Forums: Skydiving: Tandem Skydiving:
Personal tandem rig

 


jzzsxm  (A License)

Nov 10, 2012, 12:25 PM
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Personal tandem rig Can't Post

Has anybody/do people ever get their tandem certification, buy their own tandem rig,and use it just to take their friends skydiving? Would a DZ allow this if they paid for two tickets instead of a tandem ticket or would they prohibit it because of the loss of tandem ticket sale?


FlyingRhenquest  (B 37920)

Nov 10, 2012, 12:36 PM
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I wouldn't want to speak for the home DZ, but I would _guess_ that they'd prohibit it for liability concerns. Friend of mine has a D license and instructor certifications but they wouldn't let him do coaching jumps with me unless he was an employee there. And although taking work away from their coaches may be a concern, I really do think that it's more an issue of liability and risk for them. Some of their neighbors already hate them plenty without bad press to fan the flames.


Mr_Polite  (D 420)

Nov 10, 2012, 12:45 PM
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It depends on the DZ. I know of a few people that own a Tandem rig and use it at different dz's for this reason.

Also if you own your own tandem rig and do tandems at a dz you will get paid more per tandem because your using your own equipment. Again this is going to vary dz to dz.


pchapman  (D 1014)

Nov 10, 2012, 2:58 PM
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Re: [jzzsxm] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

Too expensive (compared to regular gear) and too limited in its use (compared to, say, a 2 seat airplane) for people to buy "to take their friends" skydiving. If someone buys (and maintains) a whole rig for themselves, it is normally a business decision.

The few guys I know who have their own rig either are full time skydivers who move around with the seasons, or got into the tandem business early, before every DZ had a pile of them (and so were a sort of specialist professional).


rowet  (D License)

Nov 10, 2012, 5:36 PM
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Re: [FlyingRhenquest] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I wouldn't want to speak for the home DZ, but I would _guess_ that they'd prohibit it for liability concerns. Friend of mine has a D license and instructor certifications but they wouldn't let him do coaching jumps with me unless he was an employee there. And although taking work away from their coaches may be a concern, I really do think that it's more an issue of liability and risk for them. Some of their neighbors already hate them plenty without bad press to fan the flames.

HAHAHA Mile high won't let friend jump with friends that is why. It is a crime that they charge like 200 bucks for a recurrency jump there.


fcajump  (D 15598)

Dec 10, 2012, 2:49 PM
Post #6 of 17 (1749 views)
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Re: [jzzsxm] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Has anybody/do people ever get their tandem certification, buy their own tandem rig,and use it just to take their friends skydiving? Would a DZ allow this if they paid for two tickets instead of a tandem ticket or would they prohibit it because of the loss of tandem ticket sale?

Kinda...

I made a deal with my local DZO who (at the time) could use extra instructors...

I got my rating, I bought my rig. When I had friends I could bring them out and take them at cost doing all the work myself on my own rig.
When he had need of additional instructor help, I would take his students on my rig under his program and he paid me as instructor, packer and rig rental.

Now... was this financially profitable? Not really. When I got married, I sold the rig. I suspect it all paid for itself, but I certainly didn't make a bunch on it.

What it did for me and the DZO:
One more rig, packer and instructor when he needed more capacity without him having to buy another rig.
An instructor that would disappear when times were lean... no bitching about not getting work.
Two slots sold anytime I brought out a friend who would "only jump with" me...
I had the comfort of always being 100% sure I knew the history, condition and pack job/style of the rig.

However, while another local DZ (whose rigs were trashed) kept calling for me to teach, they balked when I said "sure... but I use only my rig". They kept calling, I kept laying down the condition, they kept balking... until they went out of business completely. Crazy

Just 1 TI's experience....

JW

PS - I'm back in the market for a Strong DHT for exactly this same use... or maybe a TNT?? Cool


swoopfly  (E License)

Dec 22, 2012, 11:49 PM
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Re: [jzzsxm] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

I know a few who bought there own tandem rig. I'm contemplating buying one myself and with good reasons. A big reason is knowing your own gear and knowing what's coming out the bag every time. As a traveling instructor I jump all types of gear, brand new to worn out. Also you get at average $15 extra per tandem jump towards your own equipment used. So after the first thousand tandems your new rig just paid for itself, after the next thousand you just profited 15 thousand. The downside to this tho is I can already show up to the dz and make money with no investment using their gear. And as far as taking friends, all up to the Dzo.


davelepka  (D 21448)

Dec 23, 2012, 8:50 AM
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Re: [jzzsxm] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

 
FYI, a new tandem rig is $15k. How many friends do you have that you want to take up for a tandem that you want to spend $15k up front to be able to do that.

