approach that you cannot guarantee avoiding colliding with, do you make the turn that you may well not be able to land in order to avoid the collision? There is very little time to make that decision, and if the other jumper is below they will have no warning if they or their canopy is hit.

Putting aside whether you should have been in that position, I think avoiding hurting or killing someone else must be the priority. If that was the case here, good on him.

Here's hoping for a swift and full recovery.


(This post was edited by AlRedler on Jan 6, 2013, 9:31 PM)




theonlyski  (D License)

Jan 10, 2013, 4:57 AM
Post #19 of 24 (1998 views)
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Re: [AlRedler] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Putting aside whether you should have been in that position, I think avoiding hurting or killing someone else must be the priority. If that was the case here, good on him.

I would rather end up in a hospital because I had to give someone a better chance of walking away than live with the knowledge that I caused serious injury to a person.

I did have an event, last year I believe, where I was coming in on final, look up and a guy is heading right at me. (I was in the correct pattern, he was a visiting low time jumper booking it down wind). I put enough of a turn in to avoid him and he still hooked it pretty low. No injuries, but I thought for sure he wasn't going to pull that off.


AlRedler  (D 6021)

Jan 10, 2013, 1:33 PM
Post #20 of 24 (1830 views)
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Re: [theonlyski] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

Exactly. I did put myself in hospital doing just that. My fault, so no complaints. A broken femur was a good result in the end. Hurting someone else must be avoided.


Pendragon  (D 104102)

Jan 11, 2013, 10:22 AM
Post #21 of 24 (1562 views)
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Re: [AlRedler] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Interesting question raised here, that I had to make a couple of years ago. If you are low on final turn such that a crosswind or part crosswind landing is looking necessary, and then you notice another canopy on correct approach that you cannot guarantee avoiding colliding with, do you make the turn that you may well not be able to land in order to avoid the collision? There is very little time to make that decision, and if the other jumper is below they will have no warning if they or their canopy is hit.

You have descent rate and speed to play with, as well as direction.

My likely response would be deep brakes and a flat carving turn (as little as necessary) followed by a PLF in anticipation of a damped flare. Carving on rear risers may be another option, although that's probably best left to those that really understand what they're doing with their canopies!

As with all these things, prevention is always the best - and each jumper should try and maintain awareness of where everyone else on the load is in the sky under canopy.


Rich2

Mar 19, 2013, 10:24 AM
Post #22 of 24 (1038 views)
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Re: [PhreeZone] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

Saw this update on the guy:

http://www.wptv.com/...ydive-crash-recovery


(This post was edited by Rich2 on Mar 19, 2013, 10:25 AM)


DougH  (D License)

Mar 19, 2013, 10:58 AM
Post #23 of 24 (1000 views)
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Re: [Rich2] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:

I wish him the best of luck as he works through his recovery. It sounds like he has a great attitude and has a good head on his shoulders.

Smile


bilt2ride  (C 40336)

Mar 23, 2013, 7:59 PM
Post #24 of 24 (702 views)
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Re: [danhack] Injury - Sebastian FL - 30 December 2012 [In reply to] Can't Post

We were set up in the front corner near manifest and watched the entire incident. We were not jumping due to the winds. It happened right in front of us across the runway. Out of the three of us who saw it not a single one saw any canopy close to him. It looked as though he turned to land into the wind. We were scratching our heads at the news of him trying to avoid someone.



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