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Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition

 

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Premier slotperfect  (D 13014)
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Dec 12, 2012, 7:08 AM
Post #1 of 39 (3205 views)
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Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition Can't Post

Skydive City (ZHills) is faced with a potential Airport Access issue . . . the City of Zephyrhills wants to fence off the airport (at extreme hardship to the dropzone).

DZO David "TK" Hayes has posted a Change.org online petition, and is garnering support from all skydivers for this Airport Access cause. Read about the issue using the following link . . . a link to the petition is on the page.

http://www.icontact-archive.com/...TaLsoaf9Nc-lxwNX?w=2

Spread the word . . . stop the madness. Crazy


Premier slotperfect  (D 13014)
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Dec 12, 2012, 7:15 AM
Post #2 of 39 (3167 views)
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Re: [slotperfect] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

A news article on the subject:

http://www2.tbo.com/...port-fenc-ar-399253/


(This post was edited by slotperfect on Dec 12, 2012, 7:15 AM)


piisfish

Dec 12, 2012, 7:16 AM
Post #3 of 39 (3162 views)
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Re: [slotperfect] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

unfortunately cannot sign from work, as the system does not like Internet Explorer


DougH  (D License)

Dec 12, 2012, 7:36 AM
Post #4 of 39 (3122 views)
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Re: [piisfish] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

We have one of those shiny TSA fences at our airport, complete with automated gates and keycard readers. What a waste!Crazy


Southern_Man  (C License)

Dec 12, 2012, 7:40 AM
Post #5 of 39 (3119 views)
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Re: [slotperfect] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Skydive City (ZHills) is faced with a potential Airport Access issue . . . the City of Zephyrhills wants to fence off the airport (at extreme hardship to the dropzone).

I've read the article. Can somebody explain to me why this is an airport access issue or an extreme hardship to Skydive City? I've jumped at a number of airports that have a fence and it can be a little inconvenient, depending on the particulars but I would not call it an extreme hardship. Is there something specific about the SDC that makes it so?


DougH  (D License)

Dec 12, 2012, 8:35 AM
Post #6 of 39 (3082 views)
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Re: [Southern_Man] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

From reading the news article it sounds like a portion of ZHills operation would be inside the fence, and a portion of the operation would be outside the fence.

One of the things I liked about ZHills was the open feel to the facility. I doubt it would have nearly the same feeling if it was ringed by a fence!

As a whole they suck, they isolate and airport, and shut off the businesses from the rest of the area.


normiss  (D 28356)

Dec 12, 2012, 8:41 AM
Post #7 of 39 (3066 views)
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Re: [Southern_Man] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

I keep asking the same thing.
Nobody can or doesn't want to provide the technical information regarding the fence I think.

I jump at plenty of airports with fencing and access areas. No issue to jumping at all.
Ask Deland, ask Sebastian for two fine neighbors as a comparison.

I can't vote until I know more detail. The last time we bitched about a fence there, it was simply to protect the water supply and it was a cube. No hazard at all.


BillyVance  (D 18895)

Dec 12, 2012, 11:33 AM
Post #8 of 39 (2974 views)
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Re: [slotperfect] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

Can't they change the fence to include the entire DZ? Wouldn't that simplify/eliminate the issue?

Provided that there is access to the DZ to begin with...


(This post was edited by BillyVance on Dec 12, 2012, 11:34 AM)


normiss  (D 28356)

Dec 12, 2012, 1:32 PM
Post #9 of 39 (2924 views)
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Re: [BillyVance] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

This.

I was told the city plans on putting the fence right along the beer line. Crazy

That's just fucking stupid.


DougH  (D License)

Dec 12, 2012, 3:02 PM
Post #10 of 39 (2896 views)
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Re: [normiss] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

Wow, that is pretty fucking stupid!

A... some one at the town council wants to piss in TK's cheerios.

or

B... some one at the town council has a relative who sells and installs chain link security fences.


pchapman  (D 1014)

Dec 12, 2012, 4:26 PM
Post #11 of 39 (2868 views)
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Re: [slotperfect] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

Is it just the City of Zhills doing this on a whim or is there something behind it? DHS? FAA? Federal funding?

