Forums: Skydiving Disciplines: Wing Suit Flying:
Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD!

 

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medusa  (D 27526)

Oct 18, 2012, 9:12 PM
Post #1 of 169 (5283 views)
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     Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD!  

We where all in cable cars going up witnessing some jumpers come underneath us and gaining altitud. Ask any of the competitors of the WWL.

People can disagree and use all kind of arguments, but one thing is for sure. We are gaining altitude.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VigfXe1vhYg


Shredex

Oct 18, 2012, 9:18 PM
Post #2 of 169 (5223 views)
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     Re: [medusa] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

Thank you. :P


phoenixlpr  (D 3049)

Oct 18, 2012, 11:33 PM
Post #3 of 169 (5167 views)
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     Re: [medusa] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

In reply to:
We where all in cable cars going up witnessing some jumpers come underneath us and gaining altitud. Ask any of the competitors of the WWL.

People can disagree and use all kind of arguments, but one thing is for sure. We are gaining altitude.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VigfXe1vhYg

CGI! Tongue


johnmatrix  (D 9999)

Oct 19, 2012, 4:39 AM
Post #4 of 169 (5086 views)
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     Re: [medusa] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

That footage is insane.


Cool


kallend  (D 23151)

Oct 19, 2012, 7:40 AM
Post #5 of 169 (5011 views)
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     Re: [medusa] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

In reply to:
We where all in cable cars going up witnessing some jumpers come underneath us and gaining altitud. Ask any of the competitors of the WWL.

People can disagree and use all kind of arguments, but one thing is for sure. We are gaining altitude.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VigfXe1vhYg

Cool!


LukeH  (D License)

Oct 19, 2012, 7:43 AM
Post #6 of 169 (5007 views)
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     Re: [medusa] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

Oh wait... you're right wingsuits have been flying up for years...
https://vimeo.com/17074287
Crazy

It's possible to build energy in a WS by diving and flare out to a temporary low fallrate, level flight or a small climb but it requires a significant dive and flare, just like any other wing. Where is the boogie man you've invented that is denies this?

What you are trying to portray is that the smoke trail proves a climb, it doesn't. In your above video (which has the camera below and looking up), it's even clearer that it shows a turn towards and then away from the camera.

"Fact: Camera on level" Really? Get your eyes tested.

There are 3 possibilities, this is a windup, you are really dumb or you're just using this to promote false info knowing it's not true. I doubt you are that dumb, so I'd guess a combination of the other two.


Premier WickedWingsuits  (D 30916)

Oct 19, 2012, 7:53 AM
Post #7 of 169 (4998 views)
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     Re: [LukeH] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

In reply to:
Oh wait... you're right wingsuits have been flying up for years...
https://vimeo.com/17074287
Crazy

It's possible to build energy in a WS by diving and flare out to a temporary low fallrate, level flight or a small climb but it requires a significant dive and flare, just like any other wing. Where is the boogie man you've invented that is denies this?

What you are trying to portray is that the smoke trail proves a climb, it doesn't. In your above video (which has the camera below and looking up), it's even clearer that it shows a turn towards and then away from the camera.

"Fact: Camera on level" Really? Get your eyes tested.

There are 3 possibilities, this is a windup, you are really dumb or you're just using this to promote false info knowing it's not true. I doubt you are that dumb, so I'd guess a combination of the other two.

Some of us have seen this with our own eyes and hearing someone argue so strongly against it is kind of comical.

Of course some people also don't think the evidence of dinosaurs is conclusive. Each to their own! It wouldn't be any fun if we all agreed.


piisfish

Oct 19, 2012, 8:11 AM
Post #8 of 169 (4980 views)
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     Re: [WickedWingsuits] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

In reply to:
It wouldn't be any fun if we all agreed.
Yes it would http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQFKtI6gn9Y


Premier WickedWingsuits  (D 30916)

Oct 19, 2012, 8:24 AM
Post #9 of 169 (4967 views)
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     Re: [piisfish] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

In reply to:
In reply to:
It wouldn't be any fun if we all agreed.
Yes it would http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQFKtI6gn9Y

I thought this might be in the style of Monty Python...and I didn't get a surprise! Nice.


normiss  (D 28356)

Oct 19, 2012, 8:52 AM
Post #10 of 169 (4947 views)
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     Re: [WickedWingsuits] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

No it isn't.


RyanFYF  (C 41792)

Oct 19, 2012, 10:04 AM
Post #11 of 169 (4896 views)
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     Re: [WickedWingsuits] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

cant someone just jump with a camera on the altimeter? seems like that would be the most conclusive


nickfrey

Oct 19, 2012, 12:16 PM
Post #12 of 169 (4843 views)
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     Re: [LukeH] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

In reply to:
Oh wait... you're right wingsuits have been flying up for years...
https://vimeo.com/17074287
Crazy

It's possible to build energy in a WS by diving and flare out to a temporary low fallrate, level flight or a small climb but it requires a significant dive and flare, just like any other wing. Where is the boogie man you've invented that is denies this?