On top of that, is the fact that you need to get your rating, and that costs money to get and to renew every year.

At the end of that, you're going to suck as an instructor. Take a guy who does 20 tandems per week, and a guy who only takes his friends, and you tell me who the better instructor is likely to be.


riggerrob  (D 14840)

Dec 23, 2012, 11:19 PM
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Re: [swoopfly] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

You still have to pay for Cypres batteries and factory inspections.
Then you have to replace drogues and risers and main d-bags after 600 jumps. Main suspension lines only last 350 jumps (Dacron or Spectra) to 1000 jumps (the latest and fanciest Vectran).
Then you have to pay a rigger to do 25 jump inspections and repack the reserve every 180 days, then you have to ship Strong rigs back to the factory after 8 years and 12 years.
Bottom line, tandem rigs require so much expensive maintenance that few skydivers can afford to buy "toys" to only take their friends for fun jumps.

Rob Warner
Vector and Sigma TI
Racer Tandem Check Pilot
Strong Tandem Examiner
FAA Master Rigger


swoopfly  (E License)

Dec 24, 2012, 5:32 AM
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Re: [riggerrob] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

I agree, ....if you got a rating only to take your 5 friends you could actually talk into jumping, buying a rig would be ridiculous. now if you bought a rig because you got your rating and will be doing 1000 tandems a year, might could work in your favor.


Squeak  (E 1313)

Dec 25, 2012, 2:18 AM
Post #11 of 17 (1259 views)
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Re: [swoopfly] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I know a few who bought there own tandem rig. I'm contemplating buying one myself and with good reasons. A big reason is knowing your own gear and knowing what's coming out the bag every time. As a traveling instructor I jump all types of gear, brand new to worn out. Also you get at average $15 extra per tandem jump towards your own equipment used. So after the first thousand tandems your new rig just paid for itself, after the next thousand you just profited 15 thousand. The downside to this tho is I can already show up to the dz and make money with no investment using their gear. And as far as taking friends, all up to the Dzo.
you haven't factored in service and replacement costs into your little money making scenarioWink


Premier SkymonkeyONE  (D 12501)

Dec 26, 2012, 9:31 AM
Post #12 of 17 (1183 views)
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Re: [jzzsxm] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Has anybody/do people ever get their tandem certification, buy their own tandem rig,and use it just to take their friends skydiving? Would a DZ allow this if they paid for two tickets instead of a tandem ticket or would they prohibit it because of the loss of tandem ticket sale?

DZ policies vary WILDLY. I've worked at dropzones ( like Z-Hills) where I was permitted to do my own AFF and tandems so long as my students signed the DZ waiver and I was paying full-price tickets for all slots. I've also worked at dropzones where I had to pay the DZ a "facility usage fee" (I think we used to have to pay $40 at Raeford if we were not staff) to use our own gear.

As far as owning your own rig goes, I recommend it if you are a travelling full-time skydiver and can afford one. I've not worked at a dropzone where I didn't have the option of using my own rig and getting paid to do so. Most dropzones which allow it will pay you what they normally pay themselves for the gear maintenance upkeep portion of a tandem jump. I've been paid both $25 per jump and $40 per jump to use my own rig. If you DO own your own tandem rig you can BET YOUR ASS you are going to need that money for upkeep (like Rob Warner discussed). Personally, though, if I'm at a dropzone with fantastic gear and superior upkeep (like Eloy, San Marcos, or Raeford), then I'm just going to use their gear and keep the wear off of mine so that I can use it at boogies.

Chuck Blue, D-12501
Vector/Sigma/Eclipse/Multi-Mission/Racer-I


JohnMitchell  (D 6462)

Dec 27, 2012, 8:46 PM
Post #13 of 17 (1125 views)
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Re: [SkymonkeyONE] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I've been paid both $25 per jump and $40 per jump to use my own rig.
I wouldn't do it for a dime less. The $15 quoted a few posts above is not enough to maintain the rig and make a profit on your large investment. Why spend $15K to break even or go slowly broke.