I've been at a couple medium sized airports (in Canada) that got fenced in over the last 10 years and it is a pain to walk from one hangar area to another, or to even walk around a hangar & office area as there are fences separating 'airside' from 'out back'.

If this is anything but a whim by someone on city council, I bet this will have to be fought with meetings & facts & graphs & comparisons to other businesses & airports, not by a list of skydiver names.


tkhayes  (D 18764)

Dec 13, 2012, 4:20 AM
Post #12 of 39 (2766 views)
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Re: [slotperfect] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

The proposed fence is a 6' chain link fence that would effectively cut north-south from the tree line south, across the beer line, keeping the RV park outside, cutting off the Swoop pond and then to the hangar. (Approximately 1000' of fence)

A second leg from the hangar north to the tree line and then continuing around the tree line to the rest of the airport.

This puts ALL of Skydive City's structures outside the fence, except the front of the hangar. Gate access to go to and from the boarding area and the landing area only in front of the deck, but they did say they could add additional gates as necessary.

(To which I always say "If you are going to put a gate wherever I want one, then want is the point of the fence?")

Things they cannot seem to get over: 1) that an RV Park could exist inside the fence, and 2) that skydivers are some sort of risk and thus must be kept outside the fence.

Our compromise is to put a fence around the perimeter of the AIRPORT, not Skydive City and then if they want, some sort of gate access on the road that allows customers to come and go. When inside, they are 'on the airport'

Our property is in fact, 'on the airport', and our lease states all the activities we can do, including an RV park, a restaurant, sales, aircraft operations, fire pit, camping, etc - EVERYTHING is allowed in the lease, and the lease is for AIRPORT property, therefore we argue that we are, in fact, part of the 'airport' and therefore authorized to be there.

Not to mention the fact that the fence effectively subdivides land that we lease, rendering it useless except for the fence, with no compensation offered of any kind.

And the City does actually have the right to do this, they can do pretty much whatever they want, but they are hiding behind a 'mandate from the Florida DOT' and say they are being forced to do this. This statement is patently false and there is no mandate from ANY govt entity forcing anyone to build a fence or fence us out, the decision is ultimately up to the City what they want to do for security. But the grant is for fencing and only fencing.

No one wants to see the grant money go away, not even the politicians that are on our side - we get that.

We do not object to security, we we also argue that all skydivers, residents, and students that come to Skydive City are thoroughly vetted through registration and we collect more about them than any other business on the airport that simply has customers come and go. The security risk is NOT from us or our customers and TSA/DHS/FAA documents state the same fact - airport tenants are NOT the risk here.

Lots more to it of course, but this will cramp our business and slow down the operation. We may have to cancel the CP Nationals in May if they build a fence that interferes with the swoop pond and creates a hazard. We are under contractual obligation to host it. The City might be able to build a fence, but that also does not free them of the tortuous consequences if they do so.


muff528  (D 17609)

Dec 13, 2012, 4:55 AM
Post #13 of 39 (2742 views)
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Re: [tkhayes] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

If security is really the concern, the city could fence all the airport property northwest of runway 4-22 and leave the rest of the airport alone. They could have some nice gates or openings at the taxiways for access to the runway for the GA folks and the security guard would not have to patrol such a large perimeter. For security purposes, this would encompass all of their buildings, planes, etc. and would actually provide greater control over security for them and their lessees' property (IMO). They almost never use 18-36 anyway. Maybe another fence around the water treatment plant if they want to use up more grant money.

I suspect that "No one wants to see the grant money go away..." has a lot (everything) to do with it. Why fret over losing grant money for a fence that is not wanted or needed?


tkhayes  (D 18764)

Dec 13, 2012, 5:02 AM
Post #14 of 39 (2738 views)
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Re: [muff528] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

2/3 to 3/4 of the airport IS already fenced in, all around the GA areas and over near 4/22. Even that is silly.