What you are trying to portray is that the smoke trail proves a climb, it doesn't. In your above video (which has the camera below and looking up), it's even clearer that it shows a turn towards and then away from the camera.

"Fact: Camera on level" Really? Get your eyes tested.

There are 3 possibilities, this is a windup, you are really dumb or you're just using this to promote false info knowing it's not true. I doubt you are that dumb, so I'd guess a combination of the other two.

Let me guess, you also believe god created man...


Shredex

Oct 19, 2012, 12:39 PM
Post #13 of 169 (4823 views)
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     Re: [LukeH] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

In reply to:
rable rable rable


Your attempt at holding your negative faith is making you look rather ignorant.

The video from the WWL is a side perspective that is almost ON level. The wingsuit pilots turn about 5-10 degrees before they start their flare. By the time they turn, they are still flying perpendicular to the camera. If you put a dot in the center of a circle, the outer ring never gets closer to the dot, even though its curved into a circle.

I know my angles, and I know my perspectives. I am a woodworker, a realistic pencil artist, and a photographer.


gisellemartins

Oct 19, 2012, 2:30 PM
Post #14 of 169 (4762 views)
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     Re: [medusa] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

YES, he did flew up and not because of a dive and flare but because he CLEARLY hit a small thermal. I'm also a paraglider and hanglider pilot, my HG would do exactly that when flying tro a thermal. GET OVER sceptics, your starting to look ridiculous.


(This post was edited by gisellemartins on Oct 19, 2012, 2:31 PM)


yeyo  (D 32048)

Oct 19, 2012, 5:40 PM
Post #15 of 169 (4720 views)
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     Re: [gisellemartins] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

lol!
i missed u, bird lady Sly


johnmatrix  (D 9999)

Oct 19, 2012, 6:02 PM
Post #16 of 169 (4709 views)
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     Re: Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

All I have to say is that it would be better to argue over some Flysight data than the camera's perspective in a video.... ?


lurch  (D 27583)

Oct 19, 2012, 6:58 PM
Post #17 of 169 (4692 views)
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     Re: [RyanFYF] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

Not necessary. An Alti-track can do a playback of the actual jump second-by-second. All this season since I worked out the actual ninja trick for a climb I've been producing bizarre rewind effects on my altimeter. During a typical climb the fallrate display scrolls down to zero and reverses, showing "fallrates" of up to -29 mph. In sync with it, the altitude display slows to a stop, reverses, and shows 100 to 130 feet of regain depending on how fast I was flying. The regain slows, stops, and resumes normal descent in a few seconds.

It has been argued that this proves nothing because an altimeter could produce a false reading based on air pressure surges. But when your GPS shows the same damn thing, well...

As soon as I got the idea, I started doing it whenever possible at the slightest excuse. See this GPS track for instance. This skydive was exactly as much fun as it looks.

Besides, all the quibbling about the gauges is so much noise. The real proof is simply the experience. I'd been accustomed to being able to produce near-zero planeouts in an S-Bird for years at breakoff. When I got my Rebel online, executed the same maneuver, and got a +100 foot recoil out of it, it was dramatic and absolutely unmistakable. Total elevator rollercoaster sensation. You know it when you get it. I landed howling my lungs out, ran around jumping up and down laughing and bouncing off the walls, indulging in outbursts of random slam-dancing and jumping, sticking to, and climbing various random nearby objects due to unendurable surplus of exultant energy, so cranked up for the next half hour I couldn't even speak straight. My friends love it when I get all excited like that.

-B
Attachments: second run twoclimbs.jpg (152 KB)


SLAMBO

Oct 19, 2012, 10:33 PM
Post #18 of 169 (4638 views)
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     Re: [LukeH] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

You people are pathetic.


freeflysoul

Oct 20, 2012, 3:15 AM
Post #19 of 169 (4602 views)
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     Re: [SLAMBO] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

In BASE there's an old discussion about qualifying an object as Building or Other (i.e.: a grain silo). Some of the BASE pioneers said about this arguing "ask a children what is it"...
I'd apply the same solution to this... Smile
I'm pretty confused to see people denying what is now so obvious, also with GPS and alti data supporting the facts.
But I'm not surprised as I still read about people saying that Elvis and Hitler are still alive and in good health...
Take it easy and enjoy your ride up to altitude!Sly


Waldschrat

Oct 21, 2012, 7:49 AM
Post #20 of 169 (4372 views)
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     Re: [freeflysoul] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

In reply to:
But I'm not surprised as I still read about people saying that Elvis and Hitler are still alive and in good health...
!Sly

This is the last Species i know with the "Führers" Name:
http://en.wikipedia.org/...Anophthalmus_hitleri

Quote:
The scientific name of the beetle comes from a German collector, Oscar Scheibel, who was sold a specimen of a then undocumented species in 1933. Its species name was made a dedication to Adolf Hitler , who had recently become Chancellor of Germany . The genus  name means eyeless, so the full name can be translated as "the eyeless one of Hitler". The dedication did not go unnoticed by the Führer , who sent Scheibel a letter showing his gratitude.[1]
Laugh

But i know his family lives in the USA.


