Forums: Skydiving: Safety and Training:
Converging canopy traffic

 


theplummeter  (C License)

Oct 6, 2012, 10:43 AM
Post #1 of 16 (2178 views)
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Converging canopy traffic Can't Post

Have I completely missed it, or is there guidance somewhere as to how to handle coming head to head with another canopy?

Pilots have been instructed to aggressively turn aircraft to the right in the event of an imminent collision observed visually or in response to an alert from a Terminal Collision Avoidance System, but I have never heard it from skydivers, either as part of a canopy course or a manifest briefing.


poolmarty  (C 39245)

Oct 6, 2012, 12:18 PM
Post #2 of 16 (2157 views)
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Re: [theplummeter] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

From the SIM 5-1

H. Canopy collisions


1. The best way to avoid a collision is to know where other canopies are at all times.

2. If approaching a jumper head on, both canopies should steer to the right.


Mr_Polite  (D 420)

Oct 6, 2012, 1:35 PM
Post #3 of 16 (2130 views)
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Re: [theplummeter] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

Really? You have been in the sport for 5 years and never heard or considered this?!?


theplummeter  (C License)

Oct 6, 2012, 1:40 PM
Post #4 of 16 (2126 views)
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Re: [Mr_Polite] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

I knew I read it before but for some reason couldn't find the reference.

I've considered and briefed it on group jumps, just find it odd that while various dropzones require a briefing from manifest on where to land and in what direction that I have yet to hear this mentioned.


danornan  (D 11308)

Oct 7, 2012, 3:28 PM
Post #5 of 16 (1978 views)
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Re: [poolmarty] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
From the SIM 5-1

H. Canopy collisions


1. The best way to avoid a collision is to know where other canopies are at all times.

2. If approaching a jumper head on, both canopies should steer to the right.

Not all the time..... But most of the time...

Someone was coming at me in the landing pattern, on my final and was not looking, coming in downwind and veering to my right. Had I turned to my right, we would have collided.


popsjumper  (D 999999999)

Oct 7, 2012, 6:58 PM
Post #6 of 16 (1940 views)
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Re: [Mr_Polite] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Really? You have been in the sport for 5 years and never heard or considered this?!?

yep...unbelievable, but we have 'em.


popsjumper  (D 999999999)

Oct 7, 2012, 7:04 PM
Post #7 of 16 (1939 views)
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Re: [danornan] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Not all the time..... But most of the time...

Someone was coming at me in the landing pattern, on my final and was not looking, coming in downwind and veering to my right. Had I turned to my right, we would have collided.

yep, avoid avoid, avoid.
It doesn't appear that your story was going to be a head-on had you done nothing....which is what the "turn right" is all about.


Periapt  (D 3017)

Oct 7, 2012, 9:01 PM
Post #8 of 16 (1916 views)
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Re: [poolmarty] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
From the SIM 5-1

H. Canopy collisions


1. The best way to avoid a collision is to know where other canopies are at all times.

2. If approaching a jumper head on, both canopies should steer to the right.

Is #2 an international standard or is it only USPA/North America? It would be good if so. Imagine how interesting it could get at an international get together if jumpers from countries that drive on the left also turned left to avoid the collision.


Squeak  (E 1313)

Oct 7, 2012, 9:08 PM
Post #9 of 16 (1913 views)
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Re: [Periapt] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
From the SIM 5-1

H. Canopy collisions


1. The best way to avoid a collision is to know where other canopies are at all times.

2. If approaching a jumper head on, both canopies should steer to the right.

Is #2 an international standard or is it only USPA/North America? It would be good if so. Imagine how interesting it could get at an international get together if jumpers from countries that drive on the left also turned left to avoid the collision.
it's pretty much uniform across many areas, nautical aviation and parachuting. Turn Right


Anonthemouse  (A License)

Oct 8, 2012, 1:43 AM
Post #10 of 16 (1890 views)
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Re: [Squeak] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:
In reply to:
From the SIM 5-1

H. Canopy collisions


1. The best way to avoid a collision is to know where other canopies are at all times.

2. If approaching a jumper head on, both canopies should steer to the right.

Is #2 an international standard or is it only USPA/North America? It would be good if so. Imagine how interesting it could get at an international get together if jumpers from countries that drive on the left also turned left to avoid the collision.
it's pretty much uniform across many areas, nautical aviation and parachuting. Turn Right

So how about England? I heard they've got some *cough* traffic issues.


Squeak  (E 1313)

Oct 8, 2012, 2:18 AM
Post #11 of 16 (1880 views)
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Re: [Anonthemouse] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:

So how about England? I heard they've got some *cough* traffic issues.
this is a topic specific forum not bonfire


andreeb77  (D License)

Oct 8, 2012, 4:50 AM
Post #12 of 16 (1849 views)
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Re: [Periapt] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
Is #2 an international standard or is it only USPA/North America?

For Germany: Yes, it's standard.

To the OP: Apart from that I find it very very disturbing that you don't know this basic but very important piece of information at 150 jumps according to your profile, you cannot brief every section of the handbook prior to jumping at any given drop zone. This would be comparable to going through every road rule before driving somewhere. You just have to rely on basic skills of your fellow jumpers.


adamhildreth  (C 110471)

Oct 8, 2012, 5:17 AM
Post #13 of 16 (1833 views)
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Re: [Squeak] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
In reply to:

So how about England? I heard they've got some *cough* traffic issues.
this is a topic specific forum not bonfire

UK / BPA is turn right - and it's taught at day one ground school, I'd consider it one of the most important things you should know, given that there really is such little time to react in that type of situation.


chuckakers  (D 10855)

Oct 8, 2012, 6:38 AM
Post #14 of 16 (1810 views)
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Re: [theplummeter] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

Might wanna crack a SIM once in a while. Wink


Joellercoaster  (D 105792)

Oct 9, 2012, 12:45 AM
Post #15 of 16 (1727 views)
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Re: [Squeak] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

In reply to:
this is a topic specific forum not bonfire

Don't worry, it's also entirely unmoderated. Knock yourself out Smile

Back on topic, as adamhildreth says, we have the same rule (turn right if you are head-on), and it is well known.


erdnarob  (D 364)

Oct 12, 2012, 5:56 PM
Post #16 of 16 (1521 views)
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Re: [theplummeter] Converging canopy traffic [In reply to] Can't Post

A very subtle problem especially when the convergence is weak. Have your neck on a swivel at all time.



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