Open gates allow people to come and go, and when you hit the buzzer to get int through a drive-through gate, they just opn it without even asking who you are.....


muff528  (D 17609)

Dec 13, 2012, 5:07 AM
Post #15 of 39 (2732 views)
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Re: [tkhayes] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
2/3 to 3/4 of the airport IS already fenced in, all around the GA areas and over near 4/22. Even that is silly.

Open gates allow people to come and go, and when you hit the buzzer to get int through a drive-through gate, they just opn it without even asking who you are.....

Well then, problem solved. The city needs to turn down the grant money and move on to the next crisis. Wink


Premier slotperfect  (D 13014)
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Dec 13, 2012, 5:11 AM
Post #16 of 39 (2731 views)
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Re: [tkhayes] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

TK - I would suggest creating a slide or photo using Google Earth imagery showing the fence line. For those of us who have been there, it is very easy to understand just by description. For those who haven't been in a long time, or haven't been at all, it would provide clear understanding of the impact to Skydive City.


jonstark  (D 8298)

Dec 13, 2012, 6:01 AM
Post #17 of 39 (2693 views)
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Re: [slotperfect] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

see attached...
Attachments: small TSA cartoon.jpg (167 KB)


MakeItHappen

Dec 13, 2012, 6:38 AM
Post #18 of 39 (2660 views)
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Re: [tkhayes] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
... But the grant is for fencing and only fencing.

....

Would the grant cover the fence around the entire airport or do they run out of money?

.


TomSpoon  (D 20967)

Dec 13, 2012, 6:42 AM
Post #19 of 39 (2657 views)
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Re: [normiss] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

The issue is not about the fence being a hardship to Skydive City. The issue is that No fence is needed or required at all. Ask any tenant at the airport. Stop the madness.


tkhayes  (D 18764)

Dec 13, 2012, 7:11 AM
Post #20 of 39 (2638 views)
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Re: [TomSpoon] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

The hardship issue will actually be the only issue that we will have left to argue. Yes we all know the fence is ridiculous; even the people that are building it and paying for it - but the 'madness' will not actually stop.

The security freight train is here and steamrolling over everything and no one is going to stand in the way of that, regardless of whether the country is broke, regardless of whether the fence provides no security, regardless of whether everyone thinks it is stupid.


Southern_Man  (C License)

Dec 13, 2012, 9:31 AM
Post #21 of 39 (2597 views)
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Re: [tkhayes] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

T.K,

thanks for the detailed explanation, that all makes a lot more sense now.

I think the whole airport fencing business is silly (I agree w/ you on the security madness) but virtually impossible to stop. I hope you are able to get it changed so it does not impact your business.


tkhayes  (D 18764)

Dec 13, 2012, 10:28 AM
Post #22 of 39 (2580 views)
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Re: [MakeItHappen] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

One of their arguments is that they do not have enough money to fence the entire airport property. Our response was "How much do you need?"

So far no response, which leads us to believe that this is NOT the issue, that their true intention is to fence us out.


stratostar  (Student)

Dec 13, 2012, 11:25 AM
Post #23 of 39 (2538 views)
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Re: [tkhayes] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

Franks place still for sale? Maybe find you some acres for a better return on the investment in the long run then investing in a part of fence. The real problem will never go away, till you go away.


normiss  (D 28356)

Dec 13, 2012, 2:04 PM
Post #24 of 39 (2484 views)
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Re: [tkhayes] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

I hear the FAA is fucked if the fiscal cliff happens...maybe you should hope for that?!
Laugh


TomSpoon  (D 20967)

Dec 13, 2012, 4:22 PM
Post #25 of 39 (2413 views)
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Re: [tkhayes] Skydive City (ZHills) Airport Access - Please Sign Petition [In reply to] Can't Post

There is a Zephyrhills Airport Authority meeting on December 17th. 5:30 PM. Robert H Johnson council chambers of the Municipal building.
Attachments: 12-17-12 Agenda.doc (29.5 KB)


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