(This post was edited by Waldschrat on Oct 21, 2012, 7:55 AM)


johnmatrix  (D 9999)

Oct 21, 2012, 2:37 PM
Post #21 of 169 (4251 views)
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     Re: [lurch] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

Cooool. Smile

Lurch have you jumped the X3 or others in the Apache range? I'm interested to hear how they compare to the one you have.


Premier SkymonkeyONE  (D 12501)

Oct 21, 2012, 7:39 PM
Post #22 of 169 (4210 views)
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     Re: [medusa] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

Uh, I'm definitely not disagreeing with you, brother! You guys have been diving the shit out of your huge suits to fly with the terrain. I'm positive you can produce enough pop to gain altitude. This is nothing new.

Chuck


lurch  (D 27583)

Oct 22, 2012, 12:55 AM
Post #23 of 169 (4153 views)
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     Re: [johnmatrix] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

No I haven't, actually. As near as I can understand though, there -is- no difference. I know there were tweaks and variations in wingspan and such between Original Apache, Apache X, and AXRW, all of which are a whole nother class above the X2, the AXRW being the last and best of those- this is the same suit chassis Gary landed, tuned for very low fallrate and slow flight, but good for speed and distance if you drive it hard.

I never got to fly any of the earlier versions, every one I encountered was made for much bigger people and wouldn't fit my rig anyway with the handles thing.

I customized my own to have external harness/handle just at the handles themselves, pics up somewhere else but now irrelevant since nobody else should need to copy it.
My own suit says "Apache XRW" but as near as I can tell its the last of the first preproduction "final" version of that particular suit, and shortly after I got it, Tony told me its name has been formalized as the Rebel. Shortly after that, I heard about the X3 which is the exact same suit but without the hidden harness up top, designed for skydiving. So mine should pretty much be the last of that suit line that needed a custom handle setup and from now on, you wanna get the same suit for skydiving you just get the X3. I think its because handle problem or no handle problem, The Apache rendered the X2 obsolete and anyone who wanted the power had to hack the suit. Funny thing is right now I'm coaching a guy working on his X2 performance, and for the purpose of working your way up to a Rebel or X3 its pretty good. Most of the power without -quite- so psycho of a burble and pressurization, and now the X3 upgrade is really meaningful.

Freefall timewise this thing's an easy 4-minute suit and gets me 4:07-4:10 from 12 to 13k and I'm pretty sure I'm nowhere near its limits yet. Distance and G/R with a helluva wind at my back topped out at 3.88, neutral to trivial winds got 3.2 to 3.4ish from a diving comp attack, default cruise without competition boosting tricks is probably closer to 2.7-3.1. Its pretty draggy and the pressurization gives it a bit of a mind of its own, gets bumpy and bouncy if you dive it hard or try to force it to fly fast but its preference for certain angles and speeds can be softened by opening up the airlocks. Closed up it produces effortless floaty cruising but with somewhat restricted range and it tends to get bouncy if driven hard. Open the locks up and it gets a lot more flexible, MUCH faster in feel and top end due to the reduction in drag, the wings don't plump up so much... closed up you can feel the thicker wing holding you back a bit. Open, it tolerates full-on headdown use and any level of dive in between, at the cost of somewhat increased muscle endurance and a slightly higher wingload, but even with all the locks left wide open, this thing's pressurization starts, open, where an S-Bird leaves off, closed. The best hidden feature in the thing is the unreal amount of wingload it takes off the user. I test flew a Manta after getting used to the Rebel... and even with the Manta being smaller the wingload felt like it was gonna tear my arms off at first, I had to redouble the strain just to get the wings level. The Mantas a good suit taken on its own merits, it'd be a great Speed suit, good competitor against an Alien Suit. But The Rebel is slower, bigger, vastly more surface area and is SO much easier to fly.

My initial impression of it being nearly impossible to shut down has vanished entirely- Now I don't even notice it, but it does take an even more refined and technically thought-out sort of pull sequence, have to break the tail by bending at the knees and hips before you can scrunch it.

I haven't yet tried a solo time cruise with the winglocks left open to see if it actually flies longer that way. It might, if the speedup is worth more in dynamic lift than the increased fatigue factor costs me. Even with a whole season training with the thing theres a lot I don't know about it yet and I'm looking forward to exploring its limits more thoroughly next season.
-B


johnmatrix  (D 9999)

Oct 22, 2012, 3:34 AM
Post #24 of 169 (4126 views)
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     Re: [lurch] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

Thanks - that's interesting stuff!


Vezina29  (B License)

Oct 24, 2012, 1:06 PM
Post #25 of 169 (3911 views)
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     Re: [medusa] Wing Suits Gain Altitud. PERIOD! [In reply to]  

seriously why I don't skydive


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