In reply to:
If you DO own your own tandem rig you can BET YOUR ASS you are going to need that money for upkeep (like Rob Warner discussed). Personally, though, if I'm at a dropzone with fantastic gear and superior upkeep (like Eloy, San Marcos, or Raeford), then I'm just going to use their gear and keep the wear off of mine so that I can use it at boogies.
I know one instructor who must own the first Vector tandem made. Do you think he saved a nickel to replace that sad old thing? Crazy


swoopfly  (E License)

Dec 28, 2012, 8:40 AM
Post #14 of 17 (1067 views)
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Re: [Squeak] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
I know a few who bought there own tandem rig. I'm contemplating buying one myself and with good reasons. A big reason is knowing your own gear and knowing what's coming out the bag every time. As a traveling instructor I jump all types of gear, brand new to worn out. Also you get at average $15 extra per tandem jump towards your own equipment used. So after the first thousand tandems your new rig just paid for itself, after the next thousand you just profited 15 thousand. The downside to this tho is I can already show up to the dz and make money with no investment using their gear. And as far as taking friends, all up to the Dzo.
you haven't factored in service and costs into your little money making scenarioWink

Your right, i figured maintenance is a known. So what would you add the maintence cost at for 2000 jumps? Subtract that from 15000. Even after cost if you only made 5000 and a tandem rig, i think thats a good outcome considering you were making those 2000 tandem jumps regardless. So make 2000 tandems on dz gear and make average pay, or make those same 2000 tandems and have an extra 5000 and your own personal tandem rig at the end along with your average pay. To some people who skydive as a career , it makes sense. Now add in that you bought a vigil and are your own rigger and you can come out pretty good.


theonlyski  (D License)

Dec 28, 2012, 12:34 PM
Post #15 of 17 (1033 views)
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Re: [swoopfly] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
In reply to:
I know a few who bought there own tandem rig. I'm contemplating buying one myself and with good reasons. A big reason is knowing your own gear and knowing what's coming out the bag every time. As a traveling instructor I jump all types of gear, brand new to worn out. Also you get at average $15 extra per tandem jump towards your own equipment used. So after the first thousand tandems your new rig just paid for itself, after the next thousand you just profited 15 thousand. The downside to this tho is I can already show up to the dz and make money with no investment using their gear. And as far as taking friends, all up to the Dzo.
you haven't factored in service and costs into your little money making scenarioWink

Your right, i figured maintenance is a known. So what would you add the maintence cost at for 2000 jumps? Subtract that from 15000. Even after cost if you only made 5000 and a tandem rig, i think thats a good outcome considering you were making those 2000 tandem jumps regardless. So make 2000 tandems on dz gear and make average pay, or make those same 2000 tandems and have an extra 5000 and your own personal tandem rig at the end along with your average pay. To some people who skydive as a career , it makes sense. Now add in that you bought a vigil and are your own rigger and you can come out pretty good.

I own my own tandem rig, am my own rigger and my rig has a Vigil2 in it.

Huge potential downside is if it gets chopped (I rent my gear to the DZ some times when they don't have enough on line), then I'm out for a drogue, disk, bridle, d-bag, main, risers and possibly the freebag assembly... Until it's found (if ever).

If that happened, I'd part out what's left and hope I didn't end up too far in the hole.



2000 jumps would probably be looking at a main line set or two, couple drogue kill lines, couple main closing loops, 3 or so drogues. Easily $2500.


(This post was edited by theonlyski on Dec 28, 2012, 12:36 PM)


Premier rwieder  (C 32349)

Dec 29, 2012, 12:17 AM
Post #16 of 17 (972 views)
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Re: [jzzsxm] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

I've seen it and it caused no problems whatsoever. This particular TM1 owned his own Tandem Rig, Harness and he is a Lawyer to boot. Great Skydiver / Trainer, etc....


JohnMitchell  (D 6462)

Dec 29, 2012, 9:18 AM
Post #17 of 17 (924 views)
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Re: [theonlyski] Personal tandem rig [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
I own my own tandem rig, am my own rigger and my rig has a Vigil2 in it.

Huge potential downside is if it gets chopped (I rent my gear to the DZ some times when they don't have enough on line), then I'm out for a drogue, disk, bridle, d-bag, main, risers and possibly the freebag assembly... Until it's found (if ever).

If that happened, I'd part out what's left and hope I didn't end up too far in the hole.



2000 jumps would probably be looking at a main line set or two, couple drogue kill lines, couple main closing loops, 3 or so drogues. Easily $2500.
I'm not a rigger, but wouldn't the main be pretty close to being retired after 2000 jumps?

And you're right about the risk of losing your stuff on a chop. That's a big investment with a fair amount of risk. I'd want a decent return on it